Recap of Ritz's Tuesday USATF Teleconference

Ditto.

i'm sick of the push to make all these guys marathoners. the brojos have it all wrong. there's a reason Ritz got burnt on the marathon, you race infrequently, if you're not perfect on that day, its a throw away, and in 4 or 5 years, your career is over.

Ritz, don't listen to these guys. break 1250, break 27 for 10k, race more, and have a longer career. if things go well well, race on the track for the next 3 or 4 years, then turn back to the marathon.

don't throw away the best years in those very talented track legs.

The rojos push the marathon wrongly, Ritz's best medal hopes would be the 10 k in london, run it under 27 and you've got a medal.

finally, i'd rather have no medal and run sub 1250, and sub 27, than a silver or bronze at the olympics,

who is more famous or considered a more accomplished runner

bob kennedy or Meb.

square that one rojos.

Yes. 12:56 does require footspeed, but in this case of Ritz, I think the term "finishing speed would be better."

I personally, would love to see Ritz focus on world cross. That would be awesome.

1. 12:37.35 Kenenisa Bekele (ETH) Hengelo May 31 2004

2. 12:39.36 Haile Gebrselassie (ETH) Helsinki June 13, 1998

3. 12:39.74 Daniel Komen (KEN) Brussels August 22, 1997

4. 12:46.53 Eliud Kipchoge (KEN) Rome July 2, 2004

5. 12:47.04 Sileshi Sihine (ETH) Rome July 2, 2004

6. 12:48.66 Isaac Songok (KEN) Zürich August 18, 2006

7. 12:48.81 Stephen Cherono (KEN) Ostrava June 12, 2003

8. 12:49.28 Brahim Lahlafi (MAR) Brussels August 25, 2000

9. 12:49.71 Mohammed Mourhit (BEL) Brussels August 25, 2000

10. 12:49.87 Paul Tergat (KEN) Zürich August 13, 1997

11. 12:50.24 Hicham El Guerrouj (MAR) Ostrava June 12, 2003

12. 12:50.25 Abderrahim Goumri (MAR) Brussels August 26, 2005

13. 12:50.55 Moses Ndiema Masai (KEN) Berlin June 1, 2008

14. 12:50.72 Moses Ndiema Kipsiro (UGA) Brussels September 14, 2007

15. 12:50.80 Salah Hissou (MAR) Rome June 5, 1996

16. 12:50.86 Ali Saidi-Sief (ALG) Rome June 30 2000

17. 12:51.00 Joseph Ebuya (KEN) Brussels September 14, 2007

18. 12:51.95 Thomas Pkemei Longosiwa (KEN) Brussels September 14, 2007

19. 12:52.33 Sammy Kipketer (KEN) Oslo June 27, 2003

20. 12:52.40 Edwin Cheruiyot Soi (KEN) Paris, Saint-Denis July 8, 2006

21. 12:52.45 Tariku Bekele (ETH) Berlin June 1, 2008

22. 12:52.80 Gebre-egziabher Gebremariam (ETH) Rome July 8, 2005

23. 12:52.99 Abraham Chebii (KEN) Oslo June 27, 2003

24. 12:53.41 Khalid Boulami (MAR) Zürich August 13, 1997

25. 12:53.66 Augustine Choge (KEN) Rome July 8, 2005

?. 12:56 D. Ritzinger

first pull out the drug cheats.then have Ritz break 1250then list everyone thats run under 207 in the marathonthen rethink your statement

first pull out the drug cheats.

then have Ritz break 1250

then list everyone thats run under 207 in the marathon

then rethink your statement

I may often differ in opinion with Rojo, but on this I think he's completely on-point. People take Ritz's 5000 completely at face value and miss the forest for the trees. There is little that is enticing to the average spectator about Ritz's 5000 AR and the way he ran it. Time trials are ho-hum, time-to-get-up-to-piss-and-get-some-nachos affairs to all but the most hardcore distance fans. The marathon is no more a "second-tier event" at the WC or OG any more than the 10,000 or 5,000 are. If anything, the marathon is more of a marquee running event (along with the 100m, 400m and 1500m) than the 5000, 10,000, steeple, and 800 are. And it definitely became a "top-tier event" after Beijing, if it wasn't already. Ritz isn't going to improve his footspeed (which has basically nothing to do with holding a faster, steady pace) going forward. Footspeed is about the ability to change gears after having already run hard for a while. It's also about shorter PRs like 1500m, 800m, and 400m. In the marathon, it's less of an issue for someone like Ritz. If he can learn to just follow pace through 20 and race the last 10K well then that's where his most (or only) realistic medal hopes lie. In the marathon, fueling becomes a factor and at the OG and WC the weather and course can often be equalizers. Including his recent 5000 run, Ritz still reminds me a LOT of Shorter. Ritz should follow Shorter's lead to the podium.

I agree with all of the posters here and disagree with Rojo. I would much rather see Ritz focus on the track and believe that his best events are the track 5K/10K and 12K XC. I want him to focus on these events.

Why? A few reasons...

1) Marathoners race too infrequently. If anything goes wrong on race day, you have to wait 6 months to race again. We already have 2 years of proof that this does not suit Ritz.

2) The WC marathon is watered-down significantly and the olympic marathon is headed that way as well. Geb convieniently had to miss in Beijing, and the WCs miss big names (Geb+Sammy W, plus Hall) nearly every year (see US 2009 team). Contrast this with track where the WCs and Olympics remain the gold standard.

3) Seeing Ritz move from last to 3rd in a major meet with top african talent gives me hope that we can compete in this event. Combined with a 6th in the 10K and I don't believe that his best chances are in the marathon. I think because of Meb, Denna, and Stefen Baldini, there is this myth that white people can compete there. This is a result of watered down races and the high variability inherent in marathoning.

4) Selfishness. Track is much more fun to follow than marathoning. They race more often so there are more performances to analyze and more to see. Plus we already have Hall providing enough excitement when he races in the 'thon. If Ritz doesn't race the 5K/10K, than which Americans should?? Should we just give up because of the Africans?

rojo wrote:

webby wrote:Yes, he has a better shot at Olympic Gold, but only because the Olympic Marathon is a second-tier event. If German Fernandez's best shot at Olympic Gold turned out to be the Trampoline competition, would you want him to make the switch?

The Olympic marathon is only a 2nd tier event in the same fashion that the 5k and 10k are - in the sense that the extra 10 Kenyans and 5 Ethiopians who could kill every American aren't running as only 3 per event are allowed.

And that's why Ritz finished 16th as the token white boy in Zurich, a time-trial race where all the elite Africans that can fit on the starting line are allowed, right?

Back in the real world, he finished third with one of the best times of the year.

Get your head out of the crappy '90s and earlier '00s (why is it that this decade is almost over and we still haven't figured out a decent name for it?)

Rereading this, I just realized I was responding to the cofounder of this site and not some dime-a-dozen troll. I stand by my comment. In fact, I registered this name just to sign it. Not the name I would have chosen to register, but oh well.

--Daniel Gordon

Why that race? Well Ritz considered a number of potential races including a clash with Ryan Hall in Philadelphia but the chose the world half because Alberto Salazar told Dathan, “You’re one of the bets runners in the world and you need to race the best runners in the world.”

exactly to give your self the best you can be, you have to compete against the best possible competition. that is why i get frustrated when are best runners some of which qualified for the world xc, decide to run the 15k in jacksonville and/or the new york 5 miler. it would not help a runner like ritz at all to run in a race against 13:30 for 5k runners, the 12:56 he just ran, will help him immensely in knowing he can compete with a loaded field.

bring it wrote:

And that's why Ritz finished 16th as the token white boy in Zurich, a time-trial race where all the elite Africans that can fit on the starting line are allowed, right?

You mean all the elite Africans that the meet could afford. Once Bekele's cut comes out of the appearance fee pot there isn't a whole lot left over. Your remarks betray your level of understanding as being a trifle simplistic.

asdfsdaf wrote:

3) I think because of Meb, Denna, and Stefen Baldini, there is this myth that white people can compete there.

eh? wanna rethink that one?

Reliant Aries wrote:

bring it wrote:

And that's why Ritz finished 16th as the token white boy in Zurich, a time-trial race where all the elite Africans that can fit on the starting line are allowed, right?

You mean all the elite Africans that the meet could afford. Once Bekele's cut comes out of the appearance fee pot there isn't a whole lot left over. Your remarks betray your level of understanding as being a trifle simplistic.

Exactly how many meets have more money than Zurich? As far as I can tell, it's not second-tier to anything, and Ritz finished higher in it than he did at the "second-tier" WCs. (Granted, the events were different.) Here's one American who isn't getting crushed by fifteen of anyone, anywhere.

douglas burke wrote:

Why that race? Well Ritz considered a number of potential races including a clash with Ryan Hall in Philadelphia but the chose the world half because Alberto Salazar told Dathan, “You’re one of the bets runners in the world and you need to race the best runners in the world.”

exactly to give your self the best you can be, you have to compete against the best possible competition. that is why i get frustrated when are best runners some of which qualified for the world xc, decide to run the 15k in jacksonville and/or the new york 5 miler. it would not help a runner like ritz at all to run in a race against 13:30 for 5k runners, the 12:56 he just ran, will help him immensely in knowing he can compete with a loaded field.

Dougie, meet Zersenay Tadesse:

bring it wrote:

Exactly how many meets have more money than Zurich? As far as I can tell, it's not second-tier to anything, and Ritz finished higher in it than he did at the "second-tier" WCs. (Granted, the events were different.) Here's one American who isn't getting crushed by fifteen of anyone, anywhere.

That doesn't change that the funds are still limited. WAF will be a more competitive meet than Zurich or WC, FYI.

5K

Possible PR: 12:50

Gold Medal in World Championships or Olympic Games? NO

Bronze Medal? Extremely slim possibility

10K

Possible PR: 26:50

Gold Medal in WC or OG? NO

Silver or Bronze? Reasonable, if he runs for a medal, but not the Gold

Marathon

Possible PR: 2:05:XX

Gold Medal in WC or OG? Possibility

Silver or Bronze? Absolutely, especially if he runs for a medal (ie: Meb/Deena)

Boston Win? Good Possibility

New York Win? Good Possibility

Chicago Win? Maybe??? (it could happen)

London Win? Maybe??? (not entirely laughable)

I think what he was trying to convey was that if he was in a tactical 5000m race with Bekele, the last 800m could go in 1:52 (59/53). Bekele can probably run a 47-48 second single 400m and perhaps Ritz does not have that ability.

I cant understand why the Brojo's want Ritz to be a marathoner. It is a stupid distance nobody gives a shit about. Training for 5K allows you to run well in everything between 1500 up to half marathon. Marathon training gears you for the marathon, thats it. Three races of 26.2 a year for all that training. WAKE UP THE MARATHON SUCKS!!! Please Ritz focus on the 10K 5K, it is so much cooler. All the best distance runners focused on track and the around age 32 switch to marathon. Not switch at age 24. Dont waste your best years (especially speed wise) in the marathon when you can do it in your mid 30's. Ritz please forget the marathon.

frogger60 wrote:

Training for 5K allows you to run well in everything between 1500 up to half marathon. Marathon training gears you for the marathon, thats it.

Ritz did a lot of marathon training before he switched coaches. Sure he seems to be doing better under Salazar, but his past training contributed to where he is. Salazar is taking him to the next level. It should be interesting to see what he can do the longer he is with this group, but I think it's too soon to pigeonhole him into what event we think he should do.

If Ritz' next marry isn't 2:07 or better and in the time between now and then he runs 26:50-27:10 and a couple of 13:0x 5ks, then he should think about focusing on the 10k in London. I think that's what Sally is doing, anyway. Seeing how it goes and what not.

By 2012, Ritz will likely have the ability to snag a medal in the 10k. It's unknown whether he can do it in the marathon. He may just not have the body for. a 2:10 PR isn't gonna get him anywhere.

-STS