I'm currently reading His Excellency - George Washington. Fascinating book. While reading it, I've been wondering if Washington and other early American leaders spoke with British accents or if they had ones more similar to regional dialects of the Mid-Atlantic region.
Any historians on the board know the answer?
English accents in America died out probably around 1820 - 1830 when regional accents started to dominate.
So to answer your question: yes, we sounded like little girls
by the time of the Articles of Confederation and the Constitutional Convention, late 1700s, most had been born in the colonies. GW and Patrick Henry, I believe, had even developed part of their substantial wealth via of investment in what we know as Kentucky - thanks to Daniel Boone's back-breaking explorations and surveying. That was part of the problem for the colonists: Most couldn't identify with anything British, let alone a king. Kind of cool.
Of course they did.
The American War of Independence was in reality a civil war amongst British colonialists in America.
Ironically, the taxes that George the Third tried to impose on his American colonists were far less onerous to those already inflicted on the taxpayer in the British Isles itself.
It is very likely that George Washington spoke with something resembling a British accent. His father had been educated in England (as had his grandfather). In addition, the Northern Neck of Virginia had a fairly persistent presence of a British accent (something that continues, for example, on Tangier Island to this day).
No to 2012 wrote:
Of course they did.
The American War of Independence was in reality a civil war amongst British colonialists in America.
Ironically, the taxes that George the Third tried to impose on his American colonists were far less onerous to those already inflicted on the taxpayer in the British Isles itself.
It was a revolution.
Mtn Dew wrote:
No to 2012 wrote:Of course they did.
The American War of Independence was in reality a civil war amongst British colonialists in America.
Ironically, the taxes that George the Third tried to impose on his American colonists were far less onerous to those already inflicted on the taxpayer in the British Isles itself.
It was a revolution.
You say tomaaato, I say tomahhto
The winners tend to decide what definition is the "real" one. I bet if Jefferson Davis et al had won, that 1861-1865 conflict would be known as the "American Revolution II".
The Dutch and German ones did not speak with English accents.
Begs to Differ wrote:
The Dutch and German ones did not speak with English accents.
also dont forget the Italians...the french....the Portuguese....many people came to America to europe during WW1 and late 1800's.... sure i think Americans had some what of English accent even during the first half of the 19 century.
PastAsPrologue wrote:
You say tomaaato, I say tomahhto
The winners tend to decide what definition is the "real" one. I bet if Jefferson Davis et al had won, that 1861-1865 conflict would be known as the "American Revolution II".
Not really. Jefferson Davis and the Confederacy had no desire to win out over the Union, so it would not have been the Second Revolution. They wanted separation from the USA, not to be in control of it. More likely, it would have been the Confederate Revolution.
BTW, most European powers supported the South, as they liked the idea of a marginalized, fractured United States. Thanks for rooting for slavery Europe.
moloradocudstuffin wrote:
PastAsPrologue wrote:You say tomaaato, I say tomahhto
The winners tend to decide what definition is the "real" one. I bet if Jefferson Davis et al had won, that 1861-1865 conflict would be known as the "American Revolution II".
Not really. Jefferson Davis and the Confederacy had no desire to win out over the Union, so it would not have been the Second Revolution. They wanted separation from the USA, not to be in control of it. More likely, it would have been the Confederate Revolution.
BTW, most European powers supported the South, as they liked the idea of a marginalized, fractured United States. Thanks for rooting for slavery Europe.
I recall a definition of a civil war as being a war over control over government. Since the CSA wanted to secede, the war of 1861-64 should not, by that definition, be considered a civil war.
The US-British war of independence (a far better term IMHO) was also not a civil war. One definition of revolution is the overthrow of an established government. Not sure that is exactly what happened in 1776 either.
I don't know about British accents but what I want to know is why didn't anyone on "Happy Days" or "Laverne and Shirley" speak with a Wisconsin accent? The Fonz, Laverne, and Squiggy talk like they were from Brooklyn.
The only ones close were Mr. C and Shirley.
moloradocudstuffin wrote:
Not really. Jefferson Davis and the Confederacy had no desire to win out over the Union, so it would not have been the Second Revolution. They wanted separation from the USA, not to be in control of it. More likely, it would have been the Confederate Revolution.
BTW, most European powers supported the South, as they liked the idea of a marginalized, fractured United States. Thanks for rooting for slavery Europe.
You agree then, if the South had won the "War Between the States" it might well be termed a REVOLUTION today. That was my only point ... the winner gets to decide.
BTW, I in no way rendered an opinion on the rights and wrongs of either side. And I'm not European.
Jo dog what is up hessayyy. wrote:
Begs to Differ wrote:The Dutch and German ones did not speak with English accents.
also dont forget the Italians...the french....the Portuguese....many people came to America to europe during WW1 and late 1800's.... sure i think Americans had some what of English accent even during the first half of the 19 century.
The American Revolution began in 1775, not too many (as in none)of the founding fathers were Italian or Portuguese, but thanks for your illiterate post.
Yeah, thanks for backup. I didn't appreciate seeing my original point diluted and distorted. There were Dutch and German among the Founding Fathers, but Italians and Portuguese? Nope.
John Witherspoon surely spoke w/ a Scottish accent.
Begs To Differ wrote:
Yeah, thanks for backup. I didn't appreciate seeing my original point diluted and distorted. There were Dutch and German among the Founding Fathers, but Italians and Portuguese? Nope.
No problem. I had always assumed that New England accents were well established by 1775, but your question is a really good one. Who would know for sure?
It's difficult to imagine some of our more infamous Sons of Liberty heroes, for example, being kin to anything British - let alone their dialect or accent. I can't see Sam Adams, Joseph Warren, Paul Revere, etc. sounding like Brits in the midst of their gutting tax collectors' horses. Considering the colonial frontier culture, and having read transcripts of court cases, lawsuits and such, there was a real deviation of traditional English spelling going on amongst the common men, which kind of hints at a more guttural pronunciation. I don't know - are there any historical linguists out there? Now there's a job...
Well, Sam Adams was born of Puritan (British) stock from one original British colony of Massachusetts, similarly, Joseph Warren was from the same area and his forbearers were from Britain also. Revere had a Huguenot father and an English mother, but presumably spoke like all the others.
If as you say, they were not kin to anything British, despite being of British blood, one wonders what sort of language, dialect and accents they spoke in.
Rap?
Incidentally, Revere’s father could have hardly hated the English, because after the St Bartholomew’s Day massacre and others similar in France, England was one of the countries that gave sanctuary to the fleeing Huguenots.
No to 2012 wrote:
Well, Sam Adams was born of Puritan (British) stock from one original British colony of Massachusetts, similarly, Joseph Warren was from the same area and his forbearers were from Britain also. Revere had a Huguenot father and an English mother, but presumably spoke like all the others.
If as you say, they were not kin to anything British, despite being of British blood, one wonders what sort of language, dialect and accents they spoke in.
Rap?
Incidentally, Revere’s father could have hardly hated the English, because after the St Bartholomew’s Day massacre and others similar in France, England was one of the countries that gave sanctuary to the fleeing Huguenots.
It would seem that the southern accent was well established by then also, or was it. Certainly less than 100 years later it was, or was Gone With The Wind not accurate?