Is this good training for XC season?

summer of malmo.

This is a great injury plan! What are you shooting for, stress fracture or overtraining?

Yams wrote:

This is a great injury plan! What are you shooting for, stress fracture or overtraining?

What he means is - periodization - build a base, then do workouts. Simple.

Sarah. Palin wrote:

Yams wrote:

This is a great injury plan! What are you shooting for, stress fracture or overtraining?

What he means is - periodization - build a base, then do workouts. Simple.

What should I be doing instead? I thought this was perfect...

Hunted wrote:

Mon - Tempo (something along the lines of 30 min.)

Tues - Speed workout on track (repeats anywhere from 150s to 1000s)

Wed - Moderate distance (5-6 mi) easy + 12 strides

Thurs - 20 min. tempo or longer intervals on road/track (400-2000)

Fri - Moderate distance (5-6 mi) easy + 12 strides

Sat - Long run (10+ miles) + 12 strides

Sun - Off or very short easy run (3 mi)

Suggestions? Comments?

Move the speedwork from tuesday to thursday and just run easy on tuesday. Make sure your long run is at a steady pace and it really doesn't need to be over 10 miles.

That will give you 3 hard days, 3 easy days, and one day complete recovery. Make sure you do a good 2 or 3 mile warmup before the tempos and intervals and don't run them so hard, you are wiped out.

Hm, thanks. Just one thing: is there any way I could fit a fourth day of work into that plan? I've done 4 hard days per week (Mon/Tues/Thurs/Sat) for the last year and a half and I'm not sure it'll serve me well to drop that for a few months.

Hunted wrote:

Hm, thanks. Just one thing: is there any way I could fit a fourth day of work into that plan? I've done 4 hard days per week (Mon/Tues/Thurs/Sat) for the last year and a half and I'm not sure it'll serve me well to drop that for a few months.

What was that injury you said you got again?

coons bay, OR wrote:

Hunted wrote:

Hm, thanks. Just one thing: is there any way I could fit a fourth day of work into that plan? I've done 4 hard days per week (Mon/Tues/Thurs/Sat) for the last year and a half and I'm not sure it'll serve me well to drop that for a few months.

What was that injury you said you got again?

Translation: you're not that fast, why are you doing four workouts? It's actually possible to do less workouts and run faster - it's called "recovery". Get Daniels Running Formula, do the Blue Plan. When you break 17, do the 5k specific plan.

Ended up running "just around 5:00"?

What state ends HS track on April 29th? Even if you don't make the team for conference (which you won't) you should not be done now?

Do you live in Australia?

darkness wrote:

Ended up running "just around 5:00"?

What state ends HS track on April 29th? Even if you don't make the team for conference (which you won't) you should not be done now?

Do you live in Australia?

I live in southern California. The last meet I'm likely to make it to actually is League Prelims on May 4th, so I guess I still have a chance to PR, but I'm not really expecting much in the next 5 days beyond a second or two. The point really is that I'm very, very far behind and it feels like crap to have your normal training partners beat you by 100 meters.

Sarah. Palin wrote:

coons bay, OR wrote:

What was that injury you said you got again?

Translation: you're not that fast, why are you doing four workouts? It's actually possible to do less workouts and run faster - it's called "recovery". Get Daniels Running Formula, do the Blue Plan. When you break 17, do the 5k specific plan.

I'm really not running very slow, though... The normal workout from our coach (which we do 4 of a week) is tough (12x400 at 67) and our injury rates are low. I think our plan works, I'd just like some good base to bring me up.

He means that you should be doing summer of malmo.

Hunted wrote:

Sarah. Palin wrote:

What he means is - periodization - build a base, then do workouts. Simple.

Wait, I thought this was a base? Normally I do four interval workouts a week.

What should I be doing instead? I thought this was perfect...

You only do 12x400 four times a week? I would bump that up to five to six times a week, or maybe even every day.

This is a tough situation, because around July 5th I am guessing you will start "team practices" and I am guessing that you will be doing intervals again.

Without covering all the fundamentals (which you DO need to know), base training DOES need to be about a minimum of EIGHT weeks. If your training in July/August consists of a lot of intervals you are going to be worn out by the time XC starts. But this is beyond your control.

Try this:

two weeks of doing other sports after last meet. If you feel you MUST RUN - alternate 2 and 3 mile runs and a little longer on Saturday (4-5 mi).

BASE:

6 weeks until team practice:

M: 30 min tempo - WU and CD if you like

T: 45-60 min easy

W: 45 min tempo (7-8 mi) - again you can WU/CD if you feel you must

Th: 45-60 min easy

F: 35 min easy

S: 75 min at long run effort

Su: 20 min easy or day off

Start with the minimums here and increase to the max. The tempo effort should be about 1:00 slower than your current mile ability -- so about 6:00 pace for you. Don't get too scientific with that though, just aim for a strong effort that feels about what you could sustain for twice the duration if you had to (:60 and 1:30).

You don't need to go any faster than 5:45-6:00 pace during base phase. You need to focus on aerobic development (everyone does during base training - even a 4:00 miler) and as a 5:00 1600 runner right now, you need to rack up time at easier/continuous efforts and the faster you go the shorter each training day is going to be.

The best runners in the world have a base schedule just like this -- only some durations are longer and they have another 30-60 min run 5-6 days each week.

Youll peak in August with your training stlye. Your mesocycle until training beginins in coach should be pretty much base. Speed in esscen should be done in tempo runs. Let mon, weds be distance runs, tempos run or something like pick ups during the run, i.e each mile becomes faster, youll be fine. be smart about it. Summer training is about pure base

Hunted wrote:

First week: A week of mostly easy-ish running

You should maybe just do a week of easy running, not easy-ish.

if you have a coach who likes do give high schoolers 4 hard days a week you are not going to be short on intensity for the season...

do 2 weeks of easy running then just run easy/steady distance with maybe a tempo run every other week (every week if you must)with strides thrown in

dont put pressure on yourself to "catch up" to the people you were running with before the injury...chances are theyll take time off after the season and be out of shape too and if not you have all season to do that...trying to rushg things is not a good idea long term

Your summer of training should be base. NOT intervals or speed work. You get enough of that during the xc season. And with the workouts your coach is giving you... you best rest up before the season. If you start in July, and live in Cali, then you're season ends in November. DAMN that's a long season! Do yourself a favor and do base training from end of track to the first day of xc. Don't touch a track, you'll get enough of that during your 5 month season.

I once had a historically great coach tell me that the season is long... during summer just put in miles and have fun. I did just that and I ran pr's for the next three years.

According to your proposed workout schedule, you are aiming for about 45 miles a week. I suggest the following which is more miles, less intesity.

Monday: 10 miles. 2 miles easy, 6 miles quicker (35 min slower than "tempo" but faster than a jog), 2 miles easy.

Tuesday: 8 miles easy.

Wednesday: 10 miles easy.

Thursday: 10 miles total, 7 to 8 miles in the middle being a fartlek.

Friday: 6 miles VERY easy, run with your dad or something.

Saturday: 10 to 14 miles confortably.

Sunday: Rest, no running. If you insist, then ride a bike or swim.

Total: Aim for 60 miles a week off of 6 runs a week. If you want to do 45 on high intensity, shoot for 60 on low intensity base build up. Get strong this summer, not "faster" and once practice starts and you begin your intense workouts, you'll be strong enough to handle the work load and you'll get a lot faster.

By the looks of your current workout schedule through the team, I'd say you aren't improving quickly because you aren't strong enough to handle that type of work load. Get stronger over the summer so that you can handle your coaches assinine "4 workouts a week" phylosophy.

P.S. You get faster when you REST. In case you don't believe me... the college I attended did two workouts a week. Yes, two. We took 13th, 8th, 7th, and 3rd at NCAA div. I National when I was there off of that training. Oh and no intense workouts over the summer, just a lot of miles a LOT of miles.

Good luck to you.

Pretty much concur with what everyone says on here. I'd take two weeks off after the season, and then do a six week base period. (It's short, but you work with what you've got.) Concentrate on miles, not speed. I would even suggest that the first three weeks, you avoid any tempo or really even steady state. Alternate between days when you run an hour as slow as you'd like (I'd leave my watch at home), and days where you run the same distance at something slightly faster than as slow as you'd like. Long run (10-12) on the weekend. That gets you to about 55-60 mpw, which is OK for the first three weeks.

The second three weeks, add a couple of "tempos" (really shorter steady states) in there. I'd actually do something that's a little longer and slower -- maybe 7-8 at 6:10 or so pace. The point of these isn't to develop race speed. It's to get ready for team workouts, which I suspect you guys race (high schoolers usually do). Bump the other three days up to 10, and the long run up to 13 (no more!). That puts you at 60-65 mpw.

When you show up for team practice, you should be slow but light and in pretty good shape. That's a good place to be in July for fall XC.

(PS If you really are doing intervals four times a week, you're going to need to double to get the necessary long slow miles. Make sure your coach knows that you are also running 4-6 miles 4-5 times a week.)