Ryan Hall's old college summer training

wow.

he is a very dedicated and inspirational runner. you can see that even though his mid d career didnt work out, he tried as hard as could and that's very respectable. im proud to be associated with the same country as this guy, and i cant really say that about any other runner, no homo, it's really great to see him suceed.

Well this makes sense as to why he didn't succeed at Stanford for most of his time there. He probably could have run prs in every event in september that year. Sub 4 never happened because he was too fried by the time the year came around. It's almost shocking to read that...what could Hall have possibly been thinking doing that leading into xc season? It's amazing when you see such dedicated runners who are very intelligent, making poor decisions. That's why almost everyone needs a coach. People can see what others are doing is counterproductive, but they seem to not always see what they are doing is as well.

Vin really had some interesting problems at Stanford...Hall trained too hard in the summer, as did Sage to some degree, Luchini wouldn't train at all in the summer til like his sr year, and Robison hardly anything either.

If only he had those 4 training in some sort of middle ground.

jesus, was he training for the mountain running champs? that sounds awful, too hard, not fast enough (too many hills), not enough long steady state runs, mileage too low for the effort, not to mention this was before the season... i guess now he has learned his lesson of training smart, not killing it

I would criticize this training if he weren't faster than me.

Ryan Hall was an ideal candidate for SOM.

But there is a positive that came from this. You'll never know where the abyss is unless you've actually walked out to the edge to take a look.

I'm a big believer that hard training requires a year to pay full dividends. It's almost a delay-effect deal. IMO, Paul McMullen overtraining badly for the 2000 trials and having a huge 2001, was no coincidence.

I also think Hall's track work the year prior, combined with his marathon training, gave him the diverse training to do so well. I'll be curious on how he does next year, as the track training goes further into the rearview mirror.

Krum had his best season, the year after leaving his old coach. 2 training principles gave him diverse training for his biggest season. Gradually, he got worse as the 1st principle went further into the rearview mirror.

When Webb had great strength developed over a few years, his best season was when he emphasized speed in 2007, with the strength still intact from years past. That AR doesn't happen, if he has the same speed philosophy every year. Plus, everytime Webb didn't run or show XC form, his months later track seasons faultered.

Teg's 13:04 was not long after he was "overworking". As his new, lighter philosophy continued, and the harder work was further into the rearview mirror, he continuously lost his fitness... even considering his WC 4th place. He came in 4th because he was faster and sharper. But wasn't as fit or as end-end fast, as in his 13:04 season.

In short, diverse training, with attention to all parts of running... and long-term patience off of hard training, count the most, IMO.

I agree This is known as training lag[B/], often an athlete has a huge breakthrough after their past training catches up to them.

Never heard of training lag before? That's because I just made it up.

It is not this seasons work that determines success but last years, and the years before that. Often when an athlete is coming back from injury or some other break from training (such as having a baby), they have great performances, because they are fresh but still have the training benefits.

http://www.flotrack.org/videos/speaker/660-williams-todd

malmo wrote:

Ryan Hall was an ideal candidate for SOM.

But there is a positive that came from this. You'll never know where the abyss is unless you've actually walked out to the edge to take a look.

So what do you think might have happened to Hall had he continued, and walked right off the edge into the abyss (i.e. kept over-doing it)?

Is this often the case when people talk about burnout?

story/ anecdote regarding my experience running the same trails and workouts around the same time as Hall:

i've run up that ski resort he's talking about. A teammate of mine in college trained with Hall (he was friends with Ryan's brother Craig) and spent 10 days there over the summer. When we had our college XC camp, we ran the resort, called, "The Wall" a double black diamond that is almost a vertical face.

We jogged 2-3 miles there from our cabin, ran the face, starts out moderate and switchbacks for about the first 10 minutes, then it takes you to the wall, where it took me about 5:30 to get up. Our top guy (he'd run it a few times before) ran it in about 14:30, while me and my other teammate were 15:00-15:30 (only 3 of us ran it). Ryan typically would run it in about 12 minutes. from the start (essentially, the parking lot) to the top of the hill, is about 1500 feet. the parking lot is probably 400-500 feet above the lake. so yes, you're starting at 6,000', but you're finishing at 7500' or so. When we got to the top, we did an easy 30 minute jog, more like a cool down, then waited for about 15 minutes for the lift operator to turn on the lift. you can ride the lift down for free, while all the mountain bikers ride up with their bikes.

our coach picked us up and we covered about 8 miles that morning and then drove back to LA. that was in 2003. We did it again in 2004, and bumped into Hall later that morning. We ran similar times, and informed us that they were "pretty good."

in 2005 i went up there for the weekend on my own and camped/ trained for 2-3 days. while there, i was running barefoot 100's at the Big Bear Middle School track infield and bumped into Craig and his Dad, who were doing a fitness lesson for elementary aged students doing a "speed golf" sort of thing. When i was done, i was talking with them, and they invited me to go for a run with them on Sunday morning. It was Craig and a young Chad, who were going for a 25-26 miler up San Gregornio Mountain. I really wanted to go, but had to be at a running camp sunday morning. Chad just finished his sophomore year, and was beginning his junior XC season. I knew then that he would become an extraordinary runner. (Rewind to 2003, when my teammate told me about Ryan's little brother who was in 8th grade, who Ryan said would be better than him. Someone born at altitude-only one of the Hall family born at altitude--and was training really hard.) interesting to see the results.

flattop wrote:

(Rewind to 2003, when my teammate told me about Ryan's little brother who was in 8th grade, who Ryan said would be better than him. Someone born at altitude-only one of the Hall family born at altitude--and was training really hard.) interesting to see the results.

WEll Ryan has set the bar very high. Interesting story though, thank you