Atlantic Region XC 2008

Why not race hard against DI teams?

yech wrote:

Why not race hard against DI teams?

Probably because doing well against (ranked) DIII competition at Oberlin (and at their UAA conference meet) would be more helpful in getting them to Nationals?

I know that NYU has "cruised" the UAA meet sometimes in the past (still winning some of those), but would not be surprised if they made closer to an all-out effort this time around. If they don't finish in the top three (or however many auto qualifiers there are--three teams? two teams?) at Regionals, but finish in the top five, they'll want to have some high-quality DIII scalps on their belts.

By contrast, the Mets--a meet NYU has won in the past--does have DI teams, but some of the better ones won't run their top guys in it; and even if they did, and NYU still won, beating DI teams really won't do much to enhance the Violets' chances of getting an at-large bid to Nationals.

[If it comes to that! NYU still hasn't run an 8k/5M race, so there's no telling what kind of shape they're in. For all I know, they could be one of the Atlantic Region's top three teams already--we just can't tell.]

I am confused as to why a # 1 team would want to run their top 7 at such a low key meet like Hamilton. They have such a large team why not give the other guys a chance to run? Plus there are some big out of state meets coming up. I think we will see Cortland's "B/C" team running at Hamilton just for experience

"there are a lot of guys vying for that 7th spot to get to go to nationals on cortlands team and I wouldn't be surprised if Cortland only runs from 7 down to get a better idea of who that 7 man will be"

You are most definitely confused.

Cortland's top 6 are pretty much set in stone:(from Short results) Wager, Henry, Nally, Dubois, then take your pick, O'brien, Scrafford, and Greenlaw. Granted Greenlaw had a bad race and I would classify him as the number 5 guy. But the top 5 are all interchangeable. Any one of them can win. It gets real good as to who is number 7 because DeRusso and Stermer are monsters also. Stermer(outdoor steeple champ from Delhi) and DeRusso have the ability to crack the top 7. I don't see it happening though. Even if one or two of the top guys didn't run at Nationals I could still see them winning, but Calvin is strong. I saw Cortland was entered at Hamilton this weekend. Im not expecting to see anything special from Cortland. I was looking at the roster and I expect to see the bottom half(if you could say that) of thier team to show up. I agree with running#### when they said that Cortland will run the bottom half just to get them out on an 8k course for experience.

ghostofblake wrote:

"there are a lot of guys vying for that 7th spot to get to go to nationals on cortlands team and I wouldn't be surprised if Cortland only runs from 7 down to get a better idea of who that 7 man will be"

You are most definitely confused.

I disagree. I think that is a good concept. It seemed as though they did something similar to that at states last year. Travis Derusso was their top man at Saratoga and I believe ended up as alternate for regionals and raced at nationals. If the role is up for grabs I think that's more fair than naming a seventh runner and holding him out of races along with the pillars of their varsity.

I'll buy that Cortland's Top 4 are set in stone, but the 5/6/7 spots are most definitely up for grabs. Assuming that O'Brien is your lock for 6th man, then why are people still overlooking that DeRusso was a few seconds behind O'Brien at PShort, and a few seconds behind Greenlaw two weeks prior at Oneonta (and Stermer was only a few seconds behind DeRusso at Oswego/Oneonta). Throw Scrafford in there and you have quite the battle for those last few spots.

I'd also like to note Stermer and DeRusso's progression so far this season. Both started the season at 5:18 pace for 6k, and its come down to 5:07 and 5:11 for an 8k.

Since Cortland is not in NYSCTC anymore (along with all SUNYAC schools due to a scheduling conflict) their Top 7 will have to be sorted out at Penn State and SUNYACs. Things could get interesting though, because Penn State's course varies from 5.2-5.4 miles and its probably slightly changed again this year and SUNYACs could literally be a pack run of 8-9 Cortland guys up towards the front, with things shaking out the last 2 miles or so. It is certainly going to be quite the battle for those last few spots.

Whoever is left off the varsity squad come NCAAs, they should not hang their head or be discouraged because this team is destined to do great things come November.

sorry if I wasn't clear...I do not think Cortland will run their top 7 at Hamilton...I think they might run 7 and slower...so it'd be something like their 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 guys for their top 7 at Hamilton

it seems like geneseo is fairly set in the 2nd spot, with cortland obviously 1st. but who does everyone think will be 3-4-5? I'm gonna go with the surprise pick and say nyu finishes 3rd and then tcnj 4th. i have nothing against slu, but i dont think they'll be able to keep it up for another month. a month is a long time to keep things together and i don't think people realize that, even if they're not peaking now. tcnj peaks well, but they just dont have anyone in the 4 or 5 spots unless kopnicki decides hes going to show up. even though we want to see what teams have right now, i think nyu's patience will allow them to run well when it counts aka not now.

off topic, but anyone know if the Oberlin course is fast or what?

off topic, but does anyone else take HUGE morning craps....

DURING their morning runs?

De la rocha, are you assuming that SLU is peaking now? I think that's a dangerous assumption. I do agree that it will be close between TNCJ and SLU.

I know that we haven't seen what NYU has but it would take a lot for NYU to top both of those teams. We may not have seen what their team can do over 8k but where are they going to get 3 or 4 guys who can run with the guys from SLU and TCNJ? Besides the sophmore shocker, or senior who put in a good summer I don't think there will be any suprises. With that said I think TCNJ, SLU, and NYU are pretty clear of the 6th spot, which I think will be Ithaca.

Wow, I dont know if NYU will beat SUNY G, TCNJ, SLU etc.... but you sure discount the level of their program. You act like they have no one, and you talk like the others are sooooo good or something. TCNJ has Gueurro and the rest are just average... A healthy Kopnicki would change their team alot.

Dont get so caught up in the bullshit d3 rankings, their based on almost nothing, 8 coaches who may or may not pay attention to what other team around the country do. Havent we seen LAX and some other teams ranked high in previous years for no reason??

Emory, Case, and Geneseo top 12?? NO WAY North Central manhandled a bunch of teams at ND, and those teams are now 3,4,5?? It wasnt like it was 20 points between them. D3 rankings are always wacked out.

no, i'm not assuming that they are peaking now. however, i do understand that it is hard to peak well when you put too much into those earlier races.

Course is super fast. No hills or elevation change whatsoever. Oberlin is in the really, really flat part of Ohio.

Not only that, but my coach told me here are the ranked teams coming to Oberlin next week:

Men

6. Carnegie Mellon

12. Ohio Northern

12. Allegheny

14. Case

18. Dickinson

22. St. Lawrence

24. Mount Union

34. NYU

Women

9. Case

16. St Lawrence

20. Depauw

24. Washington and Lee

29. Oberlin

31. Dickinson

Teams from 4 regions will be there. The at-large picture will begin to shake out next week.

I'd give up purple drank to run at that meet. Wish we had gone to that meet last year. Good luck to all the teams going, but most of all Dickinson. I think I hear a train in the distance...

It is the first year of this meet at Oberlin.

I think everyone will be rooting for SLU and NYU at this meet. At least everyone who wants the atlantic region to get any at large bids that is.