Josh Cox 2:22 Marathon in Training

Let me earmark this thread. I still can't find the numbnutz that thought that Cabada was going to beat the Hansons guys in Osaka.

Hansons put 2 guys ahead of Cox in the last trials without one of them being Brian Sell. Over the last 4 years the Hansons have improved and Cox was forced to run a qualifier a month before the trials because he has not improved a step. I say 7 Hansons ahead of Cox and 9 if the Osaka boys are allowed to finish.

My question to all you dill weeds is how many of you guys who are talking smack on Josh Cox have quailified for the trials in the marathon? If you have you may continue to discuss his training. If you have not then suck a d@#!

JC Friend wrote:

My question to all you dill weeds is how many of you guys who are talking smack on Josh Cox have quailified for the trials in the marathon? If you have you may continue to discuss his training. If you have not then suck a d@#!

If he doesn't want people discussing his training, maybe he shouldn't post it on Facebook?

jessejacksonforprez wrote:

Tempo does not equate to 5:43 avg. pace. Tempo would be at threshold, very likely near 5:00-5:05 pace. Race pace, if talking marathon pace, wouldn't be too different than a tempo/threshold pace. That's pretty much a marathon - threshold for 26 miles. The workout sounds solid enough, but nothing really to jump for joy over...

You're tripping over jargon. In training the only thing that matters is race pace and how your other training relates to that. Example: Josh essentially ran a 20 mile marathon simulation run. You start steady and finish faster so you can better simulate the late race conditions and pace of a marathon. Running 20 miles at marathon pace might be too hard of a workout. So, what you do is as old as the marathon itself (the first Ethiopians did it...Abebe Bekele...Frank Shorter did it)...10 miles easy or steady and then 10 miles hard or at marathon pace.

You don't need Jack's book to tell you how fast to run an 8 mile tempo run (some % slower than threshold or some other contrived pace). No, if you need a book to tell you how fast to run then you are failing to see the big picture in your training. You are failing to understand how your own body works. You should already know how fast you can run and how fast you should run based on your other training and racing. A runner with 5 years of experience will run a workout much differently than a runner with 10 years experience and a runner coming from a middle distance background will run a workout much differently than a runner from a pure marathon background. Basically, two runners with the same PRs could feel vastly different during various workouts....to each his own, and a book can't show you that.

Anyway...so, he did his workout...then screwed the pooch by not forcing himself to slow down...something everyone needs to learn (know when to stop, know when to rest). If he runs horrible at the trials then we know why. Then again, this is a guy who's run 170-180 miles a week for stretches at a time so he's got the durability. I say he's in the top group until mile 20 then shits the bed. I'd say he's in sub 2:15 shape.

Alan

It was the air force marathon.

Cox is "leaving it on the track," so to speak.

the big swede wrote:

i would say that he has done fairly well...in more than one genre...

You talkin' about his reality TV appearances? I suppose in the universe of people hoping to get on a national reality TV show, he has done fairly well. But as an actor, what has he done that is fairly well, aside from the regular guest spot on Gilmore Girls and that short Lifetime series about the cute marathoner married to the woman with chemical sensitivity and hypothyroidism. I liked how their love and committment made it all work out at the end of each 30-minute episode. I never could figure out why they cancelled that show.

the big swede wrote:

i would say that he has done fairly well...in more than one genre...perhaps balance is what he was looking for...a coach usually just has a myopic view anyway...

That's all beside the point that the coach was making, which is probably more true than it's not.

where can I sign this guy? he's plenty controversial enough...

gilmore girls rules. if he was on that his life is a success!!

He just ran the equivalent of a 2:15 marathon at altitude.

not sure why he is running 4:44 at altitude but maybe he is as good as Hall now?

If (IF) he can recover in time he might be able to put in 2:14 in CP 11/3.

Where did he run 2:15? Oh...you're trying to convert the workout he just ran. He didn't run the equivalent of anything. He ran 2:22 for 26.2 miles during a workout...that's it. Altitude conversions are silly because people respond to altitude differently and if you've been training there for a long long time the slowing effects will be reduced.

He also ran 2:20:57 solo...did anyone notice who finished 2nd in that race????....none other than Mr. Marathon Chuck Engle. I'd say he's in about 2:15 shape right now (did you see how he ran USAF? 1:11:04/1:09:53...nice neg split). Josh's pr is 2:13 set 100 years ago (well...7 yrs ago). He's a gamer so he'll head out with the leaders like everyone else and blow up around 20 miles. It's the trials...what else you there for?

Alan

cox will run hard at the trials and definitely be in the top ten. i suspect the true players, abdi, hall, culp, meb,sell, will make there presence known on the last loop.

Your suppose to train for the race. He was racing in training.

Let's see if he can even run sub 2:20 on race day.

If nothing else he will have been a good example of why you should not race in training.

WRONG!

That's bullsh-t. As a 2:13 marathoner, you don't have to race to run 2:22 in practice. Is he in that shape now? Maybe, maybe not. I wouldn't look too far into his Trials qualifier as an indicator of his fitness since that might have been an easy run for him as well.

For what it's worth I've run 2:18 and use to do all of my long runs (20-31 miles) averaging no slower than 5:40 pace - most were at 5:30 pace or just under. Too hard? Maybe but there's no way I could have run what I did without them. The key benefit of doing harder long runs is that you push up your velocity at aerobic threshold (not anaerobic threshold), which is the most relevant piece of the marathon puzzle. It's not difficult once you get used to it and you can recover pretty easily so long as you know what you're doing in regards to recovery.

If you want a couple of more examples, have a look at Paula Radcliffe's training. Not sure what she's doing these days but most of her long runs were roughly 2:24 pace marathon pace for 20-24 miles every weekend.

More examples? Check out what Dick Beardsley did ten days before running 2:09 at Grandma's. Have a look at Khalid K when he was flying several years ago. Even Geb does his long runs quite fast. There are many, many more. As a result, it's not a stretch at all to think that Josh has run 2:22 in training. In fact, if he's in great shape (maybe he is?) he could probably do them every weekend.

Runningart2004 wrote:

It's the trials...what else you there for?

Alan

Money.

You're saying you could go 30 miles at 5:30 pace (2:24 marathon pace) on a regular training run, yet peaked and tapered you went only 2:18 in a race?