A question for old timers.

saw Pre run in 1970 at NCAA wrote:

Is this the Steve Hoag who was a 2:11 marathoner in the early to mid 70s?

yes, at least I used to be in a former life! BTW, one of the unfortunate things in my running career was that I never saw Pre run in person. The 1970 NCAAs were only a few hours away in Des Moines.....shoulda made the trip, but I was done with school by '69 and not into Track for a few years.

Victoria B.C.: To answer your question (below), yes it was a total hip replacement. I want it to be my one and only. Consider: They saw off the top of your femur!!! Then they jam a prosthesis down into what's left of the femur with the artifical ball sticking up/out! Not to mention working on the socket itself. Once is definitely enoough. I want it to last. If you recall Bo Jackson of NFL and Major League (and Nike: "Bo Knows") fame, he has had at least three - so far. Bo tried to compete after total replacement and that is what he got. In that case I'd say Bo didn't know. I hope your friend reconsiders.

Bump.

bump

Just curious about your hip replacement: do you feel that it would be good enough to ever run on again? Always wondered how well they work. Likewise knee replacements. It sounds like you were a pretty good runner in "your day"; I'm sure you wish you could get back at it again! SH

Steve:

I LOVED running. I expected to run into my grave - at an OLD age. But the best thing to do is accept reality. I could run but I don't. I don't want to wear it out. One of my running buddies, a 2:22 marathoner, had a knee replaced 3-4 years ago (he's 61 now). Now he goes crazy on a rowing machine. Goes for age group records that he finds on line. I worry he will wear out the knee but he needs to go really hard at something.

My hip replacement works very well. The surgeon seems to have done an excellent job. He even succeeded in getting the two legs the same length. (No sure thing.) How he managed that amidst the blood and obscurity of going in through a relatively small incision - but still 8" - I don't know.

Prior to the surgery I had stopped training 8 years before - trying to avoid, or postpone, the surgery. I REALLY didn't want to do it. My understanding is that the new hips fail, and need to be replaced, as the result of the constant wear and tear in the new joint which wears off microscopic particles which ultimately cause problems. I'm vague now but I researched it pretty well at the time - Feb. 2005. Estimates vary but "they" usually say hips should last at least 10 years - and often a good deal longer. Jack Nicklaus got a ceramic hip; I got X-linked poly (a hardened version of the traditional poly). My orthopedist says ceramic hips should last the longest BUT if they break it's like having shattered glass in the joint. So he prefers not to do them. I went with what he felt best about.

Now I use a Schwinn Airdyne exercise bike but only use the arms (push-pull) to avoid thousands of wearing motions in the hip. Still get the heart rate over 120 and go 30-50 minutes 3-4 times a week. I also ride a one-speed Scwhinn around town (Gainesville FL) and walk 2-3 miles 2-3 times a week. Plus pull-ups, push-ups, crunches, toe raises (500/day) knee bends (50/day) - and yard work (mowing, weeding etc.)

I was far from your level as a runner but aged well. Proud of top 5 finishes in several Nat'l Masters races at 40/45/50/55 and of going undefeated for three years after turning 40 in Florida masters races - and won all the big ones at least once (Gasparilla, Gate River Run, Tangerine Bowl Half Marathon etc) Besides the 2:32 at 44 in NY, I managed a 33:25 at age 45 in the Race of the Americas in Miami when Salazar set a then U.S. (and world?) road record of 28:02 (I think). Passed Francie Larrieu in the last mile (loved beating the good women - when I could). Since there was virtually no money in the sport back then, even for guys like you, I suspect we did it for the same reason - what my 2:22 friend told a Miami Herald reporter after winning the 1st Orange Bowl marathon in '77; "It satisfies me."

bump

I ran 100 mpw or more most of the time between the age of 20 and 30; retired from competitive running in '84 at the age of 31 with prs from 4:07 mile to 2:23 marathon Kept running for health and fun; played some adult league basketball, some adult league softball thru my mid 40s; (the stuff I could never do when running). Unfortunately, starting in my mid 40s, (I'm now 54), I started having knee problems and have since had to give up running and have 5 arthroscopic procedures for torn cartlige in both knees. My knees are both sore now. I walk and do the life cycle at the gym; but have still put on alot of weight the last 5-6 years. I have no idea whether running had anything to do with my deteriorating knees, as I never had any knee problems all those years of running. So go figure. I think alot of it is heredity and luck as non runners in their 50s have bad knees too while still others run on, into their 50s with no problems.

Sucks how some of us can get all kinds of wear & tear problems while others don't. Experts contend that running by itself doesn't cause osteoarthritis.

I am finished too:

Your story sounds similar to mine. I ran my 1st 100 mile weeks as a high school sophomore. Probably averaged 60 or 70 quality miles a week for the next 10 years. Mostly track and CC racing in HS and college. On 30 a week I did 35:00 10K at age 35 then ran very little for 15+ years.

2 years ago I decided to get serious about getting into shape for racing. After 3 months I was doing 40 a week at 9:00 pace. A year and a half later I was still only doing 9:00 miles but my knees hurt more and more. Hard for me to believe that I was hit by a double whammy... My body won't improve and my knees can't even handle 30 miles a week now. So I'm resigned to cycling when it's warm and running only if the knees feel good. In my old age (52) my body appears to have a mind of it's own.

bump.

I do agree that the times required for those "clubs" based upon age are not equal, but it is just a system of standards that someone has developed-- I am sure it was developed by some group during a long run. I know I running group has solved many of the world's problems during our weekend tours. A very nice thread and it is good to hear the names of many that we grew up running against. I really have to agree with a recent post as to some are gifted (as in given the gift) of running and having little or no joint problems. I really think that in my case the staying on soft surfaces and not doing too much hard training on roads has helped me remain injury free- my times have slowed to a less than respectable pace, but my enjoyment is still there.

Debbie Mueller ran a marathon best of 2:34:50. Very talented.

Larry Olsen--Massachusetts. Larry Olsen! He's 60 now (2007) and is still running 29:00 for 5 miles and 17:25 for 5K.

Wow, this thread developed a life of its' own considering all I did was ask a question, plus the names on here impress me (Wysocki, Hoag, Atkins, Derderian...great Boston Marathon book, Tom...) and it's sort of nice in a miser-loves-company-way to see the aches and pains I feel are not unique.

...now if we could just get some EPO.

What model shoes do you Ancient and Honorable recommend for daily training and are any of you of the Minimalist School? I'm pretty much on the road or track 90% of the time if that helps any.

Thank you in advance.

I ran seriously into my early 30s; (100 mile weeks, serious training and racing). From my mid 30s to late 40s, just ran for my health and didn't competete anymore. From my late 40s to my mid 50s, I have not been able to run anymore due to my knees going bad the past 5-8 years, with 4 arthroscopic surgeries due to torn and worn cartlige.

Older runners? wrote:Do you or any of your contemporaries stop running altogether or just run on their own and not compete?

Given that I'm 46, graduated from HS in 1979, and live in another state, it's kind of hard to check. However, I've looked and looked online, particularly at

for the names of my former teammates and coach, and haven't found a single one of them that I can confirm. The top runner on my XC & track team, who ran 4:18/9:11/14:55, quit running right after graduation.

After college I bumped into a couple runners from my HS, and they both looked like someone had stuck a straw in them and blown them up. Suffice it to say that were NOT currently running...

Has anyone moved DOWN in racing distance (say, competing at races of 8K and under) and weekly mileage (20-30MPW) but kept the quality high to avoid such perils as have been reported here?