Connor MF Mantz

High hopes wrote:

Mister Marathoner wrote:

“Hurricane force tailwind”? This is why I’m here. The hyperbolic attempts to elevate Mantz while dishonoring his predecessors need to be countered.

On the day Hall ran 2:04, the women’s winner ran 2:22:36. That shows the effect of the tailwind is overblown.

These American runners were all better than Mantz.

Frank Shorter
Boston Billy Rodgers
Alberto Salazar
Khalid Khannouchi
Mebrahtom "Meb" Keflezighi
Ryan Hall
Galen Rupp

Mantz is in the second tier with Abdi Abdirahman and Dathan Ritzenhein. Very good company.

Respect the predecessors.

I wouldn't agree with all of those as there's serious questions about Khannouchi and Salazar. But Meb won Boston and New York in an era that was as strong as today, and he won an Olympic silver medal! Plus he made the podium three more times at majora. Mantz can't compete with those achievements.

And say what you like about the lack of depth in Shorter's era, but he was competing against state-sponsored dopers and still won an Olympic gold and silver.

Mantz has an amazing time under his belt, and he'll get the national record but his best result is 4th in a solid but unspectacular field. He was only the third non-African at the Olympics last year. He needs a big result, a major win if he wants to be in the conversation with Rupp, Meb, and Shorter.

High hopes wrote:

Mister Marathoner wrote:

“Hurricane force tailwind”? This is why I’m here. The hyperbolic attempts to elevate Mantz while dishonoring his predecessors need to be countered.

On the day Hall ran 2:04, the women’s winner ran 2:22:36. That shows the effect of the tailwind is overblown.

These American runners were all better than Mantz.

Frank Shorter
Boston Billy Rodgers
Alberto Salazar
Khalid Khannouchi
Mebrahtom "Meb" Keflezighi
Ryan Hall
Galen Rupp

Mantz is in the second tier with Abdi Abdirahman and Dathan Ritzenhein. Very good company.

Respect the predecessors.

I wouldn't agree with all of those as there's serious questions about Khannouchi and Salazar. But Meb won Boston and New York in an era that was as strong as today, and he won an Olympic silver medal! Plus he made the podium three more times at majora. Mantz can't compete with those achievements.

And say what you like about the lack of depth in Shorter's era, but he was competing against state-sponsored dopers and still won an Olympic gold and silver.

Mantz has an amazing time under his belt, and he'll get the national record but his best result is 4th in a solid but unspectacular field. He was only the third non-African at the Olympics last year. He needs a big result, a major win if he wants to be in the conversation with Rupp, Meb, and Shorter.

The King of Physics wrote:

Sub-9:00 guy wrote:

He’ll get there. I hope he runs Berlin or Valencia and not Chicago, for a very realistic shot. Of course Hall will probably say his 2:06 is better….

Mark this day and time on your calendar bruh! I hath sayeth that Connor doth not improve on his unjust 2:05:08 henceforth till the end of space and time! I don’t even want to take a second look at this chap. His ugly biomechanics just like Fishery’s one doesn’t help the optics of his presentation. You saw that last 100m of the race? His arms were like malformed deformed or something, unable to pump hard and generate joule energy and his errant feet placement mimicks those of Fishery’s.

This is why reason why I say Americans can’t run for real. Josh Kerr and Jakob can really run like monsters with much better biomechanics and no extra assistance but Connor and Fishery and Shocker? Bah, not for me……goodness gracious damn!!

Sub-9:00 guy wrote:

High hopes wrote:

I wouldn't agree with all of those as there's serious questions about Khannouchi and Salazar. But Meb won Boston and New York in an era that was as strong as today, and he won an Olympic silver medal! Plus he made the podium three more times at majora. Mantz can't compete with those achievements.

And say what you like about the lack of depth in Shorter's era, but he was competing against state-sponsored dopers and still won an Olympic gold and silver.

Mantz has an amazing time under his belt, and he'll get the national record but his best result is 4th in a solid but unspectacular field. He was only the third non-African at the Olympics last year. He needs a big result, a major win if he wants to be in the conversation with Rupp, Meb, and Shorter.

Good post. I actually would give it to Meb as the best ever. Rupp is right there. And, yes, Mantz needs a major win and/or Olympic medal to be considered “on the podium” for all time greats, but even if he does it and runs 2:03 to boot, it will still be discounted. Rupp had superior shoes when he medaled fyi.

Sub-9:00 guy wrote:

abcrunning wrote:

You are out of your mind. Rupp is a much better athlete than Mantz. Rupp is likely the best long distance runner you will ever see. Amazing times from the Mile to the Marathon and no Super shoes. Do not forget that He won Olympic medals. Mantz is doing well, but still far away from Rupp. I wanna see Mantz break 2:08 without super shoes.

No question Rupp is the better overall “runner,” given his 5000 & 10,000 track credentials and medals, though he will forever be associated with a “gray zone” coach.

All of these comparisons are really stupid, over generations because of depth, over courses because a course like Boston can run either very fast or very slow depending on the year, or across times, because, no doubt the technology is better. How much better, nobody can really say. I still think Mantz breaks 2:07 yesterday without the shoes, but we’ll never know.

Sub-9:00 guy wrote:

The King of Physics wrote:

Mark this day and time on your calendar bruh! I hath sayeth that Connor doth not improve on his unjust 2:05:08 henceforth till the end of space and time! I don’t even want to take a second look at this chap. His ugly biomechanics just like Fishery’s one doesn’t help the optics of his presentation. You saw that last 100m of the race? His arms were like malformed deformed or something, unable to pump hard and generate joule energy and his errant feet placement mimicks those of Fishery’s.

This is why reason why I say Americans can’t run for real. Josh Kerr and Jakob can really run like monsters with much better biomechanics and no extra assistance but Connor and Fishery and Shocker? Bah, not for me……goodness gracious damn!!

Look, whether it ever happens or not, you take this performance with the slight headwind and Conner runs 2:04-low on any other pancake flat course with an elite field and some pacers. Maybe sub-2:04. He’s capable. And his half marathons reinforce the point. Now, it’s up to him to go somewhere other than Boston, Chicago, or New York. Yes, Chicago *can* go fast, but he would optimize his chances getting out of the US.

I agree his form ain’t pretty.

The King of Physics wrote:

Sub-9:00 guy wrote:

Look, whether it ever happens or not, you take this performance with the slight headwind and Conner runs 2:04-low on any other pancake flat course with an elite field and some pacers. Maybe sub-2:04. He’s capable. And his half marathons reinforce the point. Now, it’s up to him to go somewhere other than Boston, Chicago, or New York. Yes, Chicago *can* go fast, but he would optimize his chances getting out of the US.

I agree his form ain’t pretty.

Non sense all!!

Boston is a drastic downhill course and the temperatures weren’t frosty like in 2018. The door was open for Connor to run 2:03:08 all he wants. He had a wide open road in front of him to do it. But he couldn’t. If it was Kelvin Kiptum it would have been 1:58 bruh!!

Difference in time between Connor and Kelvin’s Chicago performance is 7+ minutes. Using same value for the Boston marathon Kelvin runs exactly 1:58!

John Korir is a second rate marathoner. He is not at the level of Kelvin Kiptum or Eliud Kipchoge. Don’t compare Connor to John!!