Well the magic of BU has been around forever. Is it possible that Strand never runs an outdoor 3.48 mile? Absolutely.
Johnny Gregorek - 3.49.88 at BU - 3.34.35 outdoor 1500m/3.52.94 outdoor mile.
Sam Prakel - 3.50.94 at BU - 3.34.63 outdoor 1500m/3.52.32 outdoor mile
These are just a couple of higher profile examples. I would bet there are quite a few very good American/global athletes that have lifetime 1609m bests from that facility.
But I mean he's 22 years old - outdoor season upcoming and no doubt he's been in incredible form this winter. Let's hope he comes out at Pre and busts a 3.47.x and adds even more excitement to the US 1500m/mile picture going on right now.
Queue all the fanboys coming in. The bottom line is that performances at BU stay at BU. They mean nothing for outdoors, where usually people run much slower.
He's awesome. But yes this is fake bu time. Hobbs said in a an interview he doesn't take any BU times seriously.
it's the shoes not the track. BU has been the same venue for decades.
Great race, hell of a kick.
This is a Collegiate record. It is equal to Tony Waldrop, German Fernandez, Miles Batty, Chris O'Hare, Lawi Lalang, Edward Cheserek, and Cooper Teare.
It is unfair to compare times from 2020 and after to pre 2020 on the track, 2016 on the road. The shoes changed the sport and the value of race times. It is always fair to compare overall rankings.
it's the shoes not the track. BU has been the same venue for decades.
Great race, hell of a kick.
This is a Collegiate record. It is equal to Tony Waldrop, German Fernandez, Miles Batty, Chris O'Hare, Lawi Lalang, Edward Cheserek, and Cooper Teare.
It is unfair to compare times from 2020 and after to pre 2020 on the track, 2016 on the road. The shoes changed the sport and the value of race times. It is always fair to compare overall rankings.
A lot of validity to this post, but, Shoes and tracks , especially indoors have gotten better for sure over decades, the latest revisions to records, were inevitable. For those old enough I remember Eamonn running 3:49.x at the Meadowlands, fast for it's time but No BU, not even an Armory when it was as fast as any track indoors ever at the time. That was 42 years ago, guys should be running faster by now, shoes or no shoes, tracks better or not. Pacers? yeah maybe, but not in every single race we see from HS to Golden League. Back heats, seeded heats. I would use that benchmark as something that would be what today? So , I look at it slightly differently, why? Because I choose to, that's all, look the sport is way bigger and more intensely competed than ever, guys can pace to 2K(in 3K races) in times that were close to John Walker an all time great's PR , when he broke 5 flat I was OMG are you kidding me. Guys go by in 4:04.x in a 3K with the ability to bang in. Strand closed in 2:24 in his CR 3K off 4:06? ,and blistering fractions coming in in his 3:48....I tend to look at the now old saying, two things can be true, Tracks and shoes are better, no one debates that, but guys should be faster than 40 years ago and more of them . The standard line is, like the old Mars Blackmon commercial, "it's gotta be the shoes" and I do get that. NBA players are playing longer , new shoes thats for sure, better conditioned, that's for sure. The sport that folks struggle with most seems to be Track and Field. I kind of still enjoy it obviously and think there are a lot of factors, not least of all, there is far more depth in College Coaching and other coaching by now. There are more guys who can really coach.
This is a Collegiate record. It is equal to Tony Waldrop, German Fernandez, Miles Batty, Chris O'Hare, Lawi Lalang, Edward Cheserek, and Cooper Teare.
It is unfair to compare times from 2020 and after to pre 2020 on the track, 2016 on the road. The shoes changed the sport and the value of race times. It is always fair to compare overall rankings.
A lot of validity to this post, but, Shoes and tracks , especially indoors have gotten better for sure over decades, the latest revisions to records, were inevitable. For those old enough I remember Eamonn running 3:49.x at the Meadowlands, fast for it's time but No BU, not even an Armory when it was as fast as any track indoors ever at the time. That was 42 years ago, guys should be running faster by now, shoes or no shoes, tracks better or not. Pacers? yeah maybe, but not in every single race we see from HS to Golden League. Back heats, seeded heats. I would use that benchmark as something that would be what today? So , I look at it slightly differently, why? Because I choose to, that's all, look the sport is way bigger and more intensely competed than ever, guys can pace to 2K(in 3K races) in times that were close to John Walker an all time great's PR , when he broke 5 flat I was OMG are you kidding me. Guys go by in 4:04.x in a 3K with the ability to bang in. Strand closed in 2:24 in his CR 3K off 4:06? ,and blistering fractions coming in in his 3:48....I tend to look at the now old saying, two things can be true, Tracks and shoes are better, no one debates that, but guys should be faster than 40 years ago and more of them . The standard line is, like the old Mars Blackmon commercial, "it's gotta be the shoes" and I do get that. NBA players are playing longer , new shoes thats for sure, better conditioned, that's for sure. The sport that folks struggle with most seems to be Track and Field. I kind of still enjoy it obviously and think there are a lot of factors, not least of all, there is far more depth in College Coaching and other coaching by now. There are more guys who can really coach.
Love the OG references in there King!
Walker always felt his best record wasn't actually the first ever sub 50 (even though it was the most famous and significant), but his 4.51.72 2000m from back in '76 was an awesome record, one that a prime Steve Cram had to really leave it all out there to break.
Another point re "shoes" - the way we are in society now and with almost any phenomena/topic, we have morphed from a psychology of curiosity to one of impatience and stubbornness. These days we are content with cherry picking the most convenient and explainable rationale and shutting our minds down to the possibility of anything else.
Right now what we do know for sure is that all performance levels of the sport are being redefined. At the pro level we may not have seen a wave of WR's or WR's that have obliterated those of the past but what we are seeing is that next tier of elite performance getting closer to those alltime marks. 3.29 is the new 3.32 in the 15. 7.29 is the new 7.35 etc etc. At the college level we are seeing not just the median dramatically improve but also at the top/record setting plateau.
Product is part of it but I am with you on this - coaching is the dominant factor and the whole philosophy has shifted with impact on so many levels starting with how these kids are far more protected from themselves in terms of wild speed workouts on track in spikes, through to in-race strategy and execution which is being modeled at the pro level. This happens in every sport on the planet and has done since the beginning of time - the top of the sport role models and lifts every level below it. Product supports it but the mindset and the real-life examples of it happening have created it and are the real driving force.
Spikes are the easy out though because we can open and shut the book. "Training" has always existed, so has the ability to run a race with different strategies of pacing - but we all go to spikes because it's easy. We look and say "well they didn't exist in this form a decade ago" and do a simple correlation between when this performance revolution started and when the product became more mainstream and we shut that book and dust the hands. And I'm not saying there isn't a benefit provided from these new products - there is, both mentally and physically. But there is definitely this dismissive narrative out there that this era of athlete really aren't better than their contemporaries 10, 20, 30 years ago - they have just laced on better spikes and that's done it all for them. That is so arrogant and dismissive and I couldn't disagree more with.
A lot of validity to this post, but, Shoes and tracks , especially indoors have gotten better for sure over decades, the latest revisions to records, were inevitable. For those old enough I remember Eamonn running 3:49.x at the Meadowlands, fast for it's time but No BU, not even an Armory when it was as fast as any track indoors ever at the time. That was 42 years ago, guys should be running faster by now, shoes or no shoes, tracks better or not. Pacers? yeah maybe, but not in every single race we see from HS to Golden League. Back heats, seeded heats. I would use that benchmark as something that would be what today? So , I look at it slightly differently, why? Because I choose to, that's all, look the sport is way bigger and more intensely competed than ever, guys can pace to 2K(in 3K races) in times that were close to John Walker an all time great's PR , when he broke 5 flat I was OMG are you kidding me. Guys go by in 4:04.x in a 3K with the ability to bang in. Strand closed in 2:24 in his CR 3K off 4:06? ,and blistering fractions coming in in his 3:48....I tend to look at the now old saying, two things can be true, Tracks and shoes are better, no one debates that, but guys should be faster than 40 years ago and more of them . The standard line is, like the old Mars Blackmon commercial, "it's gotta be the shoes" and I do get that. NBA players are playing longer , new shoes thats for sure, better conditioned, that's for sure. The sport that folks struggle with most seems to be Track and Field. I kind of still enjoy it obviously and think there are a lot of factors, not least of all, there is far more depth in College Coaching and other coaching by now. There are more guys who can really coach.
Love the OG references in there King!
Walker always felt his best record wasn't actually the first ever sub 50 (even though it was the most famous and significant), but his 4.51.72 2000m from back in '76 was an awesome record, one that a prime Steve Cram had to really leave it all out there to break.
Another point re "shoes" - the way we are in society now and with almost any phenomena/topic, we have morphed from a psychology of curiosity to one of impatience and stubbornness. These days we are content with cherry picking the most convenient and explainable rationale and shutting our minds down to the possibility of anything else.
Right now what we do know for sure is that all performance levels of the sport are being redefined. At the pro level we may not have seen a wave of WR's or WR's that have obliterated those of the past but what we are seeing is that next tier of elite performance getting closer to those alltime marks. 3.29 is the new 3.32 in the 15. 7.29 is the new 7.35 etc etc. At the college level we are seeing not just the median dramatically improve but also at the top/record setting plateau.
Product is part of it but I am with you on this - coaching is the dominant factor and the whole philosophy has shifted with impact on so many levels starting with how these kids are far more protected from themselves in terms of wild speed workouts on track in spikes, through to in-race strategy and execution which is being modeled at the pro level. This happens in every sport on the planet and has done since the beginning of time - the top of the sport role models and lifts every level below it. Product supports it but the mindset and the real-life examples of it happening have created it and are the real driving force.
Spikes are the easy out though because we can open and shut the book. "Training" has always existed, so has the ability to run a race with different strategies of pacing - but we all go to spikes because it's easy. We look and say "well they didn't exist in this form a decade ago" and do a simple correlation between when this performance revolution started and when the product became more mainstream and we shut that book and dust the hands. And I'm not saying there isn't a benefit provided from these new products - there is, both mentally and physically. But there is definitely this dismissive narrative out there that this era of athlete really aren't better than their contemporaries 10, 20, 30 years ago - they have just laced on better spikes and that's done it all for them. That is so arrogant and dismissive and I couldn't disagree more with.
Remarkably stated!!Obviously a position I whole heartedly agree with.