Its a massive outlier when compared to her own performances. That's what makes it seem especially unbelievable
If we go by progression, then I would argue, Hull and Georgia Bell have a progression just as fishy. Granted, they're 1500m runners but they're just every bit as unbelievable, especially for Bell, who went from never breaking 4:00 to 3:52 in a year at the tender age of 30.
The cope from defenders trying to justify this obviously nuclear-doped performance is laughable.
Roided up Eastern bloc hulk-women winning races like Secretariat was more credible than this performance.
I never said she's clean/dirty in my posts. Well, guess what. I actually believe "no doper is limited". I just don't think she's anymore dirty than her competitors.
They all dope, but she probably has found access to some drug that is giving her a greater advantage or is responding to the same drugs everyone uses in a more effective way. And your take that this performance is the greatest race by a distance runner ever even though she doped is wrong because with that logic, why stop with just drug doping? If what a person can maximally physically achieve without unfair advantages is no longer the standard, why not allow the runners to place wheels or rocket boosters on their shoes? Or allow them to teleport to the finish line or time travel to the future and just land at the finish line? I’m fine with allowing everyone to dope, it just needs to be legal and transparent so it’s a level playing field.
I think your edit covers something important. Her placing is insane. So is the amount she lowered the record by. I am extremely comfortable calling this the greatest single race in distance running.
I don’t think doping much matters here. Any other possible contender for greatest race would be equally suspect.
Yeah, I think that's the most outlandish part. I can't really explain that tbh, it's just insane.
My bad. I just posted a few minutes ago that you stated that this race was the greatest ever but that was JackmanJones who claimed that and you were just quoting him. My apologies.
It's not just the ridiculous time, it's also the way in which she ran it.
She was 15:00 through the first 5k, which is on pace for 2:06:35. That's only 60 seconds outside the women's 5,000m WR, and is equivalent (on percentage of time) to a man running 13:29 through the first 5k. For reference, the men ran their first 5k in 14:43 today (and still ran 2:02).
She was 30:14 through 10k. Still on pace for a 2:07:36. This would've been 9th on the all-time 10k list as late as 2009. It's the equivalent of the men splitting 10k in 27:31. They were almost 2 minutes slower than that today.
She was 1:04:15 through the first half. This would've been the women's Half Marathon WR up until 2021. That's only 3 years. And she's splitting the previous WR through the first half. This is the equivalent of the men splitting the first half in 58:45.
"To the gill!" "Ruth has ruined the sport!" "Filthy doper!" as always, Letsrunner's first reaction to a jaw-dropping performance is to cry foul. That's understandable, as it's human nature. I'm not gonna say whether she's dirty or not, as that's not the intention of my thread. The only thing I want to point out is that her performance today was not out of the realm of possiblity.
At first glance, her performance didn't make a lot of sense, it's 92.8% of the men's WR (7235 secs/7756). Even Chebet 's WR was only 90.6% of the WR. However, let's not forget she enjoyed a horde of male pacers, with one doing a fantastic job pacing her from start to finish. That's not the benefit Kiptum had in the race of his life. And I think we all agree that Kiptum on that particular day, with or without pacers, could've broken 2 from the way he closed the second half (and he got even faster in the last 2k). Had he also had a pacer that ran alongside him for 42k, it's not unfathomable he could've run a 1:58. Now that would put Ruth's WR at around 91% of the WR. Still incredibly strong, but nothing too crazy, compared to other women's WRs. It's kinda like Radcliffe's 2:15 back in the day. (which stood at 92.7% of the WR, 2:05:38/2:15:25).
Again, I'm not saying she's clean. It's just that her performance was not an anomaly compared to other WRs upon closer inspection.
Denial is more than just a river in Egypt. Keep chasing that pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
True. If some European or Asian woman ran this record the same stinky slobs defending Ruth would be castigating the non-African.
1) This WR is the strongest percentage-wise to any men's WR
2) Ruth's coach/agent
3) Ruth's prior PBs
4) Good but not perfect weather -- are women ready for 2:08-mid if this was run in 40 degrees w./ lower dew point?
It's not just that people are yelling into the abyss. The comments are rooted in serious questions that feel like they need addressing. Idk that male pacers the entire way can erase all of the above. This was not a 1:03 half marathoner but, even then, I'd expect a time in line with what the WR was -- not 2min faster.
Men's World Record Sept 28, 2003 - Paul Tergat - Berlin - 2:04:55 Oct 8, 2023 - Kelvin Kiptum - Chicago - 2:00:35 (dropped 4:20 in 20 years) Oct 12, 2019 - Eliud Kipchoge - Ineos 1:59 Challenge - 1:59:40 (dropped 5:15 in 16 years) ** Unofficial**
Women's World Record April 13, 2003 - Paula Radcliffe - London - 2:15:25 Oct 13, 2024 - Ruth Chepngetich - Chicago - 2:09:56 (dropped 5:29 in 21 years)
I never said she's clean/dirty in my posts. Well, guess what. I actually believe "no doper is limited". I just don't think she's anymore dirty than her competitors.
They all dope, but she probably has found access to some drug that is giving her a greater advantage or is responding to the same drugs everyone uses in a more effective way. And your take that this performance is the greatest race by a distance runner ever even though she doped is wrong because with that logic, why stop with just drug doping? If what a person can maximally physically achieve without unfair advantages is no longer the standard, why not allow the runners to place wheels or rocket boosters on their shoes? Or allow them to teleport to the finish line or time travel to the future and just land at the finish line? I’m fine with allowing everyone to dope, it just needs to be legal and transparent so it’s a level playing field.
.....
SHUT UP. I have no problem with you thinking Ruth is doing but to state it as fact shows you suffer from a severe case of Grandiose. You are entitled to your opinion but it's just that your opinion NOT FACTS. Amen I suspicious yes do I have any tangible proof it was or wasn't legal NO...so I accept she may have just had a breakthrough from her already HIGHLY CONSISTENT performances and could have done it legally! 🤔
One possibly relevant factor could be that women in African society are still playing catch up with men in society and, thus, in elite sport, in a way that is some years behind how this happened in Europe/N America/Aus - so it's possible that their elite athlete performances push forward at a slightly faster rate than do the men's. Just a thought and obvs totally inconclusive on whether this landmark time was clean.
Radcliffe's 2.15, 21 years on, and done with 'old'shoes, still sits about 3 mins 10/3.20 ahead of the next best marathon by a women not raised at altitude - so almost exactly 1km of road, or c2.5%. then there is a small cluster of sea level runners at mid to high 2.18. Odd, perhaps.
Well, Paula was at the end of the EPO era, pre-ABP, and her crazy off-score jumps of up to 47% caused quite some uproar (plus, "likely doping" in 2012). Yet here we are, debating whether Ruth is a much more or only slightly more extreme outlier than Paula...
History repeats itself. Her agent Rosa has done it again, congrats to him he's good at what he does. Here he is being defended after Rita Jeptoo's positive (also Chicago winner) by no other than Asbel Kiprop. Funny post to read a few years on
Yeah, 4:12 to 3:52 in 1 year for a 30 year old female. Not a 19 year old male struggling with injuries who had made the same progression. Insane how anyone thinks she's clean
Assuming this time isn’t legitimate, it still raises a lot of questions. If she doesn’t fail drug testing, does that mean 2:10-2:11 is going to become the norm? This is just so ridiculous that even full throttle doping isn’t a very satisfying explanation.
