Any college guys here that can tell us what flats their sprinters recieve? Obviously, there are still minimalist flats. When I was in college the sprinters used Nike Streak LT.
For the love of Jeb, think of me, your back. And your hips and knees. Long term running will take a toll on us and your might wind up a gimpy old coot unable to dress yourself.
Forgot to mention the Atreyu base model. Sub 6oz, no frills. The midsole is great, but the upper is pretty average. Can still grab them on sale for $65 pretty regularly; not sure if they still do their subscription model or not.
Here is the update. I tried the ASICS HyperSpeed 2 (stack height at 29mm and weight 6.7oz). Again, I’m coming from Saucony A9 (stack at 17mm and weight 5.9oz).
Outcome: Don’t like them. The big stack height takes away the entire sensory experience I love about running. Feeling the ground, the snap of each foot revolution, the fluid turnover. I could see using them 1-2 times a week for a recovery run, but definitely not as a daily running shoe. Running feels boring in this shoe.
Hoka has the worst shoes in the world. Anyone who wants knee problems, rest assured Hoka shoes will give them to you.
Any shoes with the kind of crappy foamy thick-soled shoes like Hokas need to be burned before you would ever let them on your foot.
Almost everyone I know has developed knee problems with these kinds of stupid shoes.
Too bad I can't start my own shoe company. Shoes would be so different.
In the meantime, I would look at shoes from different sports since you are no longer going to get true running shoes that are good for runners.
You can begin by trying outdoor soccer shoes with the rubber soles which are minimal and very stable with little side pronation and weigh about 8 ounces. Some will require you to cut slits into their stupid stitched tongue which does not work for good lacing. Be careful of size. Sometimes you need a full size bigger than your normal size.
Another big problem today with shoes is that the mentally deficient shoemakers position the laces too far apart, sometimes two to three inches apart. They should only be one half inch apart when tightened up for running. The result is then a poor and painful fit. That is why you see so many people walk around with their laces untied. It is like the shoemakers are making the worst shoes they can possibly make.
If anyone knows na answer to OP I would love to hear it.
Saucony has gone to *-€€:€ in recent years. Everything over cushioned. Top part lasts two months if you're lucky.
I've run about 300 miles in the sinisters and prob will buy a new pair, but I don't consider them a good shoe.
They wear out fast. They have a stack height that is prob a bit higher than it should be and they should have switched the forefoot to something like continental rubber, not wear out fast nubs. They made a 5k racer that is slower than 5k racers made 20 years ago with the gimic that hey its the only flat on the market.
It looks like I'm going to try to race in the mizuno wave cruise and only use the sinisters for off road slow stuff.
Something like 22 mm stack/4 mm drop is ideal for racing flats and going lower than this is less detrimental than going higher.
If anyone knows na answer to OP I would love to hear it.
Saucony has gone to *-€€:€ in recent years. Everything over cushioned. Top part lasts two months if you're lucky.
I've run about 300 miles in the sinisters and prob will buy a new pair, but I don't consider them a good shoe.
They wear out fast. They have a stack height that is prob a bit higher than it should be and they should have switched the forefoot to something like continental rubber, not wear out fast nubs. They made a 5k racer that is slower than 5k racers made 20 years ago with the gimic that hey its the only flat on the market.
It looks like I'm going to try to race in the mizuno wave cruise and only use the sinisters for off road slow stuff.
Something like 22 mm stack/4 mm drop is ideal for racing flats and going lower than this is less detrimental than going higher.
We are going to cross country flats like Saucony Kilkenny, Nike Rival Waffle 6.
I've run about 300 miles in the sinisters and prob will buy a new pair, but I don't consider them a good shoe.
They wear out fast. They have a stack height that is prob a bit higher than it should be and they should have switched the forefoot to something like continental rubber, not wear out fast nubs. They made a 5k racer that is slower than 5k racers made 20 years ago with the gimic that hey its the only flat on the market.
It looks like I'm going to try to race in the mizuno wave cruise and only use the sinisters for off road slow stuff.
Something like 22 mm stack/4 mm drop is ideal for racing flats and going lower than this is less detrimental than going higher.
We are going to cross country flats like Saucony Kilkenny, Nike Rival Waffle 6.
I've tried that. Those work fine for me on soft trails or grass, but unfortunately most of my running is on the roads these days, so they don't work great for me.
I've been running in the Brooks Hyperion Tempo for a few years now. Really like it. Light weight, firm (doesn't feel like your running on marshmallows), and incredibly durable. I've been pleasantly surprised how many miles I get out of such a light shoe. I do every thing from easy runs to races in them.
I haven't tried the updated version Brooks Hyperion (they dumped the Tempo), but I hear it is very similar.
Of course, you'll have to swallow your pride to run in a "hobby jogger" brand.
Hoka has the worst shoes in the world. Anyone who wants knee problems, rest assured Hoka shoes will give them to you.
Any shoes with the kind of crappy foamy thick-soled shoes like Hokas need to be burned before you would ever let them on your foot.
Almost everyone I know has developed knee problems with these kinds of stupid shoes.
Too bad I can't start my own shoe company. Shoes would be so different.
In the meantime, I would look at shoes from different sports since you are no longer going to get true running shoes that are good for runners.
You can begin by trying outdoor soccer shoes with the rubber soles which are minimal and very stable with little side pronation and weigh about 8 ounces. Some will require you to cut slits into their stupid stitched tongue which does not work for good lacing. Be careful of size. Sometimes you need a full size bigger than your normal size.
Lydiard was always a fan of light. simple, shoes and definitely NOT a fan of overbuilt, high tech, shoes which he believed were a leading cause of injuries. He sometimes cited research done at McGill University on shoes and running injuries done by a doctor called Steve Robbins. Robbins was very critical of most modern running shoes. Nike actually threatened McGill with cutting off the money they were giving them if they didn't shut Robbins up. I don't know how that finally played out except that Robbins didn't shut up.
Much of Robbins' research goes back to the 80s but I did check back with him in the early 00s to see if he still had the same ideas about shoes and he did. He does, or did, a bit of running and early in our contacts asked him what he'd recommend running in given what he'd learned about shoes and running injuries. He said SOME models of racing flats but not all because many were more like trainers than racers, (the kind he recommended are the kind we're now mourning the loss of) OR soccer shoes. He specifically was using the adidas Samba. I checked back with him a few years later and he said he was still quite happy in the Samba.
And someone mentioned the Saucony Killkenny. For someone truly inclined towards minimalist shoes I think they're a great choice. I believe they're still around. I also believe the Asics Sortie Magic line is still available but you really need to dig around the internet to find them.
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
Reason provided:
Didn't really need to edit.
Hoka has the worst shoes in the world. Anyone who wants knee problems, rest assured Hoka shoes will give them to you.
Any shoes with the kind of crappy foamy thick-soled shoes like Hokas need to be burned before you would ever let them on your foot.
Almost everyone I know has developed knee problems with these kinds of stupid shoes.
Too bad I can't start my own shoe company. Shoes would be so different.
In the meantime, I would look at shoes from different sports since you are no longer going to get true running shoes that are good for runners.
You can begin by trying outdoor soccer shoes with the rubber soles which are minimal and very stable with little side pronation and weigh about 8 ounces. Some will require you to cut slits into their stupid stitched tongue which does not work for good lacing. Be careful of size. Sometimes you need a full size bigger than your normal size.
Lydiard was always a fan of light. simple, shoes and definitely NOT a fan of overbuilt, high tech, shoes which he believed were a leading cause of injuries. He sometimes cited research done at McGill University on shoes and running injuries done by a doctor called Steve Robbins. Robbins was very critical of most modern running shoes. Nike actually threatened McGill with cutting off the money they were giving them if they didn't shut Robbins up. I don't know how that finally played out except that Robbins didn't shut up.
Much of Robbins' research goes back to the 80s but I did check back with him in the early 00s to see if he still had the same ideas about shoes and he did. He does, or did, a bit of running and early in our contacts asked him what he'd recommend running in given what he'd learned about shoes and running injuries. He said SOME models of racing flats but not all because many were more like trainers than racers, (the kind he recommended are the kind we're now mourning the loss of) OR soccer shoes. He specifically was using the adidas Samba. I checked back with him a few years later and he said he was still quite happy in the Samba.
And someone mentioned the Saucony Killkenny. For someone truly inclined towards minimalist shoes I think they're a great choice. I believe they're still around. I also believe the Asics Sortie Magic line is still available but you really need to dig around the internet to find them.
You can get the sortie magic from japanese sellers on ebay. For me, they have a fatal flaw though. Because of the japanese sizing, there is no size 10.5. The equivalent size 10 shoe is too small, and the size 11 is too large. The mizuno wave cruise works better for me because they are made too big, so the size 10 equivalent in that shoe fits like a 10.5.
Hoka has the worst shoes in the world. Anyone who wants knee problems, rest assured Hoka shoes will give them to you.
Any shoes with the kind of crappy foamy thick-soled shoes like Hokas need to be burned before you would ever let them on your foot.
Almost everyone I know has developed knee problems with these kinds of stupid shoes.
Too bad I can't start my own shoe company. Shoes would be so different.
In the meantime, I would look at shoes from different sports since you are no longer going to get true running shoes that are good for runners.
You can begin by trying outdoor soccer shoes with the rubber soles which are minimal and very stable with little side pronation and weigh about 8 ounces. Some will require you to cut slits into their stupid stitched tongue which does not work for good lacing. Be careful of size. Sometimes you need a full size bigger than your normal size.
Lydiard was always a fan of light. simple, shoes and definitely NOT a fan of overbuilt, high tech, shoes which he believed were a leading cause of injuries. He sometimes cited research done at McGill University on shoes and running injuries done by a doctor called Steve Robbins. Robbins was very critical of most modern running shoes. Nike actually threatened McGill with cutting off the money they were giving them if they didn't shut Robbins up. I don't know how that finally played out except that Robbins didn't shut up.
Much of Robbins' research goes back to the 80s but I did check back with him in the early 00s to see if he still had the same ideas about shoes and he did. He does, or did, a bit of running and early in our contacts asked him what he'd recommend running in given what he'd learned about shoes and running injuries. He said SOME models of racing flats but not all because many were more like trainers than racers, (the kind he recommended are the kind we're now mourning the loss of) OR soccer shoes. He specifically was using the adidas Samba. I checked back with him a few years later and he said he was still quite happy in the Samba.
And someone mentioned the Saucony Killkenny. For someone truly inclined towards minimalist shoes I think they're a great choice. I believe they're still around. I also believe the Asics Sortie Magic line is still available but you really need to dig around the internet to find them.
Using the Adidas Samba as a running shoe is interesting. Going to consider trying that.
Lydiard was always a fan of light. simple, shoes and definitely NOT a fan of overbuilt, high tech, shoes which he believed were a leading cause of injuries. He sometimes cited research done at McGill University on shoes and running injuries done by a doctor called Steve Robbins. Robbins was very critical of most modern running shoes. Nike actually threatened McGill with cutting off the money they were giving them if they didn't shut Robbins up. I don't know how that finally played out except that Robbins didn't shut up.
Much of Robbins' research goes back to the 80s but I did check back with him in the early 00s to see if he still had the same ideas about shoes and he did. He does, or did, a bit of running and early in our contacts asked him what he'd recommend running in given what he'd learned about shoes and running injuries. He said SOME models of racing flats but not all because many were more like trainers than racers, (the kind he recommended are the kind we're now mourning the loss of) OR soccer shoes. He specifically was using the adidas Samba. I checked back with him a few years later and he said he was still quite happy in the Samba.
And someone mentioned the Saucony Killkenny. For someone truly inclined towards minimalist shoes I think they're a great choice. I believe they're still around. I also believe the Asics Sortie Magic line is still available but you really need to dig around the internet to find them.
Using the Adidas Samba as a running shoe is interesting. Going to consider trying that.
I'm at the point where I may consider lifestyle or soccer shoes to run in too. I think the samba has a leather upper, unless there is some version for soccer, which means any sweaty or rainy runs are going to be rough potentially.
Using the Adidas Samba as a running shoe is interesting. Going to consider trying that.
I'm at the point where I may consider lifestyle or soccer shoes to run in too. I think the samba has a leather upper, unless there is some version for soccer, which means any sweaty or rainy runs are going to be rough potentially.
They make a bunch of versions, including a velo version. Samba classic is the soccer version and the weight is listed as 11.8 oz! That would be in the upper end for weight for a running shoe, though they do seem to be a lower stack height than all the running shoes on the market other than the sinister. Someone should tell those soccer players that they need to boing! The only other info I could find is that vogue calls them "the it girl's favorite sneaker".
He specifically was using the adidas Samba. I checked back with him a few years later and he said he was still quite happy in the Samba.
I would consider this a joke if it wasn't from such a reputable poster here but it actually sounds quite interesting. I had a friend once forget his flats for a race and he had to run in his casual shoes (just happened to be Sambas). He didn't seem to enjoy it but obviously that's a one off road race and not something he did ever again. If I were still inclined towards minimalism like in my younger/lighter days I might give this a try but I'm pretty sure now I'd rid through a pair of Sambas in a few weeks!
He specifically was using the adidas Samba. I checked back with him a few years later and he said he was still quite happy in the Samba.
I would consider this a joke if it wasn't from such a reputable poster here but it actually sounds quite interesting. I had a friend once forget his flats for a race and he had to run in his casual shoes (just happened to be Sambas). He didn't seem to enjoy it but obviously that's a one off road race and not something he did ever again. If I were still inclined towards minimalism like in my younger/lighter days I might give this a try but I'm pretty sure now I'd rid through a pair of Sambas in a few weeks!
Samba is lower stack than most shoes on the market, but I wouldn't consider it minimal. 11.8 oz in a men's 9!
Back in the day, a bunch of "early minimalists" ran in the puma h street casual shoe. The flats of the time mostly sucked. Then shoes like the nike streak 3 and The streak xc, brooks t3, and adizero line appeared on the market. The streak xc was the go to for minimalists, unless they were running in marathon flats or such.
The Nike ZoomX Streakfly is still a bit of a relic from the past racing flat wise. No carbon plate and only 6 ounces. About the only one I’ve come across. Great shoe for 5-10km races.
The nike zoom rival waffle is still pretty close to a minimalist flat, although it is technically an xc shoe. The waffle version is the xc shoe without the spikes. The new generation (6) doesn’t have the rubber plugs/nubs on the bottom in place of the spikes like the 5 did, so it is a little closer to a true minimalist racing flat. I wouldn’t take them any further than a 10k though because they are very slim. I may get some rival waffles for track workouts, feel like they’d be a solid speed workout shoe for days where I’m not spiking up but want a light shoe for speed work.