When Tatyana McFaden was in high school, she sued her school district for her right to race against able bodied runners. (See her Wikipedia page for more details.)
this is misleading. Tatyana competed in track against able bodied runner but she DID NOT SCORE. and you know what? She was FINE WITH THAT.
That's all in her Wiki page, which I suggested other people to read for more details. So what is misleading?
I agree, life is unfair. Which is why males shouldn't get to compete in female sports. Oh, your subjective reality doesn't align with the objective? So sorry, everybody else doesn't have to conform to your delusion.
That’s fine, be a freedom loving lib. I’m a freedom loving conservative and State teachers trying to brainwash kids to be actors isn’t freedom. our freedom is not buying Bud, Levi’s, Target, Adidas, Northface, Smirnoff. And others. you can fake tranny all you want but quit praying on children. that’s not freedom
...shouldn't compete with vintage women because trans women have an (allegedly) obvious advantage, what is next?
ban blacks from sports?
ban tall people from the nba?
ban short people from gymnastics?
what exactly is your end goal?
life is unfair, sports are unfair.
do you think bolt and phelps won because they trained more than others?
or because they had an obvious advantage?
I’m going to flip this on you. If trans men don’t have a difference, why not just get rid of gender based sports. All women would compete with men directly.
...shouldn't compete with vintage women because trans women have an (allegedly) obvious advantage, what is next?
ban blacks from sports?
ban tall people from the nba?
ban short people from gymnastics?
what exactly is your end goal?
life is unfair, sports are unfair.
do you think bolt and phelps won because they trained more than others?
or because they had an obvious advantage?
I’m going to flip this on you. If trans men don’t have a difference, why not just get rid of gender based sports. All women would compete with men directly.
Because that wouldn’t provide a proper way for liberals to game the system. Tranny’s are fake and are cowards or they’d chop it off.
not sure what the liberal comment was about banning blacks from NBA and how skin color equates to acting
This thread is about able-bodied, normally developed, healthy males demanding access to female sports competition based on their claim that it's not fair for them to have to compete against others of their own sex.
If you want to draw a fitting analogy to wheelchair sports, using an example of a wheelchair-dependent female athlete who sued to race against able-bodied athletes of her same sex doesn't fill the bill.
You need to give examples of boys and men with some kind of physical disability who went to court demanding their "right" to compete in girls' or women's sports in the USA - and who won their suits because the courts ruled that males who are, or believe they are, physically disadvantaged in male sports - be they ordinary male sports or para male sports - are entitled to participate and compete in female sports as compensation for being male with the sorts of disabilities that make them physically unequal to other males in sports.
This post was edited 3 minutes after it was posted.
This thread is about able-bodied, normally developed, healthy males demanding access to female sports competition based on their claim that it's not fair for them to have to compete against others of their own sex.
If you want to draw a fitting analogy to wheelchair sports, using an example of a wheelchair-dependent female athlete who sued to race against able-bodied athletes of her same sex doesn't fill the bill.
You need to give examples of boys and men with some kind of physical disability who went to court demanding their "right" to compete in girls' or women's sports in the USA - and who won their suits because the courts ruled that males who are, or believe they are, physically disadvantaged in male sports - be they ordinary male sports or para male sports - are entitled to participate and compete in female sports as compensation for having a disability.
You need to direct this argument to oncearunnerrrrrr, and not to me.
My point was that McFaden was able to compete with her peers once in college. But that was not an option in high school. So she sued the school district, and accepted the accommodation allowed to her. Trans athletes in HS can accept the same compromise.
The problem with having a rational, balanced discussion is people like the OP who with their questions demonstrate they either do not understand the issues or want the issue to be something other than it really is.
You do realize that Phelps' records are being broken, don't you? He's not superhuman.
The fact is that one woman might have the advantage of extra large hands and feet, or some other such "advantage." Male bodies, however, have numerous advantages over female bodies including heart, lungs, hip and knee placement, upper body strength, leg strength, the ability to reduce body fat much more, no menarche, etc.
I think Oscar Pistorious' heart and lungs didn't need to work to supply his legs, either. He had numerous advantages, including not losing training due to injuries in his legs.
Injuries is also an example of male dominance. Women sustain more injuries and take longer to heal, generally speaking.
You do realize that Phelps' records are being broken, don't you? He's not superhuman.
The fact is that one woman might have the advantage of extra large hands and feet, or some other such "advantage." Male bodies, however, have numerous advantages over female bodies including heart, lungs, hip and knee placement, upper body strength, leg strength, the ability to reduce body fat much more, no menarche, etc.
It's not at all the same thing.
A good example is US Olympic champion swimmer Missy Franklin. She's very tall for a woman - 6'2 - and she reportedly has a 6'4 wingspan. That means she has the same height and wingspan as her fellow Team USA Olympic swimmer Ryan Lochte, a male.
Franklin has really big feet too - women's size 13-14.
In the events in which Franklin won her 5 Olympic gold medals, her times were 9-12% slower than the men's Olympic gold-winning times.
The difference between the size and power of the hearts and lungs of males and females alone is enormous. Teenage boys and grown men have hearts that are 25-38% larger than the hearts of girls and women the same height, and lungs that are 10-12% larger.
...shouldn't compete with vintage women because trans women have an (allegedly) obvious advantage, what is next?
ban blacks from sports?
ban tall people from the nba?
ban short people from gymnastics?
what exactly is your end goal?
life is unfair, sports are unfair.
do you think bolt and phelps won because they trained more than others?
or because they had an obvious advantage?
A better comparison to trans women competing against cis women would be disabled competitors like Oscar Pistorious or wheelchair competitors competing against able bodied competitors on foot.
Many (including myself) argued it was an unfair advantage for Oscar to compete against able bodied men because he didn't feel his lower legs cramping up. THat's why there's separate divisions for paralympians. Keep in mind, Oscar was NOT the gold medalist at the Olympics and didn't make the final. But many, including myself, found it unfair.
Now imagine someone in a wheelchair competing against Sadie Engelhardt tomorrow...
Disabled people are marginalized. But they figured out a way to compete fairly amongst one another. Their advantages in some cases against their able bodied counter parts are recognized. They have their own divisions as a result. Sometimes in Paralympic events there are only one or two competitors in each classification. But no one seems bothered. It's only trans women who make a fuss. Can't have a third category they say, because there are not enough people.
I would like to up arrow this twice. WE warned the world these kinds of things would happen when all the rules were changed. And I doubt if we are close to being done yet. There are two genders.