Bro, it's D3. Go to your AD, this isn't a D1 program you're talking about. Literally you are a number for the school, and at this point you'd factor into retention rate and graduation rate. Don't let this coach bamboozle you. You have more power than you think in a D3 setting, especially if you haven't done anything to be kicked off the team.
D3 is D3, small school that cares about the total number of enrollment. D3 schools all across the board are already struggling with numbers my guy.
Lol going over your coaches head and talking to their boss is a really great way to get them to like you and want them on your team.
A few things - the coach's logic is that my 8k PR is about a minute slower than the next slowest returner, and he says that "I'll have nobody to train with". I beat this guy in the first race of the season, but he ended up developing pretty well over the past year (ran in the mid-upper 15s) while my times didn't get any better. There are people who I've trained with and occasionally beaten in races over track season, so I don't agree with this logic, but I do get spat out of the back quite often in workouts so I see where he's coming from. Our team has gotten significantly more competitive in the last few years with the "slow" guys on the team going from 28s to 27s to 26s for the 8k, so I think the coach is just trying to speed along the improvement of the program. I believe this is the first year he's made any sort of cuts. I'm also currently a freshman so it's frustrating for all of this to be based on a year where I'm still adjusting to college training.
I feel like my relationship with the coaches is pretty good, at least they don't hate me or anything.
On transferring, I don't think it's really feasible for me - this school is a great overall fit for me and transferring to a similar school that allows me to run would be almost impossible. I think I'll try to talk with my coach again to see what we can work out and if I'll at least be able to train with the team even if I don't race much/at all. Otherwise I'll just take a longer break over the summer to do some trail running and then try and develop myself aerobically to get that 5k down to the level of my 1500 during the fall.
This sounds like a good plan. I'm sorry this is happening to you. Try to see if you can work something out. With your current PBs, you can run 26:xx. You just gotta figure out what's important to you in terms of summer training. If you want to focus on getting ready for track that'll look different from getting ready for the 8k. It looks like there's room to improve your endurance. Resist the urge to train too hard because of the frustration. Good, consistent, summer miles & strength workouts will get you ready for whatever you want to focus on. You can run meets unattached, and maybe finish ahead of some of the guys coming in.
I also feel sympathy for you, OP. I ran DIII at a bottom-of-the-conference school and we never cut anybody if they put in the work. We would have been thrilled to have you.
Having said that, he can’t *really* stop you from going on easy runs with the team on non-workout days right? You could even clear that with the coach in advance, I don’t believe it would be a problem.
also, like another person wrote, it might be a good season to try ultimate frisbee if you can get your handling up to a decent spot. You’ll be doing plenty of sprinting and strength training. If you keep up good mileage otherwise, it might end up being *better* than XC for your 1500 times (our best 1500 runner on the women’s side played soccer in the fall).
Bro, it's D3. Go to your AD, this isn't a D1 program you're talking about. Literally you are a number for the school, and at this point you'd factor into retention rate and graduation rate. Don't let this coach bamboozle you. You have more power than you think in a D3 setting, especially if you haven't done anything to be kicked off the team.
D3 is D3, small school that cares about the total number of enrollment. D3 schools all across the board are already struggling with numbers my guy.
Lol going over your coaches head and talking to their boss is a really great way to get them to like you and want them on your team.
This time it ain't just about being fast.
Is it going over their head if you've already spoken to them?
Did you attend or run at a D3 school? Chances are the kids already knows the AD.
Also once again, and let me reiterate my point, D3 is all about having numbers as a school. It's all about enrollment, retention, and graduation rate. Small schools are struggling the most post-pandemic.
It's dumb antics like that in the business world "afraid to go over their head" "fear of resentment"
Shut up and get over the fragile ego some of you have for some god forsaken reason. If there is a problem, come up with a direct solution. I.E. Coach being like "ah this is D3 we have a 'roster' limitation" is a total lie. The Athletic departments at D3 schools get extra funding for students who are enrolled in the school and participate in the program, or in simple terms, pays for the coaches salaries.
It's like CTE students in high school. Schools get a certain $$ amount per student enrolled in the course. Have a high enrollment number = job security.
It doesn't matter if you are the best coach in the world, and win multiple national champion and conference titles, if you don't have the funding to even have a position.
But what do I know. I'm just a buster posting on letsrun.
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
Reason provided:
Included a quote from Dom Toretto bc were a family here.
There is also a very good chance you are on the cusp of major improvement. Male puberty lasts into your twenties and at some point it just "clicks" and you get more return from training. I'll use myself as an example. End of sophomore XC season: 27:15. The very first race of my junior year I ran 26:22, and I went on to run 25:35 a few months later. The posters that are telling you to put in good training this summer are not kidding. You would be surprised how suddenly performance can change and how much your cumulative miles will put you ahead of an 18 year old.
Same story here. 27s as a sophomore, 25s as a junior. Ended up as a sub-15 5k guy.
I.E. Coach being like "ah this is D3 we have a 'roster' limitation" is a total lie. The Athletic departments at D3 schools get extra funding for students who are enrolled in the school and participate in the program, or in simple terms, pays for the coaches salaries.
Some schools DO have roster limits...when I was running the WIAC...as a conference...limited men's cross country rosters to 24...and as was pointed out prior some schools in the WIAC instituted stricter limits than that.
I don't know if this is the case with the OP's school/conference...but D3 schools can have roster limits.
Did the other thread about the D3 kid skipping practice and getting kicked off the team get deleted?
Yeah, kid got basically doxxed. No self-awareness rich kid who cried on LR, then got owned by other people on the team saying that he was a creep and a weirdo.
Ask your coach what would be required of you for a spot on the xc team - a time this summer or time trial in the fall. If he says - no way you can, title 9 numbers or something, make sure you race through the fall unattached or road races and train to insure these new guys don't take your spot in track. It looks like your 15 is much better than your 5, but I would try to get close to or under 4 by indoor if you don't want to hear that story again. Better yet, I'd transfer unless I was going into senior year.
Good advice.^
At your age you likely still have so much upside and improvement ahead. Asking the coach what level he needs to see will show them your motivation, and also help organize a great summer of training with a couple of races. If you're 16:1x, aim to put down a 15:xx and pencil in a few races to shoot for that. At the very least you'll continue to build great fitness chasing that.
I really can't see why a coach would cut an XC runner who has already been a part of the team, especially someone who they will be welcoming for track in the spring. We all know what a great base XC lays for a 1500 runner, and frankly most college students aren't going to put in the same work through the summer/fall without a team.
I.E. Coach being like "ah this is D3 we have a 'roster' limitation" is a total lie. The Athletic departments at D3 schools get extra funding for students who are enrolled in the school and participate in the program, or in simple terms, pays for the coaches salaries.
Some schools DO have roster limits...when I was running the WIAC...as a conference...limited men's cross country rosters to 24...and as was pointed out prior some schools in the WIAC instituted stricter limits than that.
I don't know if this is the case with the OP's school/conference...but D3 schools can have roster limits.
That's very interesting! When did you run in the WIAC?
would they lay that out in the by-laws set forth by the conference? I just spent some time and went through their very vague 44 page handbook of by-laws and such and couldn't find that. So maybe not a conference thing, but a school thing?
Thanks for bringing that insight, I really appreciate it! Guess the OAC just doesn't care. I remember years when teams would have DEEP rosters!
Either way, it seems completely asinine that a D3 coach would try to limit a roster.
But maybe OP's school cares more about recruitment then retention, which if that is the case OP, look for somewhere else!
There are moments that separate us, but we always come back together.
Some schools DO have roster limits...when I was running the WIAC...as a conference...limited men's cross country rosters to 24...and as was pointed out prior some schools in the WIAC instituted stricter limits than that.
I don't know if this is the case with the OP's school/conference...but D3 schools can have roster limits.
That's very interesting! When did you run in the WIAC?
would they lay that out in the by-laws set forth by the conference? I just spent some time and went through their very vague 44 page handbook of by-laws and such and couldn't find that. So maybe not a conference thing, but a school thing?
Thanks for bringing that insight, I really appreciate it! Guess the OAC just doesn't care. I remember years when teams would have DEEP rosters!
Either way, it seems completely asinine that a D3 coach would try to limit a roster.
But maybe OP's school cares more about recruitment then retention, which if that is the case OP, look for somewhere else!
There are moments that separate us, but we always come back together.
There are still roster limitations in the WIAC. Varies by school. But there is a limit at all WIAC schools I believe.