They tend to target different kinds of races, and train differently. Both gritty and incredibly fun to watch. What they do in the next few years will tell. But, it doesn’t matter - rising tide lifts all boats. Both has inspiring stories and are great for the sport. Both are grinding hard for years to get the success they’ve achieved.
Notime wrote:
Molly didn't lose the record, Denna did.
D'Amato had her chance in Atlanta and bonked.
You're only as good as your last race.
So....
jog around the town wrote:
They tend to target different kinds of races, and train differently. Both gritty and incredibly fun to watch. What they do in the next few years will tell. But, it doesn’t matter - rising tide lifts all boats. Both has inspiring stories and are great for the sport. Both are grinding hard for years to get the success they’ve achieved.
Plus, I've read Molly and Keira are super-kind IRL and not competitive with each other.
Atalanta for a specific type of runner. Not necessarily the fastest US marathoner
hobbyjogger1 wrote:
Molly Seidel has proven herself under tough conditions against the world's best twice and against the best Americans during Olympic trials. Keira got a world record under ideal conditions and course. Molly is still our best competitive marathoner. Molly isn't being cautious about her challenges. And isn't avoiding harsh conditions or competitors. Molly still has the crown. Congratulations to Keira but we'll see what happens when she races major marathons under different weather and course difficulties.
exactly!
People seem to be wrongfully questioning the D'Amato's time and ability as if it was some sort of fluke run in a special event.
The Houston Marathon is a well-established race (50 years old) with a certified course and entry open to all.
It is held on the same weekend each year. It is not some special one-off event. There are no wavelights, wind blocking electric pace vehicles, etc. The weather can be good or not so good. There are no cash payouts for running specific times. Break the course record and you get a $10k bonus,
Pacers are allowed just like many other major marathons (Chicago).
D'Amato happened to run Houston on a fairly good weather day. She ran a well paced race, with a slight negative split. Isn't that the fastest way to get to the finish line, running your own race? Especially in a marathon, pacing yourself well and finishing in the least amount of time improves your chances of placing well.
D'Amato finished 15th at the Oly Marathon Trials in a PB of 2:34. She was 2nd at the Marathon Project in another pb of 2:22. She ran positive splits in both of these.
She was only 9 seconds off the lead pack at halfway in the Oly Trials, but faded badly to run 8 min slower for the second half. We have to believe she was going for it in that race but did not have the fitness to maintain the pace. She was already 2 minutes behind the leaders at halfway in the marathon project.
She probably would have loved to make the Olympic team and run in that marathon, and get invited to big races with limited elite fields like London 2020 and Boston 2021.
D'Amato's was leading at halfway in Houston and it was her first marathon win.
Seidel seems to try to also run conservatively aiming for even or negative splits. Her best marathon finish place results (Olympics, NYC, Olympic Trials) have been achieved by running big negative splits and where she was very fortunate enough to be in the lead pack at halfway because they races went out relatively slowly.
Her worst marathon place finish was at London, where she was over 4 minutes behind the leaders in 12th place at halfway, and ended up running slightly negative splits to finish 6th. (a personal best at the time). If she was truly a racer, why was she so far behind at halfway?
So the whole discussion about Seidel being a racer and D'Amato being a pacer is ridiculous. Neither of them is ducking competition. Everyone runs better when things shake out so that they are with the leaders at halfway and beyond. Everyone runs better when things go well so an even or positive split race is rewarded with a podium finish and/or a pb.
Both of these women have run relatively few marathons, and have done very well. They both deserve the chance to run and race in fast and competitive marathons in the future.
JBaller33 wrote:
Bronze Medal in Olympics > AR on hand selected course with no competition
And who was PACED!
How is a male-paced record legit?? Have the rules been changed?
Puddin head Joe wrote:
Keira wrapping herself in the flag must have been triggering to you commie dicks.
It’s disrespectful according to US flag code, which unfortunately the younger generations seems to be unaware of. We aren’t other countries, and just because Rocky did it does not make it acceptable. The US flag is considered a living thing and should be treated with utmost respect and dignity.
There is Room for All wrote:
Let's Run used to be a collective of highly educated and motivated people with a passion for running. It has devolved into a bar fight perpetrated by low intellect misanthropes dabbling in specious arguments that have little to do with running.
Yep... that's media for you. Whatever brings in the views (and money) At the expense of all else.
this and this wrote:
People seem to be wrongfully questioning the D'Amato's time and ability as if it was some sort of fluke run in a special event.
The Houston Marathon is a well-established race (50 years old) with a certified course and entry open to all.
It is held on the same weekend each year. It is not some special one-off event. There are no wavelights, wind blocking electric pace vehicles, etc. The weather can be good or not so good. There are no cash payouts for running specific times. Break the course record and you get a $10k bonus,
Pacers are allowed just like many other major marathons (Chicago).
D'Amato happened to run Houston on a fairly good weather day. She ran a well paced race, with a slight negative split. Isn't that the fastest way to get to the finish line, running your own race? Especially in a marathon, pacing yourself well and finishing in the least amount of time improves your chances of placing well.
D'Amato finished 15th at the Oly Marathon Trials in a PB of 2:34. She was 2nd at the Marathon Project in another pb of 2:22. She ran positive splits in both of these.
She was only 9 seconds off the lead pack at halfway in the Oly Trials, but faded badly to run 8 min slower for the second half. We have to believe she was going for it in that race but did not have the fitness to maintain the pace. She was already 2 minutes behind the leaders at halfway in the marathon project.
She probably would have loved to make the Olympic team and run in that marathon, and get invited to big races with limited elite fields like London 2020 and Boston 2021.
D'Amato's was leading at halfway in Houston and it was her first marathon win.
Seidel seems to try to also run conservatively aiming for even or negative splits. Her best marathon finish place results (Olympics, NYC, Olympic Trials) have been achieved by running big negative splits and where she was very fortunate enough to be in the lead pack at halfway because they races went out relatively slowly.
Her worst marathon place finish was at London, where she was over 4 minutes behind the leaders in 12th place at halfway, and ended up running slightly negative splits to finish 6th. (a personal best at the time). If she was truly a racer, why was she so far behind at halfway?
So the whole discussion about Seidel being a racer and D'Amato being a pacer is ridiculous. Neither of them is ducking competition. Everyone runs better when things shake out so that they are with the leaders at halfway and beyond. Everyone runs better when things go well so an even or positive split race is rewarded with a podium finish and/or a pb.
Both of these women have run relatively few marathons, and have done very well. They both deserve the chance to run and race in fast and competitive marathons in the future.
I have nothing against d’Amato, and her accomplishment is a major one. I was making the point that we should consider a bronze in the Olympic marathon against a large number of elite runners under very difficult conditions to be a greater accomplishment than setting the AR in the Houston marathon under much more ideal conditions. You may or may not agree with this assessment. Could d’Amato have done the same had she qualified? We will never know. I also stand by my general comments regarding TTs vs championship racing, though I do see your point about Houston not being a TT per se. Hassan’s 10K gold, defeating Gidey in the process, is a greater accomplishment than Gidey’s wr in the 10K, and I’m sure Gidey would trade Hassan the record for the gold if she could.
Wise Old Man wrote:
this and this wrote:
People seem to be wrongfully questioning the D'Amato's time and ability as if it was some sort of fluke run in a special event.
The Houston Marathon is a well-established race (50 years old) with a certified course and entry open to all.
It is held on the same weekend each year. It is not some special one-off event. There are no wavelights, wind blocking electric pace vehicles, etc. The weather can be good or not so good. There are no cash payouts for running specific times. Break the course record and you get a $10k bonus,
Pacers are allowed just like many other major marathons (Chicago).
D'Amato happened to run Houston on a fairly good weather day. She ran a well paced race, with a slight negative split. Isn't that the fastest way to get to the finish line, running your own race? Especially in a marathon, pacing yourself well and finishing in the least amount of time improves your chances of placing well.
D'Amato finished 15th at the Oly Marathon Trials in a PB of 2:34. She was 2nd at the Marathon Project in another pb of 2:22. She ran positive splits in both of these.
She was only 9 seconds off the lead pack at halfway in the Oly Trials, but faded badly to run 8 min slower for the second half. We have to believe she was going for it in that race but did not have the fitness to maintain the pace. She was already 2 minutes behind the leaders at halfway in the marathon project.
She probably would have loved to make the Olympic team and run in that marathon, and get invited to big races with limited elite fields like London 2020 and Boston 2021.
D'Amato's was leading at halfway in Houston and it was her first marathon win.
Seidel seems to try to also run conservatively aiming for even or negative splits. Her best marathon finish place results (Olympics, NYC, Olympic Trials) have been achieved by running big negative splits and where she was very fortunate enough to be in the lead pack at halfway because they races went out relatively slowly.
Her worst marathon place finish was at London, where she was over 4 minutes behind the leaders in 12th place at halfway, and ended up running slightly negative splits to finish 6th. (a personal best at the time). If she was truly a racer, why was she so far behind at halfway?
So the whole discussion about Seidel being a racer and D'Amato being a pacer is ridiculous. Neither of them is ducking competition. Everyone runs better when things shake out so that they are with the leaders at halfway and beyond. Everyone runs better when things go well so an even or positive split race is rewarded with a podium finish and/or a pb.
Both of these women have run relatively few marathons, and have done very well. They both deserve the chance to run and race in fast and competitive marathons in the future.
I have nothing against d’Amato, and her accomplishment is a major one. I was making the point that we should consider a bronze in the Olympic marathon against a large number of elite runners under very difficult conditions to be a greater accomplishment than setting the AR in the Houston marathon under much more ideal conditions. You may or may not agree with this assessment. Could d’Amato have done the same had she qualified? We will never know. I also stand by my general comments regarding TTs vs championship racing, though I do see your point about Houston not being a TT per se. Hassan’s 10K gold, defeating Gidey in the process, is a greater accomplishment than Gidey’s wr in the 10K, and I’m sure Gidey would trade Hassan the record for the gold if she could.
Got to agree with this. Hardware > records every time. Records are eventually lost, medals are yours forever. It's great that you have people raising the bar in terms of times but I tend to rank athletes by the competitions they win (or place in) and who they beat to win them. What is important now is that D'Amato's 2:19 puts her in a position where she can win WMMs and could even be competitive in London. It would be great to see her in London this year, I'm sure the organizers would pay her a good appearance fee now that she has the national record. She could also use a big performance at a big race with international competition
im sure she doesnt care
briswiss wrote:
Puddin head Joe wrote:
Keira is now firmly ensconced as the top US female marathoner.
Top US female marathoner of all time.
Of all time?!?! If Joan Benoit was competing now, with modern training/diet/shoes, etc, she would absolutely destroy any other American runner.
us flag is a living thing. wrote:
Puddin head Joe wrote:
Keira wrapping herself in the flag must have been triggering to you commie dicks.
It’s disrespectful according to US flag code, which unfortunately the younger generations seems to be unaware of. We aren’t other countries, and just because Rocky did it does not make it acceptable. The US flag is considered a living thing and should be treated with utmost respect and dignity.
The American flag is a joke.
Puddin head Joe wrote:
Keira is now firmly ensconced as the top US female marathoner.
How did Keira do at the olympics?
Mary changed this wrote:
Notime wrote:
D'Amato had her chance in Atlanta and bonked.
The Woke crowd now refers to it as Atalanta. Careful or you'll get cancelled for the microagression of using the real spelling.
wow man this is so witty you should write comedy somewhere
Puddin head Joe wrote:
Keira wrapping herself in the flag must have been triggering to you commie dicks.
Only Camille Heron.
Clearly, you didn't watch the trials. Keira set a PB of 2:34. Hardly what anyone would characterize as "bonked." Anytime you set a PB it's a good day. Separately, Keira has made significant progression from the trials to Houston so it's like comparing apples and oranges. If Molly were to toe the line with her today (or any other female marathoner for that matter), it won't even be a contest. No disrespect to Molly because she's obviously an incredible athlete, but Keira is clearly the top marathoner now. Seems like the sky is the limit for her.