Another level wrote:
WinnytheBish wrote:
Does anybody on this thread really think Shalane wouldn't dominate the ultramarathon scene just because there's some sticks on the ground?
Shalane would win any ultra in the world very easily if she were motivated to do so.
Correct. And she wouldn't have to wear a fanny pack fuel belt while she did it.
Another level wrote:
Shalane would win any ultra in the world very easily if she were motivated to do so.
Nope, that is not gonna happen. She would win a 50k road race easily but not a 100k road race or 100 mile trail ultra.
She might win the road 100k but she would suck at a 100 mile trail ultra.
WinnytheBish wrote:
Another level wrote:
Shalane would win any ultra in the world very easily if she were motivated to do so.
Correct. And she wouldn't have to wear a fanny pack fuel belt while she did it.
Just comrades alone would be a big question mark of her finishing top 5 let alone winning it. And if it came to mountainous ultras like hard rock 100, UTMB, Western States. It would be a even bigger question mark. Like ever heard of Courtney Dauwalter? Who chicked a huge percent of the elite male field this year at UTMB(one of the biggest trail ultras)? She chicked some very solid dudes this year at UTMB, so good luck on living in this fantasy world.
ultra thon bro wrote:
WinnytheBish wrote:
Correct. And she wouldn't have to wear a fanny pack fuel belt while she did it.
Just comrades alone would be a big question mark of her finishing top 5 let alone winning it. And if it came to mountainous ultras like hard rock 100, UTMB, Western States. It would be a even bigger question mark. Like ever heard of Courtney Dauwalter? Who chicked a huge percent of the elite male field this year at UTMB(one of the biggest trail ultras)? She chicked some very solid dudes this year at UTMB, so good luck on living in this fantasy world.
The fact that you're already comparing her to the best of the best ultra runners shows how easy it would be for her to pick up.
I hate to tell you all very few people, including me, care about fast track or road times. I don't care if a road marathon is a minute faster than the last road marathon.
Watching ultra coverage is way more enjoyable and frankly most people would agree.
Banana Nut Crunch Fan wrote:
Shalane is juiced.
MAYBE in her prime but not now. What's the point? She is retired and running/racing for fun. Drugs have potential side effects and there is not reason to put her health at risk when there is nothing to gain.
gsy u2929egs7eg wrote:
I hate to tell you all very few people, including me, care about fast track or road times. I don't care if a road marathon is a minute faster than the last road marathon.
Watching ultra coverage is way more enjoyable and frankly most people would agree.
Too classic. You think more people like to watch people do ultras then something fast? I agree that neither have a lot of fans but come on let’s get real. Don’t call out “very few people” when even less watch ultras.
Running a 2:21 marathon in Berlin (Shalane's PR) is absolutely amazing.
Running up and over a 3,000 foot pass, twice, between 10,000 and 13,000 feet at any speed is also amazing, especially when you're doing it between miles 38 and 62 at Leadville.
The thing is, the ONLY skill those two feats both require is substantial aerobic capacity. Otherwise, they are completely different sports. They require substantially different anatomic strengths and different physiological profiles.
Saying that Shalane would crush everyone at UTMB or Western States is like saying that LeBron James would be the world's best soccer goalie. Sure, it would be cool to see him try! If he could go back in time fifteen years and develop those skills instead of becoming the world's best basketball player, I'd be intrigued to see what he could have accomplished. But he didn't, just like Shalane hasn't spent 15 years trying to figure out how to ascend 18,000 feet on a 90-degree day at Western States while consuming 300 calories/hour.
Hammering out 5:20 miles over and over and over again on flat pavement is ridiculously amazing. It gives you a hell of a baseline to get into serious ultra training. But anyone who shows up at 100 mile mountain race with JUST that background (and there have been plenty of men with similar fitness profiles in ultrarunning) is going to have a bad time unless they are super conservative (which they probably won't be because the "right" pace is going to feel super slow to them.) Kara Goucher was three years out from a fourth place finish in the OT marathon when she ran ~9:00 pace for a trail marathon in Leadville. No, she wasn't anywhere close to her peak, but she wasn't a three hour marathoner, either. She was on mid-2:30s pace in Houson six months prior to Leadville before straining her hamstring.
113 wrote:
Running a 2:21 marathon in Berlin (Shalane's PR) is absolutely amazing.
Running up and over a 3,000 foot pass, twice, between 10,000 and 13,000 feet at any speed is also amazing, especially when you're doing it between miles 38 and 62 at Leadville.
The thing is, the ONLY skill those two feats both require is substantial aerobic capacity. Otherwise, they are completely different sports. They require substantially different anatomic strengths and different physiological profiles.
Saying that Shalane would crush everyone at UTMB or Western States is like saying that LeBron James would be the world's best soccer goalie. Sure, it would be cool to see him try! If he could go back in time fifteen years and develop those skills instead of becoming the world's best basketball player, I'd be intrigued to see what he could have accomplished. But he didn't, just like Shalane hasn't spent 15 years trying to figure out how to ascend 18,000 feet on a 90-degree day at Western States while consuming 300 calories/hour.
Hammering out 5:20 miles over and over and over again on flat pavement is ridiculously amazing. It gives you a hell of a baseline to get into serious ultra training. But anyone who shows up at 100 mile mountain race with JUST that background (and there have been plenty of men with similar fitness profiles in ultrarunning) is going to have a bad time unless they are super conservative (which they probably won't be because the "right" pace is going to feel super slow to them.) Kara Goucher was three years out from a fourth place finish in the OT marathon when she ran ~9:00 pace for a trail marathon in Leadville. No, she wasn't anywhere close to her peak, but she wasn't a three hour marathoner, either. She was on mid-2:30s pace in Houson six months prior to Leadville before straining her hamstring.
Any sport where you have to consume 300 calories per hour is an eating competition not a running competition.
Another level wrote:
gsy u2929egs7eg wrote:
I hate to tell you all very few people, including me, care about fast track or road times. I don't care if a road marathon is a minute faster than the last road marathon.
Watching ultra coverage is way more enjoyable and frankly most people would agree.
Too classic. You think more people like to watch people do ultras then something fast? I agree that neither have a lot of fans but come on let’s get real. Don’t call out “very few people” when even less watch ultras.
Yeah, more people watch the marathon and down over this ultra nonsense. I could see the 50k being a fun event to watch in the future but that's just another event Shalane would embarrass ultra runners in.
Now that she's done with her quest, could any female ultra runners complete what she did? The answer is NO.
sounds like something a sprinter would say about a miler
WinnytheBish wrote:
Now that she's done with her quest, could any female ultra runners complete what she did? The answer is NO.
Obviously what Shalane did isn't ultrarunning anyway, but it sounds like you don't know much about Gerda Steyn.
There is nothing to learn from Shalane unless you were or are a world class athlete with a heart like a lion.
Why are people so quick to extrapolate examples from extraordinary individuals to more average people?
Someone that runs a 2:10 marathon is no more a "real runner" than someone that runs a 4:00 marathon and they don't impress me any more. I'm much more impressed by someone that takes 24 hours to do 100 miles than someone that runs a fast road marathon.
WinnytheBish wrote:
Now that she's done with her quest, could any female ultra runners complete what she did? The answer is NO.
She defended an athlete she coaches who’s a convicted doper, for a drug that helps recovery.
Running 100 miles or even 50 is much different than 26.2. Trail running is different than road racing which is different than running on a track.
I think the OP sees some of the top Ultra runners road times say for a 10K or even a marathon and thinks haha the western states winner can't break 2:30, I can totally be compete in ultras as a 2:35 marathoner as could all my 2;30ish friends. Go ahead and run 100 miles on a trail first and see how it goes. Most of the top marathoners aren't world class 5000M runners and some are way better marathoners than 10K runners but that doesn't mean that any fast miler, 5K or 10K can start winning elite marathons.
While I think there's a bit of truth to the OP's premise due to the fact that there are far fewer people who run ultras than who run marathons so you could argue the talent pool isn't as deep since the fields are smaller and fewer people have the time to devote to training but that doesn't mean the best marathoner is going to crush the best ultra runner.
It's easy to say wow that elite female ultra runner can't break 17:40 for a 5K on Athlinks or Strava, I can totally kick her ass only to realize that if she trained for it she could easily throw down sub 16 5K road race and may have while running in college. This same person might also find that one's 5K isn't a great indicator of how well they might run 100 miles on trails.
Many a LetsRun poster has been humbled when finding a race with seemingly slow times, tasting an easy victory before realizing it had some pretty big hills, running at elevation was much harder than they imagined or was mainly on dirt trails that required dodging rocks and other obstacles.
EKJ wrote:
WinnytheBish wrote:
Now that she's done with her quest, could any female ultra runners complete what she did? The answer is NO.
Obviously what Shalane did isn't ultrarunning anyway, but it sounds like you don't know much about Gerda Steyn.
Nope because ultra running has been proven to be a joke here. Shalane could beat Gertrude in a marathon NEXT WEEK if she had to.
rudedog wrote:
sounds like something a sprinter would say about a miler
I'm confused, do sprinters think milers run ultra marathons?
18rabbitskiing wrote:
Running 100 miles or even 50 is much different than 26.2. Trail running is different than road racing which is different than running on a track.
I think the OP sees some of the top Ultra runners road times say for a 10K or even a marathon and thinks haha the western states winner can't break 2:30, I can totally be compete in ultras as a 2:35 marathoner as could all my 2;30ish friends. Go ahead and run 100 miles on a trail first and see how it goes. Most of the top marathoners aren't world class 5000M runners and some are way better marathoners than 10K runners but that doesn't mean that any fast miler, 5K or 10K can start winning elite marathons.
While I think there's a bit of truth to the OP's premise due to the fact that there are far fewer people who run ultras than who run marathons so you could argue the talent pool isn't as deep since the fields are smaller and fewer people have the time to devote to training but that doesn't mean the best marathoner is going to crush the best ultra runner.
It's easy to say wow that elite female ultra runner can't break 17:40 for a 5K on Athlinks or Strava, I can totally kick her ass only to realize that if she trained for it she could easily throw down sub 16 5K road race and may have while running in college. This same person might also find that one's 5K isn't a great indicator of how well they might run 100 miles on trails.
Many a LetsRun poster has been humbled when finding a race with seemingly slow times, tasting an easy victory before realizing it had some pretty big hills, running at elevation was much harder than they imagined or was mainly on dirt trails that required dodging rocks and other obstacles.
I stopped reading when you said I was a 2:35 marathoner. Please.