10x3:00 track workout: What does it say about fitness?

Sub 15:30 for sure. Potentially 15:00 depending on how hard it was once you got down to 4:48 pace.

CoachB wrote:

Sub 15:30 for sure. Potentially 15:00 depending on how hard it was once you got down to 4:48 pace.

HR was at about 188 according to my watch by the end of the last rep and my max HR is sitting around 200-205

Just converting in my head for my own purposes. Let's say the overall average was 5' for the ons. You basically did 10x950m @ 5' pace (3:07 per k) with 2' jog. I'm going to guess this is optimistic 8k pace or something like 8k pace +5 second.

I would guess maybe 25:30 for 8k and 15:10 for 5k on the track. Maybe a touch faster given you sped up depending how those faster reps felt.

highhoppingworm wrote:

Just converting in my head for my own purposes. Let's say the overall average was 5' for the ons. You basically did 10x950m @ 5' pace (3:07 per k) with 2' jog. I'm going to guess this is optimistic 8k pace or something like 8k pace +5 second.

I would guess maybe 25:30 for 8k and 15:10 for 5k on the track. Maybe a touch faster given you sped up depending how those faster reps felt.

+1

14:45

The point of workouts shouldn't be to try to estimate your race fitness. That's what racing is for. The point of working out is to struggle just enough that your fitness improves by a little bit each time.

Impressive workout, from what I've read in your posts I'm basically where you were a year ago. I'd love to get kind of an idea of what you've been doing that got you this far

Polish Fernandez wrote:

The point of workouts shouldn't be to try to estimate your race fitness. That's what racing is for. The point of working out is to struggle just enough that your fitness improves by a little bit each time.

I know, but every now and again I surprise myself and like to see what letsrun thinks about it haha. Thanks nonetheless

CopperRunner wrote:

I did 10x3:00 on/2:00 off on the track today. The ons steadily increased in pace from 5:15 per mile to 4:48 per mile. For the offs I ran between 7:30-8:00 pace. What do you think I should be running for 5k about now?

So roughly you did 10x1k with 2 min jogging rest at roughly 8k-10k pace. Lets split the difference 5:15-4:48 median is about 5:00. If 5:00 is your 10k pace that is about 31:00 or so. Convert 10k to 5k by dividing by 2 and subtracting 30-45 seconds that yields 14:45-15:00 🤔

Film Rep wrote:

CopperRunner wrote:

I did 10x3:00 on/2:00 off on the track today. The ons steadily increased in pace from 5:15 per mile to 4:48 per mile. For the offs I ran between 7:30-8:00 pace. What do you think I should be running for 5k about now?

So roughly you did 10x1k with 2 min jogging rest at roughly 8k-10k pace. Lets split the difference 5:15-4:48 median is about 5:00. If 5:00 is your 10k pace that is about 31:00 or so. Convert 10k to 5k by dividing by 2 and subtracting 30-45 seconds that yields 14:45-15:00 🤔

I can't believe I agree with Film Rep but I do. I would just say following your background a bit you seem more speed focused and the reps were a bit under 1000 hence my 15:10ish prediction.

Don't get me wrong... you can't fake 10x1000 (or close to it) but that doesn't mean it lines up exactly for aerobic monsters vs. mid-distance runners.

cramister wrote:

Impressive workout, from what I've read in your posts I'm basically where you were a year ago. I'd love to get kind of an idea of what you've been doing that got you this far

There’s a few big factors that have led to my huge fitness gains IMO.

1- believing in myself. Ikr, super corny. But I seriously think one of the biggest mistakes I ever made was telling myself I wasn’t talented. It really handicapped myself in hindsight. Tell yourself you’ll be the next Nick Symmonds or Cole Hocker or whoever you idolize in the running community, and you’ll be crazy at worst, and correct at best. There’s nothing wrong with being a little crazy.

2- my high school coaching handicapped me. We would run 20-35 mpw during XC and 10-15 mpw during track. I started trying to run extra outside of practice and the coaches saw it as disrespectful instead of a good way to build fitness. It turned into a me vs them thing with them instigating the conflicts and not me. In hindsight I really don’t think they even wanted to see me succeed. Apparently they get upset and defensive whenever my old teammates that are still in high school bring up how much I’ve improved. As I’m sure you’ve also noticed I have no problem absolutely dragging some high school coaches (which seems to be taboo here) all over the floor. This is why. Not all coaches are good coaches or even try to be good coaches.

3- this is the first time in my running career ive been able to be truly consistent. There was basically no time in high school where I was healthy for more than 3-4 months at a time. Low but unrealistically high intensity mileage, poor sleep, poor nutrition, poor hydration, and lack of recovery was an absolute recipe for disaster for me. I read somewhere that it takes a good two years of consistent running to really start to see your aerobic potential, and I haven’t been able to be consistent for anywhere near that amount of time until now. I’ve spent the last year and a half averaging probably 60 mpw, with the first 1/3 of that truly embracing hobby jogging. Just easy/steady running, sprinting around on soccer fields, and lifting. It gave me a lot of time to reset mentally, as I never HAD to do anything. The next time I got onto the track, I realized I was now in the best shape of my life from 1600m and up.

Now the technical stuff:

-I did that unstructured base running for 6 months or so, it’s probably not required but it was essential in getting me to where I am personally.

-Build that raw speed. In 2019 I was a 56 guy. In 2020 I was a 52.5 guy. This year im a 50 guy. Lift weights, do plyo, and do low volume reps at 95-100% intensity ranging from 50m-300m. I believe sprint speed is the foundation of a strong runner. Speed endurance is essential. A fast 400m guy holds the potential to be a fast 800m guy and so on.

- weekly structure. I adopted a 10 day cycle and rolled with it until I joined up with the team I train with now. It was essentially a pattern of workout/lift-easy long-recovery. I would allow myself one day completely off in the ten day cycle if needed. I’d cycle between a 400-800m pace day, a 1600m-5k pace day, and a tempo day for the workouts. Id lift after each workout. A lot of people believe doing my long runs the day after my workout/lift days is a dumb idea. To that I say “okay”

Best of luck to you cram!

highhoppingworm wrote:

Film Rep wrote:

So roughly you did 10x1k with 2 min jogging rest at roughly 8k-10k pace. Lets split the difference 5:15-4:48 median is about 5:00. If 5:00 is your 10k pace that is about 31:00 or so. Convert 10k to 5k by dividing by 2 and subtracting 30-45 seconds that yields 14:45-15:00 🤔

I can't believe I agree with Film Rep but I do. I would just say following your background a bit you seem more speed focused and the reps were a bit under 1000 hence my 15:10ish prediction.

Don't get me wrong... you can't fake 10x1000 (or close to it) but that doesn't mean it lines up exactly for aerobic monsters vs. mid-distance runners.

Your thoughts line up with mine pretty well. I think I’m probably not sub 32:00 for 10k right now. Ive ran one 10k race in my current form so my PB is 32:5x atm but that was XC so who knows. I do think my speed orientation gives me more fruitful time conversions though. I think I tend to gain about 25 seconds per mile every time I double distance and vice versa, so I could be looking at a 1:00-1:15 per 5k difference going off of my 10k.

I'm really impressed with how much speed you dropped as an adult in 2 years. To go from 56 to 50 in two years is pretty incredible. I didn't know that was possible after high school. Good for you and good luck in your races!

xczvzxcv wrote:

I'm really impressed with how much speed you dropped as an adult in 2 years. To go from 56 to 50 in two years is pretty incredible. I didn't know that was possible after high school. Good for you and good luck in your races!

Thank you! I believe speed has more potential for development than most realize, just because it’s so incremental compared to gains in the longer distances. It’s extremely easy to over-look those .05 and .1 second improvements as a distance runner. I do also credit most of my 400m improvement to a complete lack of speed development in high school. We rarely ever ran faster than 800m pace so the only time I practiced 400m running/pacing was during an actual 400m. I had a former teammate who was also a 56ish guy quit distance and join sprints running 51.9 at the end of that year. This was Jr-Sr year for him.