Top D3 or mid-major D1?

If you want advice about working in a well-paying managerial position at a Fortune 500 company, speak to well paid managers at Fortune 500 companies and ask them about the importance of the college one attends, career pathways, etc. Do not ask anonymous running website posters who are tossing around completely made-up and obviously inflated statistics.

You don't know any Fortune 500 managers? Well then find them. Ask your high school if there are any alumni you can talk to. Go on LinkedIn and find some people that work at companies you admire. Reach out to 1000 of them. The higher they are in the company the better. Many will ignore you, but you will be surprised at how willing some will be to talk.

I would say that your willingness and your ability to do what I describe above will be a better predicter of your success in business than where you go to college. That being said, I do think that where you go to college matters as well, and can make things much easier for you. But don't take it from me or the fake statistic guys on this board; find out for yourself from multiple sources who are actually doing what you want to do.

Yes, fortune 500 companies will mostly hire student from elite schools. I'm not recommending paying sticker at a private college, unless that college is extremely elite [harvard, yale etc] Balance cost and quality. Public schools are often a good choice. Or, you may be able to go to a slightly lower ranking school with a much larger scholarship. For example a schools ranked 80 [think American U] may give more aid than a school ranked 60 [ie George Washington U] without a significant loss of quality. You may need a slightly higher class ranking to stay competitive, but you will save tens of thousands.

**The example schools are meant to illustrate the cost vs quality trade off. I have no knowledge of college running programs

I'm not specifically looking to get into Wall Street (although if the opportunity presented itself I'd probably take it); my long-term goal is to be able to get a well-paying managerial position at a large (possibly fortune-500) company. I'm assuming that what college you go to does matter to fortune 500 companies, right?[/quote]

I matters with respect to networking and internship opportunities and alumni base… I generally recommend people go to school in the general area they want to live/work. It can be hard to transition from a small school with no name recognition that is in Kansas to a big company that is based in San Francisco… but if you goal is to work in SF a small no name school in that area where you can intern and meet/work with people at Bay Area businesses is likely more helpful than going to a “good school” in Ohio.

If you are a top D3 athlete you will likely be able to compete with more or less the same talent pool as a mid major D1 guy (top d3 kids run in top invitationals ok mid major kids do not) assuming you are actually at a legit d3 with facilities and a robust travel budget.

There's some similarity here in the advice when it comes to picking a school for professional purposes and where to run for performance purposes... If you're striving to become the best runner in the country, there's probably a list of 10 schools you'd have the best chance of making that happen. If you want to work for McKinsey or get moving on that lucrative wall street investment banking job, there's probably a list of 10 schools that have the best chance of making that happen.

If neither of these are your motivating factor, then the division is irrelevant and it all comes down to the balance of fit/function your looking for.

I ran both D1 (top 5 cc university) and D3(top 5 cc university) and I found both of them, from a dedication to excellence stand point, to be fairly even... Aside from the budget, the only difference was the team at one had foot locker champs and the team at the other had state champs, but the mentality and dedication of the groups was almost identical.

Point being, I got what I was looking for in an environment that was more my "speed", no pun intended. I work as a manager at a Fortune top 10 place to work and have an athletic background I'm satisfied with and have a degree from a school that isn't prestigious for developing athletes or scholars. There's a school for you and you'll know it when you visit it.

Newkirk wrote:

That is very odd. What school gave you a full academic scholarship while SEC schools gave none? I know kids at Georgia and Georgia Tech paying very little and those were their best deals. They were far better than any D3 schools offered. Your situation doesn't make sense.

Exactly

I ran at a top D3 distance program in the early 90s (Albany). I didn’t run in high school so I just went to one of my state’s better universities despite getting into one “public ivy” and wait listed at another because that’s what I could afford.

I can’t tell you how glad I am that I did. When I got to Albany, the track team was very good, but the distance program was a bit of a mess. That turned out to be a good thing because it meant they not only allowed walk ins, but it also meant that even a walk on could contribute.

I ended up as our 4th man at two 3rd place finished at cross country nationals and set three school records. Two of them were still intact twenty years after they had moved to D1.

So find the school that’s the right fit for you, find a way on to the team, work hard academically and athletically, and focus on enjoying the experience. All of the rest will work out, and you’ll learn that the difference between D-1 and D-3 isn’t as extreme as most people on these boards would have you believe.

i cant sub 5 :( wrote:

I ran 4:34/9:34 my junior track season and am now trying to figure out colleges. I know it depends somewhat on the person, but in general, would I be able to develop as an athlete more at a top-20 D3 school or a mid-major D1 school? I am currently talking to coaches from both types of schools. All have good academics, so that isn't a problem either.

90% of DIII schools are like high school and 98% of them aren't trying to win. Many aren't even that...more like a recreation team. Go to a DIII and expect to be on a van driven by your coach for 7 hour drives or if your in a populated area on the east coast, you won't travel further an 100 miles.

Some idiot earlier stated that 99.99% of employers don't care where you went to school. Nothing could be further from the truth.! There is a reason why the Ivies and other elite schools are elite, as compared to EastWest XYZ State U. or University of Phoenix.

If you want to get better choose a D1 school. They will have more resources for you such as athletic trainers, money for travel, gear and so on. Find a decent coach and a good team culture. Also, comparing a mid-major to a top D3 isn't really fair. Currently 14 of the top 30 schools in the recent D1 rankings are mid-major programs. A 150 ranked program D1 team is likely better than most top 10 D3 team in the country.

I think it’s clear: if you want to run we’ll go D1.

If you want to focus on academics, go D3.

347893 wrote:

Some idiot earlier stated that 99.99% of employers don't care where you went to school. Nothing could be further from the truth.! There is a reason why the Ivies and other elite schools are elite, as compared to EastWest XYZ State U. or University of Phoenix.

There are reasons why a school is elite but going to an elite school is not automatically giving you an elite job or life. I know several Ivy League grads, all forty or much older now. None of them have done anything for work that someone from a Pennsylvania Conference school, for example, couldn't have done. That's not to say there aren't differences but you should not assume that an Ivy degree will set you up for a cabinet post.

Run for Haverford if you have the grades and like it. I hear Tom is a legend and has coached some of the greats.

Check out Wartburg. Their coach will really go out of his way to take you to the next level.

I ran a bit slower than you in high school but rarely ran more than 35 mpw in high school. Went to an above average d-1 state university academically with a good business school. My college team made the nationals my freshman year in cc and had a chance to make nationals my senior year. Was running varsity races by my sophomore year and ended up as an all New England cross country runner and a all conference track runner. It was hard only going to one outdoor track meet as a freshman but I gradually increased by mileage and commitment each year. Ended up getting a job with a top accounting firm. About half of my freshman teammates were not running for the team by the time we were juniors. D-1 running is hard and I nearly transferred after my freshman year. It is a lot less fun running at a d1 school if you are not improving. If you are running a over 50 mpw consistently during high school you may be closer to your running potential and may enjoy going to a d3 school more. Also money should always play a role in your decision. May be hard to turn down a school that has good academics and gives you the best package. Schedule a visit to meet the coach in their office when you visit the school and it is important to feel comfortable with them. Good luck with your decision.

While this may be true of many bottom-of-the-barrel D3 teams, I'd say top D3 schools are every bit as dedicated as all but the top D1s. John Carrol had a sub 24:50 8k scoring average at Paul Short beating teams like George Mason; MIT had a 24:40 8k average at D3 pre-nats; Pomona-Pitzer posted a 24:3X 8k scoring average earlier this season. These teams are more than "recreation." And these are the kind of teams I am looking at.

Have you ever attended a D3 conference meet or regional meet or national meet? There are dozens of crazy teammates all painted up running around screaming for their team. It is a nice atmosphere for some but not for others. It is much more like high school than D1. Many D3 teams have 35 guys on the roster while many D1 teams have 12. You will get way more personal attention in D1 from coaching to strength training to massages to medical care.

Yes, D1s do have more resources at their disposal, which are definitely helpful when developing as an athlete. I'm more talking about team culture and coaching quality. I think being on the varsity squad on a top D3 would allow one to receive plenty of attention from the coach, even if the roster is large. If I go D1 I won't be in the travel squad as a freshman, so I probably wouldn't get as much attention anyways. It is true that D1s have the advantage overall in resources though, but I think that isn't going to make or break a college career.

The bitches are wayyy hotter at D1 schools. Follow your dick.

okay chapman

You are arguing how competitive the top D3 schools are but then say you won't make the travel roster at a D1 school. Which is it? Either the D3 schools are not as fast or you won't travel there either.