W NCAA XC: #1 NC State CRUSHES #3 New Mexico, #6 Alabama, #7 Minnesota , #8 Washington

semihaze wrote:

also crazy how steelman, tuohy and chmiel can beat each other off in a race, just depends on who has a better day

Which is not to mention that Clairmonte is the defending ACC cross country champion. Who knows what kind of form she and Shaw will be able to get into by NCAAs, but the performance yesterday is remarkable - an 18 second spread from Chimel back to their fifth runner, not including an ACC champion and a 15;40 5k runner .

FastTuohy wrote:

7empest wrote:

Looks like Dudek and Stanford back in play!!!

No offense to Stanford or anyone on the team, but that result does not show much to me. I think as a team they are far behind NC State and BYU (and perhaps New Mexico and Utah as well) at this point.

But in 2 weeks we shall see with BYU, NC State, New Mexico, Washington (and more) scheduled to be at Nuttycombe with Stanford. A little odd to me Heymach did not run this race yesterday.

I’m just saying a healthy Dudek has top 5 potential and if four more move up you can’t count them out. But I agree it is tough for anyone to be where BYU and NC State are.

semihaze wrote:

Jack2651 wrote:

Marlee starliper, was not a better middle distance runner.compared to longer distances.

her high school stats says middle distance all over it .. and her current ankles shouts "middle distances only" too

Hmmm…….seems like some misinformation semihaze? HS girls standard distance events are 3000-3200m on the track and 5k CC, so if you look at Starliper’s HS times, you must be taken some purple haze if you think she is not a distance runner!

5k CC - 16;30 (9th all time)

FL - 16:46 (5th all time)

Indoor 2 mile - 9:58 (8th all time)

3000m Indoor- 9:07 (3rd all time)

3200m Outdoor - 9:54 (11th all time)

And I don’t know what the heck your talking about with the ankle comment?

Too bad that BYU wasn't there. Would have been a competitive event for NC St.

pathways wrote:

semihaze wrote:

also crazy how steelman, tuohy and chmiel can beat each other off in a race, just depends on who has a better day

Which is not to mention that Clairmonte is the defending ACC cross country champion. Who knows what kind of form she and Shaw will be able to get into by NCAAs, but the performance yesterday is remarkable - an 18 second spread from Chimel back to their fifth runner, not including an ACC champion and a 15;40 5k runner .

In this video with Steelman and Hays on Runnerspace there is a passing reference to Clairmonte getting knocked down in this race.

again in this interview with Shaw

pathways wrote:

semihaze wrote:

also crazy how steelman, tuohy and chmiel can beat each other off in a race, just depends on who has a better day

Which is not to mention that Clairmonte is the defending ACC cross country champion. Who knows what kind of form she and Shaw will be able to get into by NCAAs, but the performance yesterday is remarkable - an 18 second spread from Chimel back to their fifth runner, not including an ACC champion and a 15;40 5k runner .

Steeleman, Chmiel, Touhy are all showing top 10 for right now (of which the former 2 did last year). Even Latour was 3 secs off Touhy which indicates at least top 25 form. Even Hays and Bush could sneak into top 40. If Clairemont and Shaw get into form, that's dangerous. If one of them has a bad race, there's 2 back ups that have borderline AA potential. NCAA's has the potential to be a lower scoring battle between them and BYU, but NC State's cards are showing more right now.

November 20th is a long way off. No ones ever won a national championship in October. Did NC State rest up for this race? Or are they still in heavy training like the other teams may be?

A recall all those years that Colorado looked mediocre during the season and then at championships came out of no where to win. So my suggestion is to lower the value of these non championship races. Heck NAU men didn’t even win their conference last year lol.

Updated LACCTiC ratings including Piane results

1 - 15:48 - NC State

2 - 15:54 - BYU

3 - 15:59 - New Mexico

4 - 16:03 - Alabama

5 - 16:03 - Colorado

6 - 16:07 - Washington

7 - 16:08 - North Carolina

8 - 16:11 - Utah

9 - 16:12 - Oklahoma State

10- 16:12 - Florida State

1 - 15:22 - Mercy Chelangat - Alabama JR

2 - 15:31 - Whittni Orton - BYU SR

3 - 15:35 - Haley Herberg - Washington JR

4 - 15:36 - Nicole Fegans - Georgia Tech SR

5 - 15:37 - Taylor Roe - Oklahoma State JR

6 - 15:39 - Hannah Steelman - NC State SR

7 - 15:41 - Jenna Magness - Michigan State SR

8 - 15:44 - Zofia Dudek - Stanford FR

9 - 15:44 - Amaris Tyynismaa - Alabama SO

10- 15:44 - Anna Pataki - Portland SR

https://www.lacctic.com/

(numbers will change with further updates)

Over the top wrote:

November 20th is a long way off. No ones ever won a national championship in October. Did NC State rest up for this race? Or are they still in heavy training like the other teams may be?

A recall all those years that Colorado looked mediocre during the season and then at championships came out of no where to win. So my suggestion is to lower the value of these non championship races. Heck NAU men didn’t even win their conference last year lol.

What you say is true, to a point. We don't know where the teams are training wise. But on an absolute basis, the times of NC State are impressive, and they also compare well to the top NC State runners(and all runners for that matter) of 2019 at the same meet who went on to place high at nationals. Perhaps New Mexico will run much faster at Nationals. Probably less likely for their top 2 as that would put them in pretty fast territory though. But the NAU analogy is off as the reason they lost their conference meet is they rested 2 or 3 top guys.

The Nuttycombe on the 15th should give us another good look at where things stand.

7empest wrote:

semihaze wrote:

her high school stats says middle distance all over it .. and her current ankles shouts "middle distances only" too

Hmmm…….seems like some misinformation semihaze? HS girls standard distance events are 3000-3200m on the track and 5k CC, so if you look at Starliper’s HS times, you must be taken some purple haze if you think she is not a distance runner!

5k CC - 16;30 (9th all time)

FL - 16:46 (5th all time)

Indoor 2 mile - 9:58 (8th all time)

3000m Indoor- 9:07 (3rd all time)

3200m Outdoor - 9:54 (11th all time)

And I don’t know what the heck your talking about with the ankle comment?

About the ankle comment - XC requires far for ankle stability than track events. In my opinion, an ankle injury is much like a concussion. Once you have had your first twisted ankle (strain or sprain) you are much more susceptible to the next. The stability is never fully regained.

For comparison purposes, here are the top five women from the "premiere" 6K race at Lehigh's Paul Short Invitational:

1 O'NEILL, Taryn JR 1020 Northern Arizona 1 19:54.8

2 FORBES, Grace SO 1099 Rice 2 19:58.4

3 OLIVERE, Lydia JR 1540 Villanova 3 20:03.0

4 STRUTHERS, Katie SR 1488 Utah State 4 20:03.3

5 SIGFSTEAD , Sadie FR 1542 Villanova 5 20:04.7

CrispyChicken wrote:

For comparison purposes, here are the top five women from the "premiere" 6K race at Lehigh's Paul Short Invitational:

1 O'NEILL, Taryn JR 1020 Northern Arizona 1 19:54.8

2 FORBES, Grace SO 1099 Rice 2 19:58.4

3 OLIVERE, Lydia JR 1540 Villanova 3 20:03.0

4 STRUTHERS, Katie SR 1488 Utah State 4 20:03.3

5 SIGFSTEAD , Sadie FR 1542 Villanova 5 20:04.7

Is that the same course as the December 2019 XC club championship? Tuohy ran 20:11 in somewhat muddy conditions in that race.

fwiw LACCTIC rated O'Neill at a 16:00 for the Paul Short race whereas NC State's top ladies were rated at sub 15:50 at Joe Piane

Villanova and Utah State are supposed to be at Nuttycombe as well, while NAU and Georgetown are supposed to be at Fl State Pre Nats.

Over the top wrote:

November 20th is a long way off. No ones ever won a national championship in October. Did NC State rest up for this race? Or are they still in heavy training like the other teams may be?

A recall all those years that Colorado looked mediocre during the season and then at championships came out of no where to win. So my suggestion is to lower the value of these non championship races. Heck NAU men didn’t even win their conference last year lol.

/

....why would you think NC State would be "resting up" for this race? They're probably in the same place in their training cycle that other elite teams are. Strange comment.

CrispyChicken wrote:

7empest wrote:

Hmmm…….seems like some misinformation semihaze? HS girls standard distance events are 3000-3200m on the track and 5k CC, so if you look at Starliper’s HS times, you must be taken some purple haze if you think she is not a distance runner!

5k CC - 16;30 (9th all time)

FL - 16:46 (5th all time)

Indoor 2 mile - 9:58 (8th all time)

3000m Indoor- 9:07 (3rd all time)

3200m Outdoor - 9:54 (11th all time)

And I don’t know what the heck your talking about with the ankle comment?

About the ankle comment - XC requires far for ankle stability than track events. In my opinion, an ankle injury is much like a concussion. Once you have had your first twisted ankle (strain or sprain) you are much more susceptible to the next. The stability is never fully regained.

Well that may be a good explanation if she would have ever had an ankle injury!

jami has a stress fracture so will probably redshirt this season. she’s always injured because she runs too hard on her easy days. I think she’s had ~5 stress fractures at bama and she’s only a junior. such a shame because she’s pretty talented.

7empest wrote:

Well that may be a good explanation if she would have ever had an ankle injury!

I thought she had some sort of a lower leg injury in the Spring of 2020 that she overcame, but then something else popped up.

She "tweaked" her ankle during a run through the woods last year but the injury was described as minor:

https://www.runnerspace.com/gprofile.php?mgroup_id=44531&do=news&news_id=602675

Fully disagree with the notion that if you sprain an ankle your distance running career is never the same. And absolutely completely disagree with the clowns here suggesting Starliper was never a real distance runner. She was one of the best ever.

N c state got a great surprise from LaTour who looks like a great number Number 4 Runner and seems to be continuously improving. But I don't know if they're going to have another number 5 Runner to really step up and challenge BYU this year. B y u could easily have all five run All American and will have a great number one and number two in the top 10. Not sure that NC State's number five Runner can crack the top 60

Also I think State might be overeager and go out too hard and fade. They are younger team. BYU's Runners have Decades of experience and they have the stability of being older married women which gives them certain maturity

MidFootStriker wrote:

N c state got a great surprise from LaTour who looks like a great number Number 4 Runner and seems to be continuously improving. But I don't know if they're going to have another number 5 Runner to really step up and challenge BYU this year. B y u could easily have all five run All American and will have a great number one and number two in the top 10. Not sure that NC State's number five Runner can crack the top 60

Also I think State might be overeager and go out too hard and fade. They are younger team. BYU's Runners have Decades of experience and they have the stability of being older married women which gives them certain maturity

By mid November BYU may indeed have the superior team and win. But we have not yet seen that team this Fall - perhaps at Nuttycombe we will. What we have seen is NC State have a 18 second spread between #1 and #5 at the 5K Joe Piane meet. BYU, in their opener at FSU had a 38 second spread between #1 and #4 in the 6K race. I only look at #4 as Anna Camp was their 7th that day and I assume she will return to be their #2 or 3 runner. Granted, that was 2 weeks earlier than Joe Piane. NC States top five looked better timewise vs the top runners of S Utah, Fl State, and Furman than BYU's did in their respective races as well.

Not so sure about the younger team comment either as Chmiel, Steelman, Hays, Clairemonte (who fell at ND) have a lot of experience, and I think Tuohy will be fine in a big race given her experience. Running in a pack is a benefit to both teams. BYU's 4th runner at FSU was a freshman, so similar experience to LaTour.

In any case it is too early to know, but I think if both teams run their best in November they will be very close with both teams under 100 points.

Supposedly Runnerspace is going to stream Nuttycombe, and Flotrack will stream the FSU PreNats race on the 15th. Both require a fee to watch live.