Since there will be no NXN why not invite Newbury Park to compete against the best in NYS and the Northeast? Records will fall.
Since there will be no NXN why not invite Newbury Park to compete against the best in NYS and the Northeast? Records will fall.
They could have registered.
trappist wrote:
Since there will be no NXN why not invite Newbury Park to compete against the best in NYS and the Northeast? Records will fall.
Because nobody cares about the northeast except for the northeast
trappist wrote:
Since there will be no NXN why not invite Newbury Park to compete against the best in NYS and the Northeast? Records will fall.
If that course has a lot of down hill they won’t go there. NBP doesn’t go to Mt. Sac because of the down hill per their coach. So I don’t see them going a cross the country for that type of course.
Real xc happens in the northeast.
Not paved, waxed sac races.
I remember a Fox from Syracuse who only recruited in a 200 mile radius from campus...
And won NCAA....
Yup correct. Coach Bell the current head coach does the same thing now. Recruits within 5 hours of the campus. I’ll be at manhattan and I’d be more than willing to take them on there. I’d get smoked but I’m sure they wouldn’t run as good as they do out west and manhattan is as close as it gets in the Northeast for courses that resemble something they would race on.
Newbury Park and other top teams are racing at RunningLane on 12/4… should be a fun meet on a very fast course.
DougC wrote:
Newbury Park and other top teams are racing at RunningLane on 12/4… should be a fun meet on a very fast course.
That's the problem, since when did cross country become about fast races. We might as well just watch these guys race on the track with some of these courses down south and out west. Real cross country courses shouldn't be fast, take a look at some of the storied NY courses... VCP, Bowdoin, Sunken Meadow. Some of the toughest courses in the country and they produce all-Americans for a reason....
NY XC wrote:
DougC wrote:
Newbury Park and other top teams are racing at RunningLane on 12/4… should be a fun meet on a very fast course.
That's the problem, since when did cross country become about fast races. We might as well just watch these guys race on the track with some of these courses down south and out west. Real cross country courses shouldn't be fast, take a look at some of the storied NY courses... VCP, Bowdoin, Sunken Meadow. Some of the toughest courses in the country and they produce all-Americans for a reason....
They could also go to Holmdel in NJ or a few courses in Pennsylvania or Maryland. There's enough great competition and plenty of challenging courses.
Actually, the Manhattan XC Invite HAS hosted California Prep Teams in the Past. I remember seeing El Toro run there in the late 90's as well as Great Oak participating in Eastern States in 2013 I think. I also think Palos Verdes ran there in the early 2010's because Miles Irish's Son was one of the top Runners at PV (Miles was an All American from Georgetown in the 80s).
When El Toro came across in (I think 1999), I asked one of their runners what he thought of VCP as a Tough Course. The response was along the lines of "This would only be a course of average difficulty in CA".
As to whether VCP is an extremely difficult course, I would say from looking at the Mt Sac Layout that terrain seems much more difficult. Remember, the first .75 mile at Vanny for the 5k is flat and so is the last half mile. Mt Sac seems to have a very daunting challenge on Switchback as well as Poop Out Hill.
IF (key word) NP decided to race at Manhattan, I believe at least their top 5 would go Sub 13:00 for the 2.5- especially if there were other Eastern powerhouses such as F-M, CBA, La Salle Academy, and Bishop Hendricken pushing them.
justthefacts wrote:
Actually, the Manhattan XC Invite HAS hosted California Prep Teams in the Past. I remember seeing El Toro run there in the late 90's as well as Great Oak participating in Eastern States in 2013 I think. I also think Palos Verdes ran there in the early 2010's because Miles Irish's Son was one of the top Runners at PV (Miles was an All American from Georgetown in the 80s).
When El Toro came across in (I think 1999), I asked one of their runners what he thought of VCP as a Tough Course. The response was along the lines of "This would only be a course of average difficulty in CA".
As to whether VCP is an extremely difficult course, I would say from looking at the Mt Sac Layout that terrain seems much more difficult. Remember, the first .75 mile at Vanny for the 5k is flat and so is the last half mile. Mt Sac seems to have a very daunting challenge on Switchback as well as Poop Out Hill.
IF (key word) NP decided to race at Manhattan, I believe at least their top 5 would go Sub 13:00 for the 2.5- especially if there were other Eastern powerhouses such as F-M, CBA, La Salle Academy, and Bishop Hendricken pushing them.
But the 4k course is what's run at Manhattan, and the course bottlenecks into a narrow climb within the first 600 meters at most. Not to mention the train track steps, the terrain at Manhattan for the 4k is no cake walk. And as far as Bowdoin park goes, you'd be hard pressed to find any stretch of flat land that isn't in the opening 400m off the race or the last stretch down the finish.
coach wrote:
NY XC wrote:
That's the problem, since when did cross country become about fast races. We might as well just watch these guys race on the track with some of these courses down south and out west. Real cross country courses shouldn't be fast, take a look at some of the storied NY courses... VCP, Bowdoin, Sunken Meadow. Some of the toughest courses in the country and they produce all-Americans for a reason....
They could also go to Holmdel in NJ or a few courses in Pennsylvania or Maryland. There's enough great competition and plenty of challenging courses.
Agreed, I only spoke to the legitimacy of those courses because those are the ones we frequently race at.
NY XC wrote:
coach wrote:
They could also go to Holmdel in NJ or a few courses in Pennsylvania or Maryland. There's enough great competition and plenty of challenging courses.
Agreed, I only spoke to the legitimacy of those courses because those are the ones we frequently race at.
My point is that there are so many real XC courses around the metropolitan NY area. VCP, as you know, is just one of many so one doesnt need to travel to race in spikes up and down hills.
The Harrier magazine used to rate courses and their level of difficulty. No one suggested that VCP is a very hard course. It's easy compared to many Pennsylvania and some Maryland courses. VCP has 100 years of history.
justthefacts wrote:
Actually, the Manhattan XC Invite HAS hosted California Prep Teams in the Past. I remember seeing El Toro run there in the late 90's as well as Great Oak participating in Eastern States in 2013 I think. I also think Palos Verdes ran there in the early 2010's because Miles Irish's Son was one of the top Runners at PV (Miles was an All American from Georgetown in the 80s).
When El Toro came across in (I think 1999), I asked one of their runners what he thought of VCP as a Tough Course. The response was along the lines of "This would only be a course of average difficulty in CA".
As to whether VCP is an extremely difficult course, I would say from looking at the Mt Sac Layout that terrain seems much more difficult. Remember, the first .75 mile at Vanny for the 5k is flat and so is the last half mile. Mt Sac seems to have a very daunting challenge on Switchback as well as Poop Out Hill.
IF (key word) NP decided to race at Manhattan, I believe at least their top 5 would go Sub 13:00 for the 2.5- especially if there were other Eastern powerhouses such as F-M, CBA, La Salle Academy, and Bishop Hendricken pushing them.
I asked a Wyoming HS XC coach that same question when they used to race at VCP. They didnt find it that hard either.
justthefacts wrote:
IF (key word) NP decided to race at Manhattan, I believe at least their top 5 would go Sub 13:00 for the 2.5- especially if there were other Eastern powerhouses such as F-M, CBA, La Salle Academy, and Bishop Hendricken pushing them.
FM's guys suck this year. CBA is also way down. They aren't pushing the likes of Corning, forget about NP.
NP would go wayyyy under 13. I'm sure their top 5 would run 12:10 at the slowest. The winner usually runs around 12:15-12:20 and they're better than most of those guys. Also, Corning is the best team in NY without a doubt but it's just because NY sucks this year. Very solid team but outside of NY none of the teams in here compete with the strong teams in other states. Manhattan isn't a hard course either. You have to get out hard but both times I've gone I've passed the most runners using the downhill which the whole second half of the course is. Bowdoin is a real and tough course though.
NY XC wrote:
DougC wrote:
Newbury Park and other top teams are racing at RunningLane on 12/4… should be a fun meet on a very fast course.
That's the problem, since when did cross country become about fast races. We might as well just watch these guys race on the track with some of these courses down south and out west. Real cross country courses shouldn't be fast, take a look at some of the storied NY courses... VCP, Bowdoin, Sunken Meadow. Some of the toughest courses in the country and they produce all-Americans for a reason....
What you taking about? This course is Northern California. Don’t tell me that any northeast course can be that much tougher than Crystal Springs. Those of us that have run this course know how hard it is.
http://lynbrooksports.prepcaltrack.com/ATHLETICS/XC/crybook.htmNP vs me!! wrote:
NP would go wayyyy under 13. I'm sure their top 5 would run 12:10 at the slowest. The winner usually runs around 12:15-12:20 and they're better than most of those guys. Also, Corning is the best team in NY without a doubt but it's just because NY sucks this year. Very solid team but outside of NY none of the teams in here compete with the strong teams in other states. Manhattan isn't a hard course either. You have to get out hard but both times I've gone I've passed the most runners using the downhill which the whole second half of the course is. Bowdoin is a real and tough course though.
Ha Ha Ha - 12:10 average. They won’t be close to that. I’ll take that bet.
NP vs me!! wrote:
NP would go wayyyy under 13. I'm sure their top 5 would run 12:10 at the slowest. The winner usually runs around 12:15-12:20 and they're better than most of those guys. Also, Corning is the best team in NY without a doubt but it's just because NY sucks this year. Very solid team but outside of NY none of the teams in here compete with the strong teams in other states. Manhattan isn't a hard course either. You have to get out hard but both times I've gone I've passed the most runners using the downhill which the whole second half of the course is. Bowdoin is a real and tough course though.
12:10? Idk about that. Their top 4 would be around there but their 5th would be back closer to 13:00. Probably a bit better than 2014 FM boys, maybe a 12:20 average. NY and the whole Northeast definitely does suck this year though. This Corning team would've gotten smoked by their 2017 and 2016 teams (as of now, they could improve ofc), and they didn't win regionals either of those years.
trappist wrote:
Since there will be no NXN why not invite Newbury Park to compete against the best in NYS and the Northeast? Records will fall.
Most ridiculous idea ever!!!
Expose Leo and Lex to the most depraved of ethnic covid germs?
Expose good California kids to a Mafioso infested city of sin?
Expose good rich kids to angry people who say nyawk and think they are actually saying New York?
No!
I hate New York and New Yorkers because they are everything a nice kid from Ventura County would not ever want to be around.
They would have covid coughing shills in the cheering areas to infect runners clandestinely because East coast people are dreadfully evil.
For that reason...NEVER New York anything for Newbury Park