If the Team Postal story taught us anything it is that passing drug tests has nothing to do with not doping. Al Sal is dirty and his athletes are dirty, they are just dirty in a way that isn't detectable just like the cycling team.
It will all come out eventually.
Yusef Scumm. wrote:
rekrunner wrote:
I think you should educate yourself on what the tampering charge really is, and what is on the banned substance list.
You’re mincing words, boot licker.
The report has been handed down and upheld. The wording clearly states why Shady Al will not tarnish the sport any longer.
I know I can buy L- carnitine at the local food store. I remember in the 80s, it was touted as a fat burner by the bodybuilding community. Lies…..
Maybe the key is injecting it? Either way, the powers that be have spoken and your disgraced idol is finished. Ha. Ha.
You started by asking questions to which apparently you already predetermined you knew the answers.
We aren’t disagreeing on the opinions, but you are just getting the facts wrong.
The CAS announcement didn’t go into details, so I’m going off the AAA Panel report 2 years ago.
Salazar sent an email, instructing his athletes that when asked if they had infusions, to say no, because, according to Salazar, the L-Carnitine infusions are really injections. USADA argued that that was tampering, and won.
L-Carnitine is incidental. What the WADA code cares about in this tampering charge is that Salazar sent an email with instructions, attempting to tamper with the doping control process. What the WADA code cares about with infusions is a limit of 50ml of any liquid, regardless of contents, over a 6-hour period (not given in the ordinary course of medical need or trauma). This is because cyclists used it often to thin their blood before blood tests. What the WADA code does not care about is ingesting L-Carnitine, in any amount, that doesn’t involve a banned method.
What is tragic about the email:
- The infusions were really infusions
- The distinction between infusions and injections does not matter — both are subject to the same WADA limit
- (Allegedly) no athlete was ever asked about infusions by a DCO — no process was actually tampered
- Nevertheless, sending an email fits the criteria of attempted tampering and results in a nominal 2-year penalty.
According to the WADA code defintions of “doping” and “intentional”, Salazar is considered by the WADA code as an “intentional doper” for sending an email which had no impact.
But I will correct myself. I was actually wrong to say nobody cares — Salazar cared a great deal about the potential performance effects of this completely WADA legal amino acid.
AS was using experimenting and testing drugs ... That's enough , why are you defending this piece of horse sh..
Testo-massage to test for tampering = nandro-pork in my carne burrito that I didn't even finish cuz it was greasy
I mean, come on....
just like lance, there was / is a preponderance of 'evidence' of doping around al sal. So they took whatever they could get hold of, including making hobbby joggers athletes (i have an athletes UK number for christs sake, so i suppose i am an athlete - who knew) and threw the book at him, hoping other cracks would form, like with lance.
as someone says, they havent.
so far.
but the rats are leaving.........
Jacob Ollsen wrote:
AS was using experimenting and testing drugs ... That's enough , why are you defending this piece of horse sh..
Defending?
I thought I was just repeating the known facts about Salazar’s low testosterone condition/prescription, about anti-doping’s view on L-Carnitine, and known details about the Tampering finding, clarifying obvious errors in understanding, as posters were getting it wrong.
If you think any of my statements are not factual, please correct the facts (e.g. I hadn’t seen that CAS also found “possession” and was corrected on that point.)
rekrunner wrote:
If you think any of my statements are not factual, please correct the facts (e.g. I hadn’t seen that CAS also found “possession” and was corrected on that point.)
I recall that Tara originally lied about her injections, and then later backtracked. Not sure about the timing of Salazar's tampering email.
I am curious though what happened to the evidence that USADA claimed to have about her and Rupp and others to have used that forbidden method, see for example:
https://www.letsrun.com/news/2017/05/usada-appears-highly-likely-6-nop-athletes-including-galen-rupp-dathan-ritzenhein-violated-anti-doping-rules/USADA presents strong evidence that all of the Nike Oregon Project runners that received L-carnitine injections from Dr. Brown – Dathan Ritzenhein, Galen Rupp, Tara Edrmann (now Welling), Lindsay Allen, Alvina Begay, and Dawn Grunnagle – committed anti-doping violations
It seems they didn't present that to CAS, for whatever reason.
Update: The ban is still in effect.
I expect similar findings tomorrow.
#TeamCarnitine
Wasn't the "testosterone" medication something like "Testo Boost" or similar like EPO Boost?
In the UK, Athletics Weekly used to regularly advertise "EPO Boost", which was basically an iron supplement and completely legal...
Hobbling wrote:
Wasn't the "testosterone" medication something like "Testo Boost" or similar like EPO Boost?
In the UK, Athletics Weekly used to regularly advertise "EPO Boost", which was basically an iron supplement and completely legal...
It wasn’t “testosterone.” It was pharma grade testosterone. Delivered by the doctor who was also banned, Dr. Brown.
Fun facts: Salazar is still banned. Brown is the color of poo.
Yusef Scumm. wrote:
rekrunner wrote:
This is probably the most important confirmation.
The totality of evidence collected came from 30+ witnesses — current and former NOP employees and athlete, thousands of emails and documents.
This confirmation of no NOP athletes found doping comes from the prosecutor USADA, and was confirmed by the AAA Panel and again by CAS.
After 5 years of investigation, 2 years of prosecution, and 2 years of appeal, there is simply no basis in evidence or fact to accuse any NOP athlete of any doping.
The only thing (slightly) wrong with your post is that no one cares about L-carnitine. This only became a problem because it was mixed with too much liquid, and too much liquid infused in a short time frame is banned, with or without L-carnitine.
Another thing wrong in other posts in other threads, is this misplaced focus on TUEs — NOP didn’t use that many TUEs, because they didn’t need to, and in any case, TUEs are WADA legal for many banned substances in specified cases.
Lol…. This is the same response another poster wrote earlier in the thread.
I’ll ask you the same question: If the testosterone, carnitine, etc Salazar was banned for wasn’t for his athletes, who was it for? You don’t need that much for “testing” as he claimed.
The testosterone was for him self and and he admitted testing with Magness . The Carnatine wasn’t an issue,the delivery method was the issue. The drip could have been carnitine or doctor pepper , doesn’t matter . No athletes were found to do anything wrong period.
wazzu1452 wrote:
It's a simple question
Who has had more runners fail drug tests?
BOWERMAN
or
NOP
Bowerman!
Love how nobody wanted to answer this
David Loyd wrote:
Yusef Scumm. wrote:
Lol…. This is the same response another poster wrote earlier in the thread.
I’ll ask you the same question: If the testosterone, carnitine, etc Salazar was banned for wasn’t for his athletes, who was it for? You don’t need that much for “testing” as he claimed.
The testosterone was for him self and and he admitted testing with Magness . The Carnatine wasn’t an issue,the delivery method was the issue. The drip could have been carnitine or doctor pepper , doesn’t matter . No athletes were found to do anything wrong period.
Not true. There’s a section of the document that lists all of the athletes that were likely using carnitine illegally. They just weren’t officially caught. Probably on test too.
Don’t forget that shady passport from Rupp*
DorkyDinkles wrote:
wazzu1452 wrote:
It's a simple question
Who has had more runners fail drug tests?
BOWERMAN
or
NOP
Bowerman!
Love how nobody wanted to answer this
No one wanted to answer it because it is not relevant . The fact that Shelby tested positive says nothing about the Salazar case. And it is not as if there are troves of people who are defending Shelby and going after Salazar. Maybe some are, but the overwhelming consensus on this message board is that she is obviously guilty. So I am not certain what the point of the BTC / NOP comparison is.
DorkyDinkles wrote:
wazzu1452 wrote:
It's a simple question
Who has had more runners fail drug tests?
BOWERMAN
or
NOP
Bowerman!
Love how nobody wanted to answer this
Of course no one wants to talk about this.
Salazar Athletes PASSED every single test they were presented with. Every one!
It reduces these idiots to saying things like;
"Back in 2009, Salazar reportable rubbed testosterone on Rupp. I heard it from my sorority sister's friend."
All of the 'evidence' against Salazar is circumstantial and hearsay.
And he is 'banned' for life by SafeSport which is a total joke. SafeSport is a total joke. I just took the training as part of my USATF training.
It's two hours of "Don't sexually abuse kids."
Nothing to do with Salazar or "Safesport."
But hey, back to "And then Rupp averaged 10 hours of sleep a day and once drank a Red Bull."
So Pathetic.........
wazzu1452 wrote:
DorkyDinkles wrote:
Bowerman!
Love how nobody wanted to answer this
Of course no one wants to talk about this.
Salazar Athletes PASSED every single test they were presented with. Every one!
It reduces these idiots to saying things like;
"Back in 2009, Salazar reportable rubbed testosterone on Rupp. I heard it from my sorority sister's friend."
All of the 'evidence' against Salazar is circumstantial and hearsay.
And he is 'banned' for life by SafeSport which is a total joke. SafeSport is a total joke. I just took the training as part of my USATF training.
It's two hours of "Don't sexually abuse kids."
Nothing to do with Salazar or "Safesport."
But hey, back to "And then Rupp averaged 10 hours of sleep a day and once drank a Red Bull."
So Pathetic.........
He doped with testosterone as an athlete.
He had an athlete busted for doping with testosterone.
Rupp was on "testosterone medication" with debate as to what that means.
Salazar rubs testosterone on his family.
Salazar was found with needles and testosterone at a training camp by the trainer.
If this is what you think is "circumstantial" then you don't know the meaning of that word. He doped as an athlete and had an athlete popped for the same substance - these are facts.
A sucker is born every minute. That is what is pathetic.
Update: The ban is still in effect.
I expect similar findings tomorrow.
#TeamAlRubsCreamOnRelatives
YOU
RUPP "He doped with testosterone as an athlete."
ME
Rupp is the most tested USA T&F Athlete. He has passed EVERY drug test every administered to him. This is a FACT!
The reason we know Ted Bundy killed 15 people is that we have the BODIES! We have the corpses.
Shelby Houlihan failed a test (we know that). We know Bowerman had had more athletes test positive than NOP ever had.
What do the anti - NOP idiots have?
2002 document stating that Rupp was “presently on prednisone and testosterone medication.”
GASP! OMG! BIGGEST STORY EVER!!
Salazar literally admitted to doping with testosterone as an athlete. That's a fact. One of many that I mentioned that you don't care about because you are one of those suckers born every minute. You thought I was talking about Rupp because you are hysterical.
under a bridge wrote:
Salazar literally admitted to doping with testosterone as an athlete. That's a fact. One of many that I mentioned that you don't care about because you are one of those suckers born every minute. You thought I was talking about Rupp because you are hysterical.
You case against NOP would be bolstered dramatically if you could provide tangible evidence.
"Back in 2006, Galen Rupp, while drinking a Slurpee and riding his Big Wheel..."
A failed drug test - just ONE - by any NOP athlete would help your argument.
Salazar coached many many great athletes and NONE of them have EVER failed a drug test.
But you know this.........
