Ad Hocker Teare List wrote:
proudpoppa wrote:
HI Mr. Barker! Your daughter sure is fast!!
You have no idea how fast this is. This is national prep running news worthy. Some very good boys team in this meet and she would have finished 36th place amongst the boys overall.
San Clemente boys only had 5 boys in front of her and they might be a top 20 team in the country.
Sub 16 5k would be likely on the right course.
So, the fastest girl ever I guess? I think Woodbridge will tell the real story.
What were her 1500 and 3000 times? You can share them with an asterisk since they are secondhand 😊. That Laguna Hills course was hilly, so it would be interesting to compare to something flat.
What do the course records list look like on this course? I’d be interested in seeing how the result compares to some CA legends
FastTuohy wrote:
Ad Hocker Teare List wrote:
You have no idea how fast this is. This is national prep running news worthy. Some very good boys team in this meet and she would have finished 36th place amongst the boys overall.
San Clemente boys only had 5 boys in front of her and they might be a top 20 team in the country.
Sub 16 5k would be likely on the right course.
So, the fastest girl ever I guess? I think Woodbridge will tell the real story.
When are we all going to stop paying attention to fast times put up by hs freshman girls?
Ok I read the article. She beat the course by 10secs which was previously set by Brianna bartello. Bartello looks to have been a competitive runner in her district but barely broke 18 at mt sac & ran just under 5 for mile. Still very promising for someone so new to the sport
OozmaKappa wrote:
Leftist logic dictates we check her testosterone levels otherwise we're unfairly targetting African athletes.
Thank you for my daily treat of laughing at conservatives. You guys are so petrified every second of every day you can't enter one thread without wobbling, no matter the subject matter.
Engelhardt ran a minute faster just recently as a freshman. Still a good time though.
fanagan wrote:
What do the course records list look like on this course? I’d be interested in seeing how the result compares to some CA legends
It looks like Bethan Knights won the race in 2013 in a time of 17:36 as a senior. She went on that year to win her race at Mt Sac in 16:59 and then won the CIF Div III title in a time of 17:08 at Woodward and finished her year with a 36th place at NXN.
Noah Hansen wrote:
Engelhardt ran a minute faster just recently as a freshman. Still a good time though.
Sure, but Engelhardt has been training for a while and has run a lot of races against top competition. Really, one race doesn't mean anything yet but Holly is certainly someone to keep an eye on.
Video of the race yet? Englehardt video as well?
Just some numbers that may be of interest:
16:59.2 - Holly Barker at Laguna Hills
15:59.9 - Sadie Engelhardt at Cool Breeze
Twenty girls that raced at both races: Diff = time difference in seconds
Laguna - Cool Bz -- Diff --- Girl Runner
20:30.5 - 19:40.7 -- 49.8 --- Amelia Kang - 12 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
20:32.0 - 19:27.7 -- 64.3 --- Sarah Bendzick - 9 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
21:09.3 - 20:17.7 -- 51.6 --- Coco Johnson - 9 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
21:27.5 - 19:57.8 -- 89.7 --- Ali Botuchis - 11 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
21:38.9 - 20:50.4 -- 48.5 --- Maddie Bendzick - 11 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
22:17.9 - 21:00.4 -- 77.5 --- Emma Noriega - 12 - Rancho Verde (SS)
22:31.5 - 21:05.5 -- 86.0 --- Alyssa Rangel Esparza - 12 - Rancho Verde (SS)
18:44.5 - 18:11.2 -- 33.3 --- Isabel Rosales - 10 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
20:19.4 - 19:15.8 -- 63.6 --- Josephine Bennetts - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
20:55.2 - 19:22.1 -- 93.1 --- Hannah Butler - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
21:01.0 - 20:12.3 -- 48.7 --- Ashley Glenn - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
21:11.7 - 20:09.9 -- 61.8 --- Kyana Cook - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
21:57.0 - 20:04.3 -- 112.7 -- Kaiya Archard - 11 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
22:51.1 - 20:09.8 -- 161.3 -- Madison Decker - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
22:28.0 - 20:31.3 -- 116.7 -- Lexi Wynne - 12 - Tesoro (SS)
21:12.5 - 19:08.5 -- 124.0 -- Margaret Moffitt - 10 - Woodbridge (SS)
21:54.6 - 20:48.6 -- 66.0 --- Brooke Welton - 11 - Woodbridge (SS)
22:18.5 - 20:03.5 -- 135.0 -- Mia Washida - 12 - Woodbridge (SS)
22:52.5 - 21:07.7 -- 104.8 -- Safaa Al Maubasher - 12 - Woodbridge (SS)
23:52.3 - 21:07.6 -- 164.7 -- Samantha Trimmer - 12 - Woodbridge (SS)
Median = 81.75 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
Average = 87.66 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
Throwing out possible outliers (too much of a difference):
Median = 60 - 63 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
And Both race distances are miles (supposedly).
BMeylan wrote:
Throwing out possible outliers (too much of a difference):
Median = 60 - 63 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
And Both race distances are miles (supposedly).
Nice sleuthing. So they are very much on the same level, it seems.
Interesting - so maybe around a minute difference between the courses. Also have to consider Engelhardt has put in a lot more training and has more racing experience.
jonesy22 wrote:
Sham 69 wrote:
Wth Oozma?
I want to see her race against Sadie Engelhardt.
Sadie, also a freshman, just broke 16 minutes for 3 miles.
Both Laguna and Ventura are shown in the rated section at Woodbridge, while Mira Costa is in the sweepstakes.
Sadie Engelhardt listed as an individual in the sweepstakes. Laguna Hills coach needs to move Barker to the sweeps.
Something I want to chip in here is that it isn't really that reasonable at this meet to compare times within the meet. What I mean is that the weather is CONSIDERABLY warmer for the juniors and seniors than for the freshmen. At 7:45 for Holly's race it was good weather, but by 10 and 11 am it is a different story, and with the hills it makes for considerably slower times as the heat and hills compound upon each other. (Even if they don't actually compound physically, they seem to psychologically.) So I think which race the girls at Laguna were in would be important, and Barker might've run 30+ seconds slower if she'd been in the senior race. I'm not sure what the race times or conditions were at Cool Breeze.
This also means that it may not be completely fair to compare her times to the boys in the same meet who were running hours later in the day when the air temps were much higher and the sunlight much more directly overhead.
Also, the course in 2013 and before that was different, though I'd say it used to be a little easier back then, actually.
I won't post the supposed times for the 3k and 1500m because they were fast enough that people here will either say I am or that person is lying/laughably mistaken or they'll start questioning her or her coach about why she did that. Basically I know these forums enough that I think they'll bring more negativity her way than positive statements, so why post the supposed times?
But obviously I thought her race Sat. was impressive. "When are we all going to stop paying attention to fast times put up by hs freshman girls?" Why not? It was a surprising and fun performance. I'm not saying she's the next great phenom, but that it was fun to watch and hear about. Maybe you had to be there. After literally 200m of the race two guys from another school saw her lead, her pace, and her effort and said something like, "She's going to come back in the 3rd mile!" Knowing it was a freshman race they were figuring she was, like many freshman, going way to fast for herself in the first 200m of her first race. Normally they would've been right. This year the joke was on them. That's what made it fun. Who cares if she wins a medal someday? She made the sport fun and interesting for everyone who saw her race. That's as much of what the sport is about as is bragging rights for a country because of a world/Olympic medal. (And if you don't care, why read the post and reply?)
Barker's 3000 time at a regional AAU qualifier this summer in the 15-16 age group was 10:02. Even if she's slightly older for an average freshman, that's super fast either way.
Cheetah wrote:
Something I want to chip in here is that it isn't really that reasonable at this meet to compare times within the meet. What I mean is that the weather is CONSIDERABLY warmer for the juniors and seniors than for the freshmen. At 7:45 for Holly's race it was good weather, but by 10 and 11 am it is a different story, and with the hills it makes for considerably slower times as the heat and hills compound upon each other. (Even if they don't actually compound physically, they seem to psychologically.) So I think which race the girls at Laguna were in would be important, and Barker might've run 30+ seconds slower if she'd been in the senior race. I'm not sure what the race times or conditions were at Cool Breeze.
This also means that it may not be completely fair to compare her times to the boys in the same meet who were running hours later in the day when the air temps were much higher and the sunlight much more directly overhead.
Also, the course in 2013 and before that was different, though I'd say it used to be a little easier back then, actually.
I won't post the supposed times for the 3k and 1500m because they were fast enough that people here will either say I am or that person is lying/laughably mistaken or they'll start questioning her or her coach about why she did that. Basically I know these forums enough that I think they'll bring more negativity her way than positive statements, so why post the supposed times?
But obviously I thought her race Sat. was impressive. "When are we all going to stop paying attention to fast times put up by hs freshman girls?" Why not? It was a surprising and fun performance. I'm not saying she's the next great phenom, but that it was fun to watch and hear about. Maybe you had to be there. After literally 200m of the race two guys from another school saw her lead, her pace, and her effort and said something like, "She's going to come back in the 3rd mile!" Knowing it was a freshman race they were figuring she was, like many freshman, going way to fast for herself in the first 200m of her first race. Normally they would've been right. This year the joke was on them. That's what made it fun. Who cares if she wins a medal someday? She made the sport fun and interesting for everyone who saw her race. That's as much of what the sport is about as is bragging rights for a country because of a world/Olympic medal. (And if you don't care, why read the post and reply?)
Anything to promote our sport is good. I love it.
If this inspires other girls across the United States to take up XC this fall and track in the spring, it'll be worth it.
Cheetah wrote:
Well, I meant her first cross country race. It is her school's invitational and they had someone working the 1 mile mark. He told me she did run a 3k and a 1500 in the summer, but I'm not sure if that was a time trial or what, and I'm not even sure if that's true, so I won't report the times he told me. But he made it sound like while her dad was pretty fast back in the day (late 70s), she wasn't a runner before this summer. Played soccer.
I'm not sure what the creepy creeper is about.
I didn't know they had 3k races for HS kids? Usually MS runs 2 mile and HS runs 5k, at least in the great state of Ohio.
BMeylan wrote:
Just some numbers that may be of interest:
16:59.2 - Holly Barker at Laguna Hills
15:59.9 - Sadie Engelhardt at Cool Breeze
Twenty girls that raced at both races: Diff = time difference in seconds
Laguna - Cool Bz -- Diff --- Girl Runner
20:30.5 - 19:40.7 -- 49.8 --- Amelia Kang - 12 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
20:32.0 - 19:27.7 -- 64.3 --- Sarah Bendzick - 9 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
21:09.3 - 20:17.7 -- 51.6 --- Coco Johnson - 9 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
21:27.5 - 19:57.8 -- 89.7 --- Ali Botuchis - 11 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
21:38.9 - 20:50.4 -- 48.5 --- Maddie Bendzick - 11 - St. Margaret's Episcopal
22:17.9 - 21:00.4 -- 77.5 --- Emma Noriega - 12 - Rancho Verde (SS)
22:31.5 - 21:05.5 -- 86.0 --- Alyssa Rangel Esparza - 12 - Rancho Verde (SS)
18:44.5 - 18:11.2 -- 33.3 --- Isabel Rosales - 10 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
20:19.4 - 19:15.8 -- 63.6 --- Josephine Bennetts - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
20:55.2 - 19:22.1 -- 93.1 --- Hannah Butler - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
21:01.0 - 20:12.3 -- 48.7 --- Ashley Glenn - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
21:11.7 - 20:09.9 -- 61.8 --- Kyana Cook - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
21:57.0 - 20:04.3 -- 112.7 -- Kaiya Archard - 11 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
22:51.1 - 20:09.8 -- 161.3 -- Madison Decker - 12 - Murrieta Valley (SS)
22:28.0 - 20:31.3 -- 116.7 -- Lexi Wynne - 12 - Tesoro (SS)
21:12.5 - 19:08.5 -- 124.0 -- Margaret Moffitt - 10 - Woodbridge (SS)
21:54.6 - 20:48.6 -- 66.0 --- Brooke Welton - 11 - Woodbridge (SS)
22:18.5 - 20:03.5 -- 135.0 -- Mia Washida - 12 - Woodbridge (SS)
22:52.5 - 21:07.7 -- 104.8 -- Safaa Al Maubasher - 12 - Woodbridge (SS)
23:52.3 - 21:07.6 -- 164.7 -- Samantha Trimmer - 12 - Woodbridge (SS)
Median = 81.75 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
Average = 87.66 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
Throwing out possible outliers (too much of a difference):
Median = 60 - 63 seconds faster at Cool Breeze
And Both race distances are miles (supposedly).
You are way to invested in a girl's high school sport.
Jakob Ingebrigtsen has a 1989 Ferrari 348 GTB and he's just put in paperwork to upgrade it
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
Strava thinks the London Marathon times improved 12 minutes last year thanks to supershoes
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?
Mark Coogan says that if you could only do 3 workouts as a 1500m runner you should do these
Am I living in the twilight zone? The Boston Marathon weather was terrible!
Move over Mark Coogan, Rojo and John Kellogg share their 3 favorite mile workouts