We need to rethink how to develop distance running talent in the US. I am depressed watching US stink up the Olympics

here we go again...

if it were strictly a numbers and resources game then china would be mixing it up in every track event.

yes, some east africans have doped. guess what? so have a lot of white people. if i were putting together a cross country team and i could pluck fresh, undeveloped talent from anywhere in the world you best believe i would be going straight to the rift valley.

galen rupp shows that the only way you're gonna get a white person to mix it up with the EA runners is to literally treat them like a science experiment from age 16 onward.

1) go back and watch rio- 800 (bronze), 1500 (gold), 3k st (silver), 5k (silver), marathon (bronze)

2) best steeple guy out

3) best 800 guy out

4) marathon 5k and 1500 have not even been run yet

The talent pool isn't 332 million though, is it? 40% of Americans are obese.

If you want to compete with doped up athletes the only answer is to dope. And when one of ours gets caught everyone raises hell. Yes doping is the only way to beat dopers. You don't think the African runners dominating the distances are doped to the gills? And all sprinters?

From 2004 to August 2018, 138 Kenyan athletes tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs, according to a WADA report published in September 2018.

"Notable names on the list of Kenyan runners currently banned include the 2016 Olympic women's marathon champion Jemima Sumgong and former world marathon record holder Wilson Kipsang. The 2011, 2013 and 2015 world 1500 metres gold medallist Asbel Kiprop is also banned, as is Elijah Manangoi, who succeeded him in 2017"

Maybe it's time to just shut down track and field or allow everyone to dope.

Man I got some bad news for you because there’s a pretty clear answer but nobody on this website likes it…

track and field is not a priority in our country. The majority of our best athletes are swallowed up by basketball and football for the men. Soccer, basketball and instaTHOTing for the ladies.

Also, our best coach, one of the best in the world, is ostracized and basically kicked out of the sport for saying mean things.

sinking wrote:

The talent pool isn't 332 million though, is it? 40% of Americans are obese.

40% obese and how many more are just over weight?

My high school class of 60-some students in the mid-80's had one male student who was obese and one female student was obese. I would guess that only a handful more were overweight but not obese. Now everywhere I look people are obese. I did become obese after college and got up to 230 lb before I reduced calorie intake and exercised daily. Now I weigh 160 and run marathons.

I wonder what the obesity rate is for Kenya, Ethiopia, Morocco, and other countries that are earning more medals than their population size would predict.

One really has to love running in the USA to pursue it at the collegiate and professional level. Football, basketball, and baseball is were the TV money and salaries are at in the USA at least for the men.

BekeleKip wrote:

We should be winning gold in every single middle and long distance events. The probabilities that this can happen with a population of 332 million are too high for this not to happen. We need to strive for excellence and not just "happy to be here" BS.

Track & Field is not the priority for the vast majority of the 322 million citizens here.

Simple as that.

Cerutty called us fat and lazy 60 years ago. Young athletes do not go out for our sport.

Just off the top of my head:

The first place to start is the idea that NCAA and US Trials are the be all end all. Our very promising athletes train for these two events only, while global athletes focus on global championships.

2. The NCAA's business model is broken. In global championship years, qualifying for and doing well at global championships must come first. Not some NCAA championships that mean absolutely nothing in the long run.

3. We need to figure out how to ensure those who qualify for a global championship maintain their fitness for the global championships. How do the Jamaicans run just as fast or faster at global championships as they did during their trials, while our athletes run substantially slower? Clearly peaking is an issue.

4. We need to identify exceptionally athletes with potential and properly groom them. Not send them to go thru the grind of the NCAA championships where their most promising years are destroyed by the college/grind.

There are not a lot of kids with the talent and commitment needed for the US to be competitive over the the critical phase of these negative split races that require good speed to finish. The Ingebrigtsens have given a blueprint on how to do this but not many want their kids to specialized as as distance runner at 8 yo -10 yo, especially given other, more lucrative options.

There is still scant support for post-college development of our runners. So even if someone is talented and wants to train it's challenging to make a living as a runner.

Also, as much as people want to dump on Brooks Johnson, he had it right that if you don't have the speed to run the last 400m in a low 50 sec male/ low 60-sub 60 sec female then you are probably going to be off the podium.

You should watch the swimming events instead. You will be a happier person.

BekeleKip wrote:

I am biased as US runner but we should have world records from the 800m to the 10000m. We should be winning gold in every single middle and long distance events. The probabilities that this can happen with a population of 332 million are too high for this not to happen. We need to strive for excellence and not just "happy to be here" BS.

We have the largest farm system in the world with highschool athletes, USATF, etc... yet we still suck at championship meets. We have the best facilities. The biggest budgets. Best social media presence to attract more athletes. The best olympic kits (as shown by multiple US athletes on Youtube). Much larger pool to pluck talent. Best everything but results in races that matter.

We just don't have the depth in the few events we have a shot.

Why don't YOU show em how it's done?

The original Mammoth group, coached by Larsen and Vigil, proved it could be done with that model. Hansons replicated that model with slight tweaks and decent success though that's apparently all in the past now. NOP replicated that model with slight tweaks and better success. Bowerman and NAZ Elite replicated that model with slight tweaks and decent success. USATF stopped giving that model the active support that they used to with the Team USA concept after Sydney.

Ultimately, it depends on the efficacy of developing PED testing.

There is a ton of talent out there, it's just that there are too many diversions and a lot of people don't want to work that hard. Coaches like Harry Johnson, Bob Newland etc proved that if you know what you're doing in recognizing talent and know how to talk to athletes, you can get them on board and produce awesome results on the high school level, which translates to better performance and enthusiasm all the way down the line.

Americans forget to do one simple thing - train for the race conditions.

Everyone knew how hot and humid Tokyo was going to be but I don't think anyone put in a training block in south Florida or Texas.

Didn't Frank Shorter live and train in Gainesville, FL during his marathon career?

Also, all those scrub 48-50 second 400 meter runners that clutter up college meets need to think about their distance potential.

That's the speed needed to finish distance races at the global level. I'm sure there's American 400m runners that are really distance runners in disguise.