Road Racing & Training Thread - Week Ending 6/6/2021

notarobot - Awesome 5K execution! Man, that sounds like a dream scenario.

HHW - It's good to see someone use MAF as an easy day target rather than an End All Be All. Personally I find that Low HR target days always leave my legs feeling fresh even on days when I have to speed up to get up to and maintain the target HR.

Thanks. Let me tell you though... MAF HR was not designed for the summer. I could be meditating out there and still be out of compliance.

highhoppingworm wrote:

Thanks. Let me tell you though... MAF HR was not designed for the summer. I could be meditating out there and still be out of compliance.

Hahaha, ain't that the truth! Low HR training in the summer is very slow going!

BHViking - Congrats on the masters win! Based on those power splits it looks like you measured your effort pretty well.

RunnerSam: Congrats on the race. I hope you do share your notes.

BHViking: Spectacular! Podium! I think we all understand what you mean by maybe not running the race very well, but the result is more than pretty good. Really well done. Reading a race report I could feel the joy! Thanks for sharing that. And although I hope your foot feels better, it's nice to have some company while icing! 🥶

OR: Well done! I'm glad to hear your knees are complying. Treat them well; don't piss them off! You'd hate to have another rebellion on your hands.

RRR: Hair of the dog, then eye of the tiger.

HHW: OOhhhhmmmmmm. That's what I was wondering when you said you were going to do this during the summer months. I have experience with this and my conclusion was that it is not a beneficial way for me to train here during the summer months. You know the answer to the question that gets asked all the time about "how slow is too slow?" It's always something like "if you're changing your running stride significantly." That was me. I persisted for the time I had planned to... I didn't quit in the middle of my experiment... but I had definitely had had enough by the end of it. Anyway, I know it's just a fraction of what you're doing, but just thought I'd chime in FWIW.

BHViking- Congrats on the Master's win, great way to get back to racing. How's the foot?

OR- Nice to bounce back after the long layoff with a very respectable 5K! And thanks for the prayers.

darkwave- Thanks for your thoughts, as well. Hope you're enjoying a pre-marathon taper.

Coach Jeff- Do you have access to a track? A 1-mile time trial might be fun. Only takes a few minutes, right?!

notarobot - Fine racing, congrats! Despite the ancestral connection, I've never been to Tioga County, PA. Been to Corning many times, running Wineglass Marathon. And Ithaca was the site of my one-and-only DNF -- steeplechase at ICAC Championship Meet at Ithaca College. Ugh, wasn't pretty (but I did score points in the 10,000m that day, ha!)

Coach Jeff ROC, since the threads been a little slow lately I will spice it up with a race report. I normally don't go in depth with these things but it was a slow day at work earlier in the week.

Alright, Breaking the ice with a real race that I was totally unprepared for. For reference if I was in shape my 3k time would be around 9:50 and 5:40s would be 10k pace. But since Im not in shape and have just been doing mostly tempos @ 6 min pace and strides (or 200s) I figured 5:40s were about right (see tuesday workout).

This event is an open track races that a lot of high schoolers go to as it is a kind of meet of champs. It has 200 400 800 mile 3000 and 5000. 200/400 had about 50 people in each, 800 had about 100, 5k had around 60 and miles had about 200. So the 3k had 12 people signed up with massively varying seed times, from high 8min to 12 min (see below). Both male and female in the same races. I did a little snooping on the people close to my time and two of them I raced in the TTT 5k I ran a few weeks ago, beat one and lost to the other (same result as today), in that race they both went out super hard and died as many HS do. So I figured I would sit on the guys seeded right ahead of me then see what I could do the last lap.

Eight of us on the starting line, I was positioned 5th of 8 (three girls to the right of me). I figured perfect Ill let the guys go out hard and immediately go to the rail. Nope, the two guys seeded close/ahead of me go out slow and i get boxed in by the girls. Escaped from that at around 120m with a big move and just had two guys ahead of me obviously the quicker seeded ones. Came around 350m and realized I was going way too fast, like 7s too fast on the first lap. Can't look down on those high schoolers too much huh. I figured I would just focus on keeping solid form and turnover, after two laps I was really wishing it was a mile race but kept it going. Around lap 5 I gained a shadow but after a lap or so it went away (good motivation at least) I tried to keep the pace honest with some success and sped up some the last lap. Despite having two guys finish not too far behind it was a solo effort after about 200m. One of the two guys that started quick basically matched my pace but 80yds ahead so I did have some guidance on pace. The guy who finished right behind me ran his last lap 9 seconds faster than me but I was too far ahead for him to get me, though he did pass the guy behind me. I learned after that the seed times apparently meant nothing in this race (given I did some bad math or wrote mine in wrong as I wanted to be seeded at 10:33 not 10:26). All-in-all It was a fun race that im pretty happy with. Gets me excited to get in shape and run some real races, adjusted my 1 mile club TT seed time to 5:10 from 5:20 in two weeks after going out in 77 and not really feeling bad (initially) from it. Had a few other club members run the mile with success. Will look forward to this meet again next year, and the mile race later in the summer at the same track

My splits

1:59.38 1:24.96 1:26.06 1:26.82 1:28.31 1:28.48 1:25.16

(1:59.38) (3:24.33) (4:50.39) (6:17.20) (7:45.51) (9:13.99) (10:39.14)

Number - Seed - Result

1 - 8:36 - NS

2 - 9:18 - 10:25

3 - 9:30 - 9:59

4 - 10:00 - NS

5 - 10:18 - 10:44

6 - 10:23 - 10:48

7* - 10:26 - 10:39

8 - 10:55 - 12:33

9 - 10:58 - NS

10 - 11:02 - 10:57

11 - 12:00 - 11:17

12 - NT - NS

That's kind of where I was Coach Jeff but popped a note over to my coach and he said keep it at MAF... he doesn't care how slow it is and that I should forget any concerns about mucking things up mechanically.

Honestly it was a bit of a relief to hear that, I have been feeling a bit run down from the heat and I have some monster workouts coming up in the next few weeks. It helps that it is going to go down to the 50s/60s the next few days as well.

Coach Jeff - You hit the nail on the head—the last thing I need is another rebellion.

M42

PRs

18:05 11/20

38:03 3/18

1:23:52 11/18

2:58:49 3/21

M- 12 @8:06

T- 5.75 @7:08 (3.7 miles of 400m on 400m off), 1.85 cool down

W- 5.5 @9:04

T- 7 @7:43 (8x100m sintegrated strides)

F- 3.4 @8:47 elliptical

S- 5k race 18:49, +2.3 warm up/cool down

S- 32 easy ride

40.9 run

32 ride

Paced poorly for the race, wasn't mentally in it. Had one of the better masters in the state show up since it was a $ race. I did manage to get 3rd male overall so came home with $50.

HHW- solid week

HS sophmore- nice job on the TT!

Sub 6- impressive workouts

Darkwave- another solid week. Great pacing on last week's 10 miler as well.

Allen1959- sorry to hear about your brother.

Notarobot- congrats on the win!

Fatsos- good luck on the race this weekend!

BHViking- congrats! Impressive time!

Was able to sign up for my first in person race this week, so dropping in. I used to frequent the sub3 thread and that helped my training, so hopefully this thread will do the same.

Current prs:

800m: 2:14

5k: 18:30

10k: 39:30

Half: 1:29:30 (set in the first half of a marathon)

Marathon: 3:14

Goal race is a half marathon on oct 10, so roughly 17 weeks away.

Mileage this year has been:

Jan: 120k (had an arthritis flare about half way through the month)

Feb: 19k

Mar:63k

Apr:192k

May: 194k

Ran a 9.84k tt 2 weeks ago in 39:41 (short course) first half was around 3:50 pace with the second half closer to 4:10 pace. Given the lack of mileage, I was happy with the result as it was fairly close to my all time pr.

Plan at this point is to keep building up my mileage over the next 5 weeks and doing one Steve Magness sprint training progression a week and one proper workout (alternating between 20 min tempo and vo2 track work).

I then plan to follow pfitz 12 week half plan. Hopefully the 72-102k plan, but that will depend on what my mileage is built up to.

So, race this Saturday. I looked up entries, only 4 of us. Positive: room to run. Negative: one of the entrants is a mid-15 guy. The other 2 are a woman w/ 19-low PR, and unknown recreational runner. I think I have a shot at a podium? Either that or DFL... :)

RunnerSam Much appreciated! A little spice makes everything nice. Very cool!

HHW Coach is Nick Jenkins? I've been reading some of his blogs. Good stuff. I've become much more accepting of/resigned to the summer heat. It's just a thing. I think we fool ourselves a lot about getting stuff precisely right when it comes to training. I'm a "data" guy who has matured enough to know that numbers are not the narrative; it all happens within a context.

OR Peace, my friend.

Free_the_thigh: One of my favorite LRC registered names. How old are you? Your shorter race PRs beat mine, our half marathon PR is about the same (also as the first half of a marathon... (Boston... downhill...)) and I also dropped in a lot on that sub-three thread...

Coach Jeff ROC wrote:

Free_the_thigh: One of my favorite LRC registered names. How old are you? Your shorter race PRs beat mine, our half marathon PR is about the same (also as the first half of a marathon... (Boston... downhill...)) and I also dropped in a lot on that sub-three thread...

Thank you, I’m 25, so still have (hopefully) many years of prs in front of me. I’m guessing your full marathon time beats mine, what is it?

The only pr which is post covid is the 800m time (but It was my first 800 so it was always going to be a pr), but I feel like my base speed has really increased over this last year. Now I just need some new prs to prove it.

Nate Jenkins. I agree with your bigger point. Goal for remainder of 2021 is to be less of a head case.

You will never be the biggest head case on this thread!!

Free_the_thigh wrote:

Coach Jeff ROC wrote:

Free_the_thigh: One of my favorite LRC registered names. How old are you? Your shorter race PRs beat mine, our half marathon PR is about the same (also as the first half of a marathon... (Boston... downhill...)) and I also dropped in a lot on that sub-three thread...

Thank you, I’m 25, so still have (hopefully) many years of prs in front of me. I’m guessing your full marathon time beats mine, what is it?

The only pr which is post covid is the 800m time (but It was my first 800 so it was always going to be a pr), but I feel like my base speed has really increased over this last year. Now I just need some new prs to prove it.

3:12 high in that same race, with a huge positive split. So basically we're in the same marathon neighborhood...

...unless we "age grade" those results😏 (says the guy more than twice your age 😁).

Coach Jeff ROC wrote:

Free_the_thigh wrote:

Thank you, I’m 25, so still have (hopefully) many years of prs in front of me. I’m guessing your full marathon time beats mine, what is it?

The only pr which is post covid is the 800m time (but It was my first 800 so it was always going to be a pr), but I feel like my base speed has really increased over this last year. Now I just need some new prs to prove it.

3:12 high in that same race, with a huge positive split. So basically we're in the same marathon neighborhood...

...unless we "age grade" those results😏 (says the guy more than twice your age 😁).

You followed my pacing strategy I see, take off at sub 3 pace and hold it for as long as possible before blowing up.

My 3:14 was also following my 1:29 half. I actually felt really good at half, but by 25k, everything started to fall apart.

Got pfizer #1 earlier. What's people's experience w/ running the day after their first shot?