Good news: Katelyn Tuohy 4:14 1500m. Bad news: 4 BYU women beat her.

Yeah all these sports despite the massive obesity in the US.

I mean, I obviously enjoy sport bc I am here. But I came here to say can we just keep off Katelyn’s back for a bit and then celebrate her medal in the Olympics whenever that happens? #nopressure

"the female body maturation storm" is a ridiculous and ignorant thing to say.

Rojo, while you're reminding the posters that Katelyn is a real person, maybe you need to be reminded that a lot of different types of people read these threads and eating disorders in female runners if often linked to fear of going through puberty. Every woman goes through puberty. It's not a storm. Take a seat.

FastTuohy wrote:

high school xc coach wrote:

I don't know if it's the case with these girls, but i've read discussion that byu kids go into college with undervalued times because they get a lot of kids that run all of their high school races at altitude.

i honestly have no idea if there is any merit to this.

I think we would find Henes, Steelman, Izzo, Gear, Tyynismaa, Norris, Fegans, Magness and Wasserman have also all improved a ton since HS. Roe, Forbes, Donahu, Tuohy and Chmiel have certainly shown less improvement. That is about 17 of the top women runners in NCAA this year, most of whom have improved quite a bit - probably 10% or more in 2 mile or 5,000.

I have no doubt that a lot of guys have improved a lot in a 10 K - who trains for such in HS?

Henes has become a very interesting case. She's been improving in the 5000 by around 10s per year since 2017. She grew up with a coach for a mom and a former collegiate runner for a dad, yet came to college with a lot of untapped potential.

people, moderator.. or whoever is it here

this is a katelyn tuohy post, dont cry on here if no one talks about your byu women

the reason why we are in this thread is to talk about the progress of katelyn and to update fans of her progress after knee surgery. we don't have an intention of comparing a freshman to other runners who have been in college for 5 years which is what one is trying to do in this thread by editing the title (which is quite childish and unprofessional)

and to others who are comparing women runners' progress to mens' is just straight up bs, whats the point of it? oh, i know ... someone's just a nico young fan (we got u there)

respectfully discussing about katelyn's progress is welcome in this thread but if its a non-katelyn tuohy related comment then go make your own thread if you want to talk about something else, theres no paywall on that new thread button

FastTuohy wrote:

high school xc coach wrote:

I don't know if it's the case with these girls, but i've read discussion that byu kids go into college with undervalued times because they get a lot of kids that run all of their high school races at altitude.

i honestly have no idea if there is any merit to this.

I think we would find Henes, Steelman, Izzo, Gear, Tyynismaa, Norris, Fegans, Magness and Wasserman have also all improved a ton since HS. Roe, Forbes, Donahu, Tuohy and Chmiel have certainly shown less improvement. That is about 17 of the top women runners in NCAA this year, most of whom have improved quite a bit - probably 10% or more in 2 mile or 5,000.

I have no doubt that a lot of guys have improved a lot in a 10 K - who trains for such in HS?

Grace Forbes leads the 10k qualifying list (OTQ time) and lowered her indoor 3k time by over a minute.

Reality checkmate wrote:

_reality_check_ wrote:

Shoe doped. Still two seconds slower.

Nope. Nike in high school, adidas now. She's probably two seconds faster.

I think the track makes more difference than the shoes. And I doubt shoe technology especially in spikes has change that much in three years. But running on a fast-track could give you a couple of seconds vs slower track. Shoes maybe a couple tenths of a second

Adidas makes pretty good spikes I'm sure she's getting the best spikes they make and that there are at least as good as her High School spikes. Although I heard Nike makes the best race spikes. But I have to think Adidas is pretty good. Someone who knows more give your opinion

Obviously not because it is the title of the thread so we should be talking about the BYU studs.

OriginalLurker wrote:

FastTuohy wrote:

I think we would find Henes, Steelman, Izzo, Gear, Tyynismaa, Norris, Fegans, Magness and Wasserman have also all improved a ton since HS. Roe, Forbes, Donahu, Tuohy and Chmiel have certainly shown less improvement. That is about 17 of the top women runners in NCAA this year, most of whom have improved quite a bit - probably 10% or more in 2 mile or 5,000.

I have no doubt that a lot of guys have improved a lot in a 10 K - who trains for such in HS?

Grace Forbes leads the 10k qualifying list (OTQ time) and lowered her indoor 3k time by over a minute.

I focused on Forbes 445 mile time (I think I saw) from HS - her longer race times have certainly improved a lot, not sure how real her HS 3000/3200 pr is though. But, including her would only add one more to the long list of women who get a lot better in college - which was my point. If I misread her HS prs, my apologies. I would like to see the list of top NCAA 5000 guys that have dropped their HS 3200 time by close to a minute and/or hs 5000 time by 75 seconds. That in effect was the claim that was made above - more guys improved more.

Reality checkmate wrote:

FastTuohy wrote:

I think we would find Henes, Steelman, Izzo, Gear, Tyynismaa, Norris, Fegans, Magness and Wasserman have also all improved a ton since HS. Roe, Forbes, Donahu, Tuohy and Chmiel have certainly shown less improvement. That is about 17 of the top women runners in NCAA this year, most of whom have improved quite a bit - probably 10% or more in 2 mile or 5,000.

I have no doubt that a lot of guys have improved a lot in a 10 K - who trains for such in HS?

Henes has become a very interesting case. She's been improving in the 5000 by around 10s per year since 2017. She grew up with a coach for a mom and a former collegiate runner for a dad, yet came to college with a lot of untapped potential.

Maybe being busy coaching others kept them from the seemingly inevitable over coaching of their daughter.

Every athlete coming out of high school has a great deal of uncertainty on how they will progress afterwards. Very few will have 'straight-line' improvement...bodies just don't develop like that. Every athlete in every sport goes in a series of gains/plateaus/regressions....doesn't matter if you are male of female....nor does it matter what sport you are in.

It is safe to say (i think) that females have different biological changes that they have to contend with, but the overall potential is still there. The only question is whether they (males and females) will reach it.

Video is up and it is high quality. Gear had a monster last 600, going from 7th to 1st. Tuohy was strong until 1500, then drowned in a sea of blue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maO1OX9ODJU

Thanks for that Field of Dreams video! Memorable race. Maddie Boreman in there with a pr in 1500 too. U20 steeple record holder running great after several years of injury challenges.

From Camel City to Fresno blackout, Tuohy has had a whirlwind freshman year, all compressed into 3 months. Now on to acc, east reg, nationals.

BuckleUp wrote:

Video is up and it is high quality. Gear had a monster last 600, going from 7th to 1st. Tuohy was strong until 1500, then drowned in a sea of blue.

I think you mean 1300. She ran verrrry aggressively as is her style. Lot of running wide and surging through 800, and she was right on Orton until late. If she'd run passively, she probably could've run more like 4:12-4:13. Holding onto a 4:14 even as she ran out of gas is pretty strong. She's got a great stride you can even pick this out among accomplished collegians.

I like that the announcers at no point seemed to figure out that Gear had won the race rather than her teammate. I know it was dark, but they should have still seen the times that were flashing by on the scoreboard (they were looking at that for some of the other finishers).

I want to say finally that what Diljeet Taylor has built at BYU is astonishing and probably the biggest accomplishment in NCAA women's distance. Next best is what Coach Henes is building at NC-State.

What makes Taylor so impressive is that she has a smaller pool to recruit from. I do assume Hutchins isn't mormon, but most athletes who look at BYU are going to be, and most who are not mormon will not even consider BYU even though coach Taylor is there. Still she has built an absolute powerhouse, and the best women's distance program ever in a short span of time.

I actually hope that Taylor moves from BYU to a school that is more inclusive so she can recruit a wider range of athletes. I bet kids would come flocking to her from all over the country. I would love to see her at a place like NAU, Colorado State, or Utah. Certainly keep the altitude just open up the doors a little more.

Finally, if it hasn't been clearly implied, I have a lot of issues with BYU. I am pretty disgusted with their honor code policy and how it excludes and ostracizes LGBT students. I appreciate what Emma Gee did to bring awareness and change, but it's the sort of thing that would keep a lot of kids away. I hope that more is done to at least make the school open to all (mormon) students. Even the ones who want to date people of the same sex/gender.

I definitely agree that Taylor is an amazing coach. I think you're going to be disappointed if you expect her to leave anytime soon, though. She's very happy where she is, and she's already turned down better jobs than Utah or Colorado State. It's not like having success in distance at BYU is unprecedented before her. BYU had a dynasty in women's cross country in the late 90s and early 2000s, with four titles and three runner-ups in a seven-year span.

She likes a school that has an honor code. The kids have high morals which makes coaching a joy.

bbg95 wrote:

I definitely agree that Taylor is an amazing coach. I think you're going to be disappointed if you expect her to leave anytime soon, though. She's very happy where she is, and she's already turned down better jobs than Utah or Colorado State. It's not like having success in distance at BYU is unprecedented before her. BYU had a dynasty in women's cross country in the late 90s and early 2000s, with four titles and three runner-ups in a seven-year span.

Isn't her husband Mormon?

Her husband is Mormon and she loves it there. Don't think she will be leaving anytime soon after building such a great program and pulling in some amazing recruits.