Brynn Brown 15:56 tonight

FastTuohy wrote:

I know Tuohy never ran 9:47, but almost assuredly she was fit for low 9:40s at the time. She ran 9:05 going through 2,000 at 5:58 I think (as a sophomore and all by herself). She also ran 4:39 for a mile all by herself in the Millrose Qualifier just several weeks later without appearing to really push herself. I just don't think Brown now is that close to where Tuohy was then.

I double checked to make sure my memory was not wrong. Tuohy ran 9:05 in early January 2018 going out very hard (2:21 at 800), 5:57.5 at 2,000 and then fading a bit.

If your best 2M is 9:47 and you go out for a 5000m in 4:53, then you're going out right about at 2M pace, so it certainly would be expected to take a lot out of you. Hard to believe that all of a sudden there are ten prep girls at 15:56 or better. Cain was near world class at 17 but unfortunately regressed markedly, and many of those athletes are still very young. But it's true that Sisson is the only one, to my knowledge, to do anything after high school.

You're right that many are still very young. Of the 10, there are Cain and Sisson, as noted; O'Keefe, who just graduated a 4-time All American and OT qualifier: Tuohy #24 NCAA XC as a freshman; another still in college, and two still in high school. That only leaves Chock, Hatton, and Frazier.

commentor wrote:

2021 Texas Distance Festival. Approx 4:53 at mile 10:07 at 2 mile, thoughts?

Where are these splits coming from? I was standing at the right at the mile mark with a 200m clock right in front of me and she came through at 4:57/58.

They came from the milesplit article, but looking at the video now, they obviously got it wrong. She crossed 1800 at 5:35. So that makes a big difference. Maybe a 15:45 with better pacing.

oldschoollrc wrote:

Interesting list. Sisson the only one to have major success at the senior level, I believe?

This is exactly thew reason I think Americans get too excited about fast highschoolers. It's not necassarily a bad thing to be running fast in HS, but I'd hazard a guess that the girls who placed 4th, 7th, 12th in this race have about an equal chance of going to the Olympics. Leave the Highscoolers alone, let them race and have fun and cheeckin in 6 years time

Somebody already pointed out that most of those top 10 are still young. Some of them may go on to be the best Americans ever.

Houlihan is the best American of all time. Her HS PRs are 55/2:07/4:29/9:56. And those times then were at the top of heap. She was doing those in an average $40 pair of spikes. Drop her in today in HS and she would be 54/2:04/4:25/9:40 and you would all be saying that she has no future because she is too fast.

zxcvzcxv wrote:

If your best 2M is 9:47 and you go out for a 5000m in 4:53, then you're going out right about at 2M pace, so it certainly would be expected to take a lot out of you..

The same argument then would show Tuohy was capable of much faster than 9:47 and/or 15:37. My point is Tuohy was simply much faster then then Brown is now.

If in fact, as has been mentioned, Brown was not out that fast, then the conclusion would agree with what I said.

Your use of superlatives wreaks of jealousy and ignorance about what seems to be a very humble high school girl. Y’all fan boys are just plain weird.

weirdos wrote:

Your use of superlatives wreaks of jealousy and ignorance about what seems to be a very humble high school girl. Y’all fan boys are just plain weird.

Lol do you know what a superlative is? Faster is NOT a superlative. Fastest is.

Faster is a comparative.

Ha, knew that would get ya.....sad fanboy.

A minute faster would put her within striking distance of the Japanese Girl's High School Record.

What distances are the 4:29 and 9:56 for hs Houlihan? You may have to submit them to the record keepers. If they are mile and 2mile, we have to change the narrative from ''unsung hero who made good as a pro" to "rare high school phenom who went on to pro success."

1500 and 3000.

brownie is faster wrote:

Somebody already pointed out that most of those top 10 are still young. Some of them may go on to be the best Americans ever.

Houlihan is the best American of all time. Her HS PRs are 55/2:07/4:29/9:56. And those times then were at the top of heap. She was doing those in an average $40 pair of spikes. Drop her in today in HS and she would be 54/2:04/4:25/9:40 and you would all be saying that she has no future because she is too fast.

While houlihan undoubtedly had incredible range, it is exceedingly disingenuous to mention her 1500/3000 PRs (which are the events run in Iowa), when all of the other discussion in the thread is centered around 1600/3200/5000 or their full imperial counterparts. 956 for 3200 probably comes out to about 1040 for 2m (doing this without a calculator), which is very good especially as probably your 4th best event relatively speaking but hardly on an all time level on it's own.

Following up on houlihan, here are her national rankings from senior year when she ran almost all of her PRs (she ran a few tenths faster in the 800 as a soph).

400: 99th

800: 9th

1500: 14th

1600/mile: 6th (443y from adidas grand prix)

3000:28th

3200/2 mile: 53rd (using ballpark estimate of 1040y for conversion from 956 3000). Note I did not figure out which of the 27 from 3000 ahead of her also had 2mile times above her so it could be as far down as 80ish place for her there.

Her range is incredibly impressive but I wouldn't say she was "top of the heap" in the 400 or 3000/2mile.