Help choosing a “Super” training shoe

Wait, so you want to reduce the training effect from your quality running?

How in any world does this make any sense? Sure, at the top of the game an athlete maxing our their training might benefit from this. But they have such a foundation of training that they cannot further train their legs to become more resilient. The rest of us should be thinking the opposite: How do I increase the stimulus from my measly little 50 (or 60 or 70) miles per week of hobby jogging?

Super shoes are race day shoes. As a long term training shoe, it will not be beneficial for a developing athlete. Unless you are ready to stop developing.

It's awesome to see people finally talking about this, as I've believed for some time that improved training shoes are helping runners more than improved racing shoes (for the mile-10k range).

I find the big things to look for in a super trainer are as follows:

1. High cushioning

2. Lightweight

3. Innovative midsole geometry

In my opinion, the best training shoes of all that meet these criteria are the Saucony Endorphin Speed, Nike Pegasus Turbo 2, and Brooks Hyperion Tempo.

Here's my personal rotation that I use for most of my easy miles and long runs:

Pegasus 37, Pegasus Turbo 2, Hyperion Tempo, HOKA Rincon, and Pegasus 36 Trail. I find these shoes really cover all the bases, but I'm looking to pick up the Endorphin Speed as well. For my workouts I use the Vaporfly or spikes primarily.

Always Building wrote:

Wait, so you want to reduce the training effect from your quality running?

How in any world does this make any sense? Sure, at the top of the game an athlete maxing our their training might benefit from this. But they have such a foundation of training that they cannot further train their legs to become more resilient. The rest of us should be thinking the opposite: How do I increase the stimulus from my measly little 50 (or 60 or 70) miles per week of hobby jogging?

Super shoes are race day shoes. As a long term training shoe, it will not be beneficial for a developing athlete. Unless you are ready to stop developing.

Nope, though I understand your confusion! I actually used to think of it the same way, but what made me see it all a bit differently was the discovery that having more optimized training shoes allows you increase both the quality and quantity in your training. You can train faster AND train more even at the faster pace. The aerobic benefits to be had from this are incredible.

Always Building wrote:

Wait, so you want to reduce the training effect from your quality running?

How in any world does this make any sense? Sure, at the top of the game an athlete maxing our their training might benefit from this. But they have such a foundation of training that they cannot further train their legs to become more resilient. The rest of us should be thinking the opposite: How do I increase the stimulus from my measly little 50 (or 60 or 70) miles per week of hobby jogging?

Super shoes are race day shoes. As a long term training shoe, it will not be beneficial for a developing athlete. Unless you are ready to stop developing.

Speak for yourself mate, I run upwards of 100 MPW at altitude so your point is redundant in my personal situation.

And in regards to your point, surely I can increase the stimuli in my training by having my legs less beat up from day to day in training. Fresher legs will allow me to run a little more aerobically on my easy days or push sessions a little faster. Like Ben True says, these shoes help an athlete truly max out their aerobic system.

Using myself as an example, on Tuesday I’ll do say 6x1mile plus a double then on Wednesday I’ll do a 90minute MLR. Many a time my legs have been too shot from my Tuesday to run my MLR truly moderate. Surely if I use the shoes to save my legs a little (again I’m not talk about the carbon plated shoes, just the shoes with the fancy foam) then I can increase the stimuli in my training?

It's a great shoe, there's even the new, improved, Revolution 5 EXT. I hear many Japanese running teams are using the revolution for their sessions.

I can't wait for the Ekiden colorway.

I have to say that whilst neither are super shoes, there’s a world of difference in how my legs feel when using the ZoomX Invincible and Clifton 7.

Tempted to try the cheaper Next%2 for training runs when my Turbo 2 wear out.

highhoppingworm wrote:

npurdy1112 wrote:

Agree on the first but not the second.

The pair I bought are tearing apart on the outsole just behind the airbags. Best part is Nike wont warranty that as a defect. I went to write a review on Nikes website and there were others with the same problem. Just FYI before anyone goes and spends $200 on an uptempo shoe. I replaced them with Next%

Npurdy. You probably damaged them doing burpees inbetween 2 mile repeats.

Shows how poorly built it is if a burpee will damage a $200 shoe. LOL

I wonder how much of this leg saving stuff is just placebo. You expect them to help recovery, and therefore they do?

I have a couple of new foam shoes and can't say I notice any difference with recovery, but I'm generally not beat up unless doing a hard workout anyway.

Not posting it in a 3rd thread, but there have been studies to prove the leg saving effect when using the shoes for quality work.

Always Building wrote:

Wait, so you want to reduce the training effect from your quality running?

How in any world does this make any sense? Sure, at the top of the game an athlete maxing our their training might benefit from this. But they have such a foundation of training that they cannot further train their legs to become more resilient. The rest of us should be thinking the opposite: How do I increase the stimulus from my measly little 50 (or 60 or 70) miles per week of hobby jogging?

Super shoes are race day shoes. As a long term training shoe, it will not be beneficial for a developing athlete. Unless you are ready to stop developing.

I once directly pounded my calves and shins with a hammer for 20-30min a day bc a guy Letsrun said my legs hurting = how I know I'm training right & how I'll get faster . It made them feel exactly like they feel following a hard 6 mile road tempo in my crappy trainers, but it didn't make me any faster - weird!

How do some people on here function in day to day life? Do you have assistants that open things for you, spoon feed you, etc? Mind boggling

Guys thx for thread/ info. Can i get an update / new opinions.... any new shoes? Any "super" trail shoes. The Nike one i tried "terra kiger" was good, but not a lot of cushioning. I'm looking fit next level cushioning/bounce/energy return [yes, without being super unstable] in a tall shoe. Soo...

What's the best next generation super shoe for road training and for trails?

Typos:

Edit- "for [not fit] next level...."

"..in a trail [ not tall] shoe.."

?

runderun wrote:

Endorphin Speed - lightweight, flexible nylon plate, resilient but soft foam. Best trainer out there IMO. I've put 400 miles on mine and they still feel good

Ill second this. My first pair just cracked 400 a few weeks ago. I can tell the cushioning is going limp but still overall, the best trainers I've ever ran in.

Tinny 2 Shoes wrote:

runderun wrote:

Endorphin Speed - lightweight, flexible nylon plate, resilient but soft foam. Best trainer out there IMO. I've put 400 miles on mine and they still feel good

Ill second this. My first pair just cracked 400 a few weeks ago. I can tell the cushioning is going limp but still overall, the best trainers I've ever ran in.

Thx. Looks like people love this shoe. Gonna give it a try. A bargain too. Any reason to go for 2.0 version that seems to have just come out over first edition? For $35 more. Thx. Any next gen "super" trail shoes?

No one's mentioned Puma? Anyone run in their shoe? I just received a pair of their Nitro Deviate shoes (had a 40% off coupon so got them for $96). They are plated but are more of a trainer at 9 ounces. Fit is good, cushioning feels great, just jogging around in front of the house feels feels super responsive. I think these are an older shoe that's about to be obsoleted but what the hell. 'Bout to go on a 10-12 miler with 5 at tempo in the middle.

I'd suggest the HOKA Mach 4 as your everyday trainer. Light, bouncy and definitely saves your legs on the roads/hard surfaces.