LRC is the perfect testing ground. Against free speech, send them away. Say something the mods don’t agree with. Delete. Ban.
THE FRINGES FROM BOTH SIDES ARE OFF THEIR ROCKERS.
LRC is the perfect testing ground. Against free speech, send them away. Say something the mods don’t agree with. Delete. Ban.
THE FRINGES FROM BOTH SIDES ARE OFF THEIR ROCKERS.
I think the vast majority of Americans do. I would guess its about 20% who don't and they are just being extremely loud.
They still are as Jan 6 shows.Nowadays,they wear starched shirts and neckties and call
themselves conservatives and patriots.
It might be a good idea to limit what people can "say" on social media.
Like your theatre example, free speech is really not completely allowed in all circumstances.
But beyond hurtful examples, I am for free speech, and I think the majority always will be.
The no freedom from consequences is problematic, in particular because social media/social pressure is an entity unlike anything that existed at the birth of our nation. You need a job to survive, and some political views that are widely held (right or wrong) can bar you from employment if it gets out. That's troubling.
Social media is a platform of speech, and while FB and Twitter are private entities, in our current society it's a major form of communication and there should be protections for a citizen's right to free speech. In the U.S., the power company can't refuse you service and you have more constitutional rights with respect to a private utilities corporation than you do to getting service a running store because one is a fundamental right and the other is a luxury.
If certain political views and ideologies (again, ones that include widely held views in the U.S.) are knocked off Twitter/FB/Youtube, that can be a form of political manipulation, especially when there are connections between big tech and the DNC. The line is no longer clearly demarcated.
The heart of freedom of speech is that if someone is trying in good faith to communicate, that person has the right to do so. The world has changed and there are forces much more powerful than the government that do govern your life, and these forces act to eradicate certain views. This is all pretty bad.
For the record, I have more "liberal" views on issues, but I don't agree with how the liberal side handles this. Liberals should be about promoting those who can't speak up to do so. I don't think I'd do what Kaep did, but it certainly was his right to do so, and to not be a hypocrite I feel the need to stand up for free speech I don't agree with.
Somebody Someone wrote:
The no freedom from consequences is problematic, in particular because social media/social pressure is an entity unlike anything that existed at the birth of our nation. You need a job to survive, and some political views that are widely held (right or wrong) can bar you from employment if it gets out. That's troubling.
.
Why? If you hold views that other find abhorrent, why should they be forced to employ with you. And let's be clear by political views you mean pretty much how big of a racist a person is. Nobody is not getting jobs because they voted republican, their stance on the role of government in society, tax cuts, or even things like affirmative action. You don't get a job when you are a racist, homophobe, and the like. Calling them political views is stretching is a bit. The fact that they have largely collected in one political party doesn't make it a political issue. If you want to go that being a white nationalist is a protected class, go for it. I am not sure if many people are going to be supporting you.
Where exactly to draw the line does get a bit vague and in these days a lot of stuff that used to be private is public. And there are definitely some things that reasonable people could consider overreactions. Getting a girl kicked out of college cause she used the N word as a general term (i.e. it wasn't in reference to one specific person or a specific putdown )? I am not too thrilled about that. The punishment seems excessive compared to the crime. Getting kicked off your XC team cause you are calling a specific person a N word and generally saying derogatory terms? I am pretty ok with that but could also live with just a suspension if there was no pattern. Do it to a person face to face? Yeah that is an easy dismissal...
And before you blame social media and the like, shunning has a long tradition in human societies. It is nothing new other than the mechanism being used.
You so much as post the FBI crime statistics about Black on White Crime (before Obama classified them) and I can name dozens of platforms online that will ban you instantly!
We live in scary times. Who made the government and SJWs GODS that can tell us what vibration patterns and syllables some Races of Humans can make and other cant!
Its funny watching the Alt-Light cry about how they are being censored when they didn't lift a finger to help the Alt-Right. We told you that you'd be next! Even better now the liberals are eating their own on Twitter becaues they have no one left to cancel.
Most Americans do.
Some on the left want to tell people how to talk.
Some on the right want to do the same.
They're both wrong but are a small and loud minority.
With technology is doesn't matter what people want or don't want anymore. We will all be able to say anything we want and stay completely hidden from terrorist governments.
If you are a professional college educated Republican do you really want other professionals to know that you are a big trump supporter, that you believe trump won the election, that you think Covid was all exaggerated, and that green energy and climate change are bogus.
Free speech and exposure of your ideas are not a good idea. Other professionals would think less of you if they knew what you really thought. It might hurt you professionally.
Many who tried to stop the steal are now in trouble with their companies. You might be able to express yourself more freely if you not an educated professional.
Everyone is in favour of free speech, so long as it's something they agree with.
The US doesn't allow free speech in Saudi Arabia, UAE, Bahrain, Israel, Palestine, Egypt, Yemen, and a few other places around that area.
the postmans wrote:
Yes, but I find too many people misunderstand what "free speech" means in the context that exists in society. Twitter deleting your post is not a violation of free speech. Your (private) employer firing you because they feel you made them look bad is not a violation of free speech.
Of course it is
Kinda seems you read one sentence and then stopped because I explained why I found it disturbing in detail. Try again. It's not about employers not liking something about you (that's what happened to Kaep, and I think it's unfortunate that it did). It's about the influence of social media canceling people and employers then having to cave to the pressure. So it's not employers deciding they don't like their employees, it's other internet weirdos who have nothing better to do.
The Mariners guy is a good example. He obviously was saying what everyone in the building thought (they didn't want to pay for an interpreter, holding back Kelenic). Right or wrong I'm not debating, but those were the views of the organization. But then people who probably don't even watch baseball heard his comments and put pressure on the organization to get rid of him.
You'll back this movement until one day it turns on you. I'm for progress in society, but the methods we're taking are dangerous.
Somebody Someone wrote:
The Mariners guy is a good example. He obviously was saying what everyone in the building thought (they didn't want to pay for an interpreter, holding back Kelenic). Right or wrong I'm not debating, but those were the views of the organization. But then people who probably don't even watch baseball heard his comments and put pressure on the organization to get rid of him.
You'll back this movement until one day it turns on you. I'm for progress in society, but the methods we're taking are dangerous.
Lets look at the marineer guy because it is unpolitical. Lets think about the results of his actions
a) If you are a japanese player, are you going to want to sign with the marineers knowing that the front office resents paying a tiny sum for interpreters?
b) If you are a Dominican how do you feel knowing that your boss is going to insult your english an think of you as a loud mouth.
c) if you are a vet how do you feel knowing that the front office regrets signing you (nobody forced them to)?
d) If you are a minor leaguer how do you feel knowing that the front office is going off money rather than talent?
The dude's speech basically made it impossible for him to do his job effectively. The dude basically insulted dozens of people in his organization. And no it wasn't people outside of baseball. Go read the comments from all the people he directly insulted who the marineers had invested 10s of millions of dollars in. He was fired for being an idiot who thought it was more important to try and impress a bunch of rotary club members than to do his job.
Democrats are soft and weak. It's one of their defining chararteristics. They are easily triggered by microagressions and need safe spaces at an alarming rate!
More than 60% of liberals said it’s “always” or “sometimes” acceptable to shout down a speaker; compared to 15% for extreme conservatives.
My point was that his employer/the front office had no problem with his views because they inhabit them. They had to play social media fire extinguisher because Twitter erupted and got buried in “feels.”
This society is gone. We are teetering on the edge of a dictatorship.
Ain't 1857 wrote:
They still are as Jan 6 shows.Nowadays,they wear starched shirts and neckties and call
themselves conservatives and patriots.
Of course you are full of cheap talk w no evidence. Can you site some Conservatives on the side of banning speech or do you go to college still?
Somebody Someone wrote:
My point was that his employer/the front office had no problem with his views because they inhabit them. They had to play social media fire extinguisher because Twitter erupted and got buried in “feels.”
I have no clue who knew what but they had to fire him because he had made it impossible to keep him. Imagine you are at work and are dealing with a really tough client. If you insult him to some coworkers, you aren't getting fired. Now instead of insulting him to your coworkers, you go on a rant when he is sitting in the same room. You get fired wouldn't be shocking.
And as always, if you are going to be an idiot, you better be a talented one. If they had put together a string of playoff winning teams, he could survive gaffes like this. Be mediocre? A heck of a lot easier to fire you.