People who've raced in VaporFlys, how much did they help?

Really, the hundreds of reviews and articles already at the top of google. Like with all lightweight and cushioned shoes it provides a big advantage over heavy firm shoes.

How much benefits it will while you maybe a no to a few seconds seconds per km/mile. This is going to be the same with any lightweight cushioned shoe.

These type of shoe favour the longer distances as they beat your legs up less but you can run any distance you want if you are fit enough

Is this like something that was in a draft folder from 3 years ago and you are just now hitting send?

4%

;)

They helped me get compliments!

I looked cool!

I felt expensive!

Matching aeroswift singlets, oh yeah!

Nike interviewed me at a race

Bloggers have taken my pic and filmed me lace up

One of the Janes said hi to me, totally melted..

Faster, not really... shirtless Highschool seniors flying by me at local 10ks

It's like cycling, buy what you can afford, not based on your ability.

very good question. Hopefully someone other than the goofballs answers

20 secs slower in a 10k than my Mizuno Ekiden.

It makes a tiny little marathoner 5' 6" tall , instead 0f 5' 5 1/2" tall .

I raced in Vaporflies and damn, let me tell you that story. It reminds of the time back in the day, oh, I suppose I'm going off at a tangent here but it doesn't matter because 1. it's 6am 2. I'm #gettingturntagain! 3. it was almost 20 years ago now and 4. this is pretty much public knowledge and 5. I'm making the whole thing up, so pick your poison.

Damn, it was hot that year. That's the main thing I remember. There was a kind of heaviness in the air; unsettling, omniprescent, yet sexual.But I digress. We were all under so much pressure and really those chairs should've been fastened to the floor - that's the main thing I took away from the situation, aside from anything else. Sometimes a broken foot is the lesser of two evils.

He pissed me off so much. With his shiity hair, his shiity smile and his shiity shoes. Damn, if he'd been wearing Vaporflies maybe it would've been a whole different scenario, but I suppose that's just wishful thinking. He was so inappropriate and it showed.

He provoked me over and over. He said stupid things. He said some things I can't repeat. He smiled. And then it happened. You know, I don't really recall this part but before I knew it I was standing and my foot has slightly nudged the bottom of the plastic chair in front of me which subsequently flew up into the air. They say it's like slow motion but it wasn't really - it was more like fast forward for me. And the too chair I suppose. Only the chair did not stop and softly met the face of the gentleman sitting to the side. A gentleman who was about 90 years old and a decorated war veteran.

I mean have you ever tried getting one of those shiity chairs to travel in a straight line? I had never touched one gently with my foot before (well, if we're speaking technically not a plastic one) but believe me, it is NOT an easy task to get them to travel in the right direction. They are not even equally weighted for starters. You're onto a losing game from the start. I thought I heard the gentleman laugh but I must've been dreaming. My legs carried me out of where I was, with one thought only: get to the door! (and also, WTF do I do regarding the CCTV but that is a story for another day.) I got to the door. The door was open and a gentle breeze met my face... the sweet smell of the outside world. I left, and then scrambled to make a phone call.

The lady I spoke to sounded disturbed. I started off with a simple "hello" and then, surprisingly, I faltered. "I've done something really bad," I muttered... unable to really put into words what had just happened and also thinking that if I made out it was worse it might be a pleasant surprise for her when she discovered it was not up to the level of the incident that had occurred last week. "Something really... REALLY bad,"... I paused. She paused. "You need to tell me in simple terms what has happened," she said gently. So, I did. "I'll speak to them and call you back." Okayyyy. Well, by that point I was sure I was possibly in a little bit of trouble to the point I decided to go to a field and wait for the phone to ring. I still remember that field. I can't even go back there, but that is for separate reasons. But I waited there... and then the phone rang.

British Guy wrote:

What distance did you race, and how much time do you estimate they saved vs expected performance in non-carbon fiber shoes?

The computer models of engineers at the shoe companies had determined the effects on racing before the shoes were ever produced.

I don't wear the shoes, but 4% benefit is known. Run a 60 min 1/2 marathon in 57.6 minutes.

There is also the benefits of the legs not being as tired on roads, and being ahead of typical pacing so that one feels a 'time cushion' to reach goals.

I think it is similar for the new and improved spikes when racing on a track: 65 second laps are a 4:20 mile, but that becomes 62.4 sec per lap, and suddenly a decent HS or college runner is under 4:10. 62 sec per lap becomes 59.52 and a 4:08 runner can run 3:58, so trains harder and is extra-focused in the race.

As to the recent indoor meet in France, 60 sec per lap runners can run at 57.6 sec per lap, so instead of a well-earned 3:41 for 1500m, they can run 3:36.

Maybe it is doping as well, and clearly some of the runners in that indoor meet were on PEDs, but what if the track spikes have replaced doping? sub-3:50 is now the old sub-4?

I hope something is done about the track spikes.

I don't care about the road shoes, because of the physical benefits to hundreds of thousands of runners who train and race on roads are worth it,

Nobody's getting a 4% benefit from the track spikes. Track spikes will never replace doping. Stop worrying so much, there's no research to suggest that the new spikes provide such a huge benefit, not to mention that the "4%" in the name refers to a 4% boost in running economy, not a flat 4% reduction in race times across the board, so it's unlikely that even a theoretical spike with a 4% economy boost would provide a time reduction in the shorter track distances that's anywhere near the boost that the Vapor/Alphafly provide in the marathon.

I have the New Balance RC Elite. I don’t feel any faster in my workouts but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t feel fresher in the days after a hard workout.

I'd estimate 15 seconds faster a mile. I ran a half marathon last year in ~1:30:xx after guessing I'd run 1:35.

I ran a 5K later in the summer in 18:20 after barely cracking 19 in my trainers.

Everyone responds differently so hard to say, but the benefits are noticeable to me. I've found that after I tire, they still keep my legs turning over so even though my HR may be close to max I'm not ever slowing down my pace... only other shoe I tried that even approaches that feel is the Saucony Endorphin Speeds (haven't tried the pros)… Did not experience the same feel from the Alphafly's although I haven't tried them in a race yet.

10 miler, I picked up 4 minutes.

Good on those who are honest about how much improvement these things bring.

Laughing at those who drop over 200 notes per pair (most have multiple pairs) and claim they don't make any difference to their running.

You're not fooling anybody you weirdos.

No direct experience with the Nike shoes but, I did buy a pair of Hoka Carbon X2 to give plated shoes a try. I have not noticed a big difference in actual running speed but, the difference in fatigue perception is huge. No soreness at all during or after long runs. I had started doing some weekly 5K tempo efforts after the New Year and was maintaining a 4:00/km pace at 85% HR in a pair of adidas SL20. Tried one in the X2 and went 8K at the same pace and HR on the same loop before any tiredness / cardiac drift set in.

The Carbon X2 is kind of plush and slower feeling in comparison to a purpose built racing flat. I surmise that the Vaporfly, Adios Pro, Endorphin Pro, Rocket X, and other plated racing shoes would perform better. Athletes younger and lighter than me would get a huge boost in performance.

Some races I've ran PR's, most I do not.

My 5k and 10k road PRs are still from pre vaporfly days, my 15k to marathon PRs are post vaporfly days... But I never ran a marathon before vaporfly and only a couple half marathons before the vaporfly was released. The difference seems to be minimal, at most a couple seconds per mile. I'm sure the same could be said for other improvements in shoes from the past, maybe 40 years ago.

......... wrote:

I'd estimate 15 seconds faster a mile. I ran a half marathon last year in ~1:30:xx after guessing I'd run 1:35.

I ran a 5K later in the summer in 18:20 after barely cracking 19 in my trainers.

Everyone responds differently so hard to say, but the benefits are noticeable to me. I've found that after I tire, they still keep my legs turning over so even though my HR may be close to max I'm not ever slowing down my pace... only other shoe I tried that even approaches that feel is the Saucony Endorphin Speeds (haven't tried the pros)… Did not experience the same feel from the Alphafly's although I haven't tried them in a race yet.

Oh so you ran a little over 10 seconds per mile faster wearing vaporfly over your trainers? Wear any racing shoe that weights 6 oz instead of 10oz like your trainer and you'll run quite a bit faster. Anyone who was racing in regular old trainers and suddenly wears vaporfly shoes for a race and runs faster, of course you are running faster. You are finally wearing a lighter racing shoe. This is like saying you used to swim in blue jeans and a sweater and then started swimming in a speedo and you were able to swim faster.

The average effect of VF shoes in the marathon distance is 2.5-3 min for sub-elite and elite runners. See the following paper:

https://arxiv.org/abs/2002.06105

Laboratory studies suggets significant individual variation in the aerobic savings of VF shoes. Some people get a 2% benefit; others get 6% or more. It's difficult to figure out how this individual effect as measured in the lab, over a short distance, translates into race performances. The study above estimates the average effect for all runners in real-life settings. Your benefit could be greater or less than that.

All of this is complicated by the fact that there is probably a training effect, in addition to the immediate effect of putting on the shoes. To explain: the shoes will make most people significantly faster in a long distance race, but people who also train in the shoes should get an added benefit because they can run faster workouts and recover more quickly. This is similar to how a PED improves performance because it allows the athlete to complete harder workouts than they would without the assist.

I did light training in the VF prior to my last marathon and finished ~170 places better than my bib number (based on seed time). I attribute most of this to the shoes. I have since done many workouts in the shoes, and I notice a big learning curve. My LT pace feels much easier in the shoes, but if I want to speed up my LT runs to account for the shoes, I first have to adapt, neuromuscularly, to the increased stride rate and force. After a few weeks of training in the shoes, my average tempo pace is 5-7 seconds faster than when I first started training in the shoes.

I haven't raced since carbon shoes arrived. How does the non professional competitive running scene look at these shoes? Are they part of everyone's gym bag or looked at as cheating?