Is 10 x 40 seconds hills with 2 min rest a good aerobic workout or too much anaerobic ?

CrispyChicken wrote:

For this workout, what is defined as a "hill". What is the optimum slope of the hill required to optimize this workout given the 40 sec interval time?

Same question here. Anybody have experience with this?

It depends how fast you run them. If you want a more aerobic workout, maybe reduce the intensity as well as the rest down to 1-1.5 minutes.

jiggymeister wrote:

CoachB wrote:

For 3200-5k it's not a great aerobic developer though.

What would be an alternative for 5K focused athletes? (Also in the context of hill training)

Cut the recoveries. If it's a 40 second hill, start each rep on the 2 minute point, so you have to get back down quickly. Then add a couple of reps each time you do the session. Just make sure you are running with good form.

If in doubt wear a heart rate monitor; for 5k training, as opposed to 800m, you want incomplete recovery so the 3rd or 4th rep is up near your max. If I do short-recovery work, I end up at 168-175 for a good amount of time; but if I do all-out hills with long rests, it rarely gets over 150, because 40 seconds just isn't long enough. Great lactate and power session, though!

Another approach for 5k runners is what Seb Coe used to do, mostly because he had a 100m hill behind his house. I copied this for a few seasons and it worked really well.

100m (say 20 seconds) uphill, starting on the minute. You JUST have time to pause for breath, jog, turn, take 2-3sec to get 'set', then start the next one.

Session 1: 10 reps

Session 2: 10 + break + 5

Session 3: 10 + 10

Session 4: 10 + 10 + 5

etc

Built up to 40 reps one or two winters myself, and that's a MASSIVE aerobic stimulus, plus all else.

There just isn't time for your heart rate to drop much, and there isn't enough lactate buildup to mess up your form. So your heart ends up getting 2-3 10 minute tempo runs, while your neuromuscular system is doing uphill strides at 75% power and you get a whole load of strength endurance. Sets you up really well for track work...

Chepte-GAY wrote:

I want to improve mainly on 2mile-5k distance.

I want to run each rep at 800m effort (i don't know the speed because it's too steep).

Great pre/early-season workout, although no it's not that much of an aerobic stimulus. I run something similar before getting into the spring road and summer track seasons (masters runner here).

I do 10-12x a steep hill (~30 seconds) several times in the winter (Dec-Mar?), every week or two. Walk-down rest takes ~90 seconds so I am starting every 2:00 or so.

This is all very loose and based on feel. "Pace" or effort feels similar to during 10x200 at 800 race pace with 1:30 rest, so very similar to your workout.

I think this hill workout is great for muscular strength and mechanics, but I don't think it covers many aerobic bases TBH.

This would not be bad to throw into the monthly rotation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEtdoJmBNLI

And these.......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDcXPIT380k&feature=emb_rel_end

Hill fartlek will give you a wide range of benefits

During our winter months my athletes complete a 10-12k run over a hilly circuit. Athletes surge the hills at a good clip and run easy on the flat. The run includes 2x250 2x750 and 2x900 although this doesn't sound like much it does wonders for their aerobic strength.

master of this domain wrote:

Chepte-GAY wrote:

I want to improve mainly on 2mile-5k distance.

I want to run each rep at 800m effort (i don't know the speed because it's too steep).

Great pre/early-season workout, although no it's not that much of an aerobic stimulus. I run something similar before getting into the spring road and summer track seasons (masters runner here).

I do 10-12x a steep hill (~30 seconds) several times in the winter (Dec-Mar?), every week or two. Walk-down rest takes ~90 seconds so I am starting every 2:00 or so.

This is all very loose and based on feel. "Pace" or effort feels similar to during 10x200 at 800 race pace with 1:30 rest, so very similar to your workout.

I think this hill workout is great for muscular strength and mechanics, but I don't think it covers many aerobic bases TBH.

As above, I do similar to really just improve my leg strength and mechanics- (not really sure they have ever really improved tbh!).

For an aerobic stimulus surely it would be better to just run a long hilly loop at a strong effort?

coahc wrote:

During our winter months my athletes complete a 10-12k run over a hilly circuit. Athletes surge the hills at a good clip and run easy on the flat. The run includes 2x250 2x750 and 2x900 although this doesn't sound like much it does wonders for their aerobic strength.

Basically this.

Excellent workout for those distances. In the base phase I believe it's important to do a bit longer warmup that includes 3 miles at "moderate" effort. So, a little slower than Marathon. Faster than normal running.

If you're not toast afterwards, the cooldown should also be 3 miles at the same effort. But, depending on your situation, you can be fine just jogging back home after the hills.

If you're not in the base phase, you'll find many programs including some track work after the hills. We worked up all the way to 6x300's at mile pace. Tough workouts. Always felt like I got a lot out of them.

short answer....no its not a good workout for aerobic development

Def a nice early season workout . I would do it a couple of times actually keep tabs on your times and keep the rest honest

Chepte-GAY wrote:

I want to improve mainly on 2mile-5k distance.

I want to run each rep at 800m effort (i don't know the speed because it's too steep).

I would call that a speed/endurance workout good for XC or middle distance track.

Was in a group that did that 1× weekly, only @ 90 sec uphill, jog back down interval and 8 reps.

Sprint Hill Interval Training.

That and lots of LSD did wonders for our road race times.

depends on how intense the hill repeats are

Yes. All Depends on Intensity. Generally if you want to tax the Aerobic System (thinking "heart/lungs cardio vascular") you'd get more "bang for your buck" doing 2-3 min hill rep intervals at around 90% -95% effort. Lactate Threshold into Vo2max. If you want to flood the system with lactate (aka "go anaerobic "), then heck yes doing 30-40 seconds nearly all-out with short rest could do that. You'd probably also be running with bad form and really hurting and it generally would be frowned upon for "early season base-building"). So timing in the season and with the recovery between each rep matters with the intensity and what system is challenged. Generally for pure muscular Strength and Form/Mechanics Short Hills pretty fast can be used (and usually the recovery would be as long as needed....for a well trained athlete 2-3-min is pretty long and enough to circulate the lactate and get the HR down...even for 40 sec at pretty high intensity). So in that regard this workout could be designed more to work on Form/Running Economy (leg power, high knees, good arm motion, and glute and FT muscle fiber activation) with the added bonus of getting the HR and breathing rate to spike up a bit (but not be too demanding or painful really). But the goal is proper form and improving the stride mechanics. Also depends on how steep the hill is and what the goal event you are training for is.... Same could be said for doing something like 12-16. x 400m at 3km-5km pace with a 1:30 rest or doing repeat 200m at more Jack Daniels style "Rep" pace (Mile to 3km pace), but with basically a full recovery. Early season. I call it a "Running Economy" target workout or "Pre-Vo2max" work as it can be race pace specific, but generally is not too demanding on either the aerobic system or the anaerobic system...as its more for neuromuscular coordination.

Juice Springsteen wrote:

depends on how intense the hill repeats are

I think they are good for building strength and speed during the base phase. This is a good video that explains:

https://youtu.be/ACyXsirycw0