Explain how standardized tests are biased

Bad Wigins wrote:

adsfdasfasfsafadfa wrote:

Want a person who does great on the SAT? SAT test scores are great. For picking out students that will do well in school? They don't do better than using the rest of the data.

The Scholastic Aptitude Test is designed for precisely the things they teach in school. Unless by "school" you mean something more like art or music than math, science and writing.

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No I mean science, engineering, english, business, and the rest. This has been looked at numerous times. There are schools that don't use test score for admittance. Of the kids that get in (GPA, interviews, essays.... are used), SAT scores (kids took them for other schools) have no correlation with student achievement. The tests might work at a high level (i.e. comparing a 1400 kid to a 700 one) but once you get in a narrower group (say 1100-1300), they have no predictive power. I am sorry if reality has once again failed to match your dogma.

No. You are incorrect. The studies all show that SAT scores are correlated with academic achievement. Do you think the Ivies are ignorant regarding their own admission standards?

They are biased in favor of people who study, take school seriously, and work hard. That’s it. Democrats hate those kind of people.

go r wrote:

No. You are incorrect. The studies all show that SAT scores are correlated with academic achievement. Do you think the Ivies are ignorant regarding their own admission standards?

HS GPA is a much better predictor for college graduation rate than ACT.

True. But higher ACT scores also correlate to higher graduation rates. And higher ACT scorers attend better colleges. Guys like Zuckerburg score well and get into the best colleges but don't graduate.

go r wrote:

No. You are incorrect. The studies all show that SAT scores are correlated with academic achievement. Do you think the Ivies are ignorant regarding their own admission standards?

So why do Ivy leagues require high school transcripts and essays? Why don't they just use the SAT since it's predictive power is so high. Why are they ignorant of how superior this test is?

I can tell that you did not attend an Ivy if you can't figure that out. The average score is 34 which means that all admitted students have very high test scores. They don't admit kids with great essays and GPAs who have a 20 ACT. Their documents won even be looked at.

* wrote:

Questions like:

Spencer sold 20% of his high commodity index funds to make renovations on his 30 foot yacht.

If he purchased them at the beginning of polo season, on the weekend of which leg of the triple crown would he need to sell them to clear the average yield?

How did my post become the original post?

I made the first reply.

The thread was started by “they seem fair to me”, as you can see when you click the thread to get here.

Did the mods delete the original post and leave the thread up?

Obviously.

Record this wrote:

I can tell that you did not attend an Ivy if you can't figure that out. The average score is 34 which means that all admitted students have very high test scores. They don't admit kids with great essays and GPAs who have a 20 ACT. Their documents won even be looked at.

And they also don't admit people with 35 ACTs and 2.0 GPAs. Their applications will be quickly filed. While don't the Ivies believe in the ACTs enough to let that kid in? Because they know how meaningless the test is.

These tests is great for broad classification (i.e. the 34 kid versus the 20 kid) but they fail miserably at finer levels (i.e. telling the difference between a 31 and 34) which is where we are at when talking about racial discrimination. I can't find with a quick google but somewhere they is a study about the GPA of an Ivy league school and the correlation with SAT scores. There is none. And again the same thing happens at every school that doesn't mandate standardized tests. The rest of the process does the job of filtering students just as well without the info.

If your paranoid, you would blame big test for why we keep sticking with them despite the known issues. Nothing like having a monopoly and captive market.

The correlation between test scores and GPAs is not as direct as would be expected because the smart kids go into STEM while the dumb kids go into liberal arts. The high test scorers earn high salaries while the low test scorers complain that they can't find a job with their art history degree or gender studies. You keep complaining but you arechasing your tail. The test isn't fair because rich kids have more resources so they score better. They get higher paying jobs so that their kids can also score higher and get better paying jobs. You complain about it but then try to spin it to claim that the netter scores done do any better. Then there tlreally isn't any problem if the outcomes are all the same. But you are completely incorrect. Smarter kids score better and they earn more. Asian kids are smartest and white kids are smarter. Black kids are the dumbest. Those are uncomfortable facts but everyone should be treated as an individual. You don't want that though.

There is no such thing as "bias" in standardized testing unless the graders are altering the scores of members of a particular group. It is impossible for everyone to score the same, and not all differences in test scores are due to racial discrimination. The fact that the NBA is 81% Black does not mean there was discrimination against non-Blacks.

The bias is built into the rules in the NBA. You have to be able to run fast and jump high and shoot the ball well. If they changed the rules so that points were not the determining factor, more whites would be in the league. Maybe the highest free throw percentage should win the game. Maybe to most completed passes should win the game. Maybe if there was no shot clock and if they weren't allowed to play defense within 5 feet of the 3 pt line, more whites would be in the league. So yes there is racial bias in the NBA.

No Bias wrote:

There is no such thing as "bias" in standardized testing unless the graders are altering the scores of members of a particular group. It is impossible for everyone to score the same, and not all differences in test scores are due to racial discrimination. The fact that the NBA is 81% Black does not mean there was discrimination against non-Blacks.

I'll say this again we are way off the topic of a "what a standardized test is" and "if they are biased".

"There is no such thing? " of course their is. If you speak English would I expect you to take a test that is in Spanish or vice versa?

To created a "standardized test" you have to use a reference population to create that standardization. That Cohort is the "reference group" you then compare a student too. That has built in biases from the start. Look we create things like reading benchmarks to let us know how individual students and schools are doing. There are many purposes for any different test. Most students have average scores. Students who are struggling are looked at to provide interventions with.

This is very complicated subject that can't be put easliy into a "yes" or "no".

* wrote:Questions like:

Spencer sold 20% of his high commodity index funds to make renovations on his 30 foot yacht.

If he purchased them at the beginning of polo season, on the weekend of which leg of the triple crown would he need to sell them to clear the average yield?

That's a perfect example right there of bias in testing. How many people of color can identify with commodity index funds and 30 foot yachts? It will be significantly less than many others........but you knew that already right? That's why you put that question there. To suck people into your troll. I have to admit, you got several pages of trolling going on so you did pretty good!

Out Trolling Again wrote:

* wrote:Questions like:

Spencer sold 20% of his high commodity index funds to make renovations on his 30 foot yacht.

If he purchased them at the beginning of polo season, on the weekend of which leg of the triple crown would he need to sell them to clear the average yield?

That's a perfect example right there of bias in testing. How many people of color can identify with commodity index funds and 30 foot yachts? It will be significantly less than many others........but you knew that already right? That's why you put that question there. To suck people into your troll. I have to admit, you got several pages of trolling going on so you did pretty good!

I think the joke was that this type of question doesn’t actually exist.

Jester the Tester wrote:

I think it is not so much the *test* is "biased", its that:

1. The education system is tilted toward White/Asian/wealthy-er people.

who

2. Are able (as wealthier people) to dedicate resources to their child's education and/or have

3. A cultural (or individual) predisposition to value education.

The test might have some bias but the bigger issue is that it EXPOSES bias in the system and in society.

Some of these biases are bad...poors often grow up in situations that can't/don't/won't prioritize education. Many never have a chance.

Some of these biases are not "bad"...the Asian/White/Wealthy tendency to be "all in" on education is not bad (some may take it too far) but its admirable in general.

You could have stopped when you said it favors those who value education. The rest is debatable.

Out Trolling Again wrote:

* wrote:Questions like:

Spencer sold 20% of his high commodity index funds to make renovations on his 30 foot yacht.

If he purchased them at the beginning of polo season, on the weekend of which leg of the triple crown would he need to sell them to clear the average yield?

That's a perfect example right there of bias in testing. How many people of color can identify with commodity index funds and 30 foot yachts? It will be significantly less than many others........but you knew that already right? That's why you put that question there. To suck people into your troll. I have to admit, you got several pages of trolling going on so you did pretty good!

I didn’t start the thread.

I was the first reply, poking fun at the subject.

The OP was deleted.

trashcan wrote:

(Without consulting the internet) subtract the date of Frederick Douglass’s birth from the date of Nat Turner’s rebellion (ok more like 9% and 7%, but the point holds).

Which part of the SAT tests factual knowledge? Word usage, math, logic, reasoning ability, that's all.

They don't ask "what year did the white French Emperor invade Russia" etc.