syakimi wrote:
Lmfaoo elderly beta-simps gonna hate on this video but can’t get these guys names out of their mouths.
Ha Silvia you don’t need to be a tool. Stop compensating for your upbringing.
syakimi wrote:
Lmfaoo elderly beta-simps gonna hate on this video but can’t get these guys names out of their mouths.
Ha Silvia you don’t need to be a tool. Stop compensating for your upbringing.
Mostly disagree with you. 100% agree about the sport being behind a paywall.
I do believe alcohol and gambling at meets could be huge. It would help people get in the door and then realize it's a fun time.
Of course we need more youth always, but Track & Field is the highest participation sport in most states, so we are already getting a huge chunk of youth. We just aren't doing anything with it.
Hardloper wrote:
Bullet_Proof wrote:
They earn media attention organically, by winning and running fast.
(George Costanza voice) Well there's no chance of that
1.) Evert Silva's videos have an average 20k views.
2.) Athlete special videos have an average 30k views.
3.) There are 2 Galen Rupp videos alone that have 200k+ views, the NBC sports episode recap interview with Galen post 2012 olympics, and a fan-made video.
Analysis: Galen Rupp earned more media attention than these try-hards by winning and running fast. These other guys are getting views because they are trying hard. They are spending hours of their own time editing videos or relying on volunteer time from a friend to shoot the videos. Thats a lot of effort to get 20k views. On another note, every time Galen has appeared on TV around the olympics earned millions of views because it aired on primetime tv, so judging views from a youtube recap video years later is a conservative estimate of reach.
The point is: these clowns (with the exception of athlete special because he actually has inspirational things to say) are buying attention by exerting tons of effort trying to promote themselves. Galen had other people coming to him to give him attention, thus the term, earned media.
It's similar to the Marvel Cinematic Universe. The movies have been so consistently successful themselves that there are a ton of fan-made videos because people want to talk about them. Thats FREE, ORGANIC marketing for Marvel.
I think we both care enough about long distance running to discuss its future. However I believe there are alternatives outside of the 2 options you noted to grow the sport.
1.) When you write that there are only 2 options to promote the sport, either be awesome like Galen Rupp and earn media attention or start a youtube channel, I think there are more than 2 options. How about old school stuff like becoming an assistant coach at a high school? Have you ever tried to recruit young kids to run? How about starting a cross country club for youth in middle school? How about volunteering as a running club leader for a local running shoes store? You could grow and promote the group any way you see fit. You could start a business that organizes virtual races. Or normal races. I could think of way more options to grow the sport than the 2 you noted.
2.) When you say "for anyone not in the top 5, that approach doesnt work," ..... work for what? Building a brand? How is that the goal? The goal in athletics is to be the best athlete you can be. It is NOT a popularity contest. Sure, Zach Levet is successful in bulding a brand....for himself. More and more of his videos are about finance and money. Because newsflash, videos on youtube about how to make money get the most views. His videos leave more of an impression of him and less of an impression of the time-tested ethos of running.
https://www.aspenprojectplay.org/youth-sports-facts/participation-ratesIndoor? wrote:
Mostly disagree with you. 100% agree about the sport being behind a paywall.
I do believe alcohol and gambling at meets could be huge. It would help people get in the door and then realize it's a fun time.
Of course we need more youth always, but Track & Field is the highest participation sport in most states, so we are already getting a huge chunk of youth. We just aren't doing anything with it.
This shows that 1.0% of children ages 6-12 regularly participated in track and field in 2018. Basketball and baseball are 13-14%, and soccer is 7%.
For track and cross country, the average age for the last regular participation is higher than almost every other sport, but the average duration of participation is also much shorter than almost all other sports.
This all means is that we have fewer kids doing track and cross country, they get started later, and they don’t stay interested in it very long. Seems like we don’t currently have a good recipe for growing the sport. Although there are lots of angles we can take to grow the sport, I still think it starts with trying to increase opportunities for regular participation in the sport among our youth. Participation in almost all youth sports is dying though, and track and field is no exception.
I was speaking at the HS level. Sure it'd be nice to get them earlier, but the fact is we are getting them now. We just need to do better with them while we have them.
4 nobodies talkin like they won an Olympic Gold medal
I looked up the Evert Silva kids TFRRS since he runs his mouth so much. 0x qualifier for NCAAs in track, best XC finish is 98th, 3:46, 8:02, 13:47 as a Junior... pretty weak times. His best performance being the 5k barely qualifies for regionals which he finished near last. This kid isn’t even in the top 50 in the ncaa so I can’t figure out why he barks so much. Reminds me of a chihuahua.
Yes; I didn't literally mean there are only two ways to grow the sport: You said you can "earn media attention organically" and you used some of the best runners in history as your examples. I was merely pointing out that the vast majority of runners will never be able to earn anywhere near that type of attention... so they don't have many other options but to create content.
The other examples you listed help promote the sport in different ways. (Side note: I actually am a coach so I get your points). Getting people involved in running obviously helps. We can and should do all those things. BUT, there is also the reality that people don't care too much about the professional side of running... which is what this podcast and thread is focused on. As mentioned before, Track and Field is one of the most participated sports in America (combining boys and girls). Road running gets by far the most mass participation by adults. (Millions runs road races and an estimated 60 million participated in running, jogging, or trail running in 2017 according to Statista). So there is a huge GAP between mass participation and interest in professional running. So we have to continue to keep the youth engaged, while also making the professional side of our sport more interesting to both youth and adults.
So how do you get attention? Just by running fast? Maybe, if you are really, really good. But for most people, their speed just isn't enough. I fully agree the goal of athletics is to be the best you can be...and you can argue runners don't need attention... and most don't because they aren't professionals. But if no one pays attention, then there's no money in it. Sadly, that's just how it is- and its true for every sport/activity. And you can't really be a 'professional' runner if you don't make money. So again, on the professional side of things, there kind of is only two options: Run really fast, or create good content. The 'content' is likely going to be more individual-based. So it can come across that people are selfishly creating content- which to some extent they are. But, it's a valid argument to say that their self-promotion can improve the sport as a whole. For example, some people that aren't world-class runners have popular running podcasts. When I'm a guest on the podcasts, I always get more followers on various social media platforms (which I don't care about too much on a personal level, but on a business level, it matters I guess... well I know it matters.. I just wish it didn't lol). Anyways, if I tag my wife in something, then she'll get more followers... and the more followers I accumulate, the more she gets in later tags. So it's a trickle down effect that started with some dude creating content. It's all based on More attention= more money. Attention isn't the ONLY factor, but it is a big factor... it just is. *Of course, I think the type of attention you create absolutely matters- especially long-term. So if/when a person is creating content, I personally think it should strike a balance of interesting, entertaining, and have an underlying message of positivity in some form.
So in conclusion, we need all of the above. Engaged youth and local clubs, Fast runners trying to be their best, AND good, fun, interesting content, that engages and represents various and diverse groups of people. For the most part, I know how to do those first two; I'm not so good at the content part. This podcast inspired me to get better at it- in my own way of course.
Well then at some point maybe these guys could actually produce some “good fun interesting content” for me to pay any attention to them.
With all due respect - yeah, no sh!t that little kids don't like to run in circles for no reason. Running is not going to be a huge draw, and some would argue is not particularly healthy for many kids that young. I would think most kids start track and field would be at the end of middle school to highschool range.
syakimi wrote:
Lmfaoo elderly beta-simps gonna hate on this video but can’t get these guys names out of their mouths.
Evert, you giant douche, you are going to barely run faster than your current 5k pr in the next year and a half you’re in school. Well, actually, you will probably do six years in school to take advantage of the COVID shirt, lack of progression, and lack of brain usage.
What you are doing right now will mean nothing in three years because you are wasting your talent, which you have a ton of, being a pretend distance runner.
Guys that are faster than you, not just slower, are aware that you are a towel. Just because someone exposes who you are doesn’t make them a beta simp. Aren’t you supposed to be 22 soon? You act like a high schooler. If you want any shot of being a “pro” runner, because I have no idea what else you will do, you better mature.
I agree. That’s kind of why I think it’s just the nature of the sport that is not going to allow us to grow significantly. To most people, it’s just boring and that’s all there is to it. If you polish a turd, it’s still a turd. I’m content with our sport not being very popular. I don’t think our sport will ever go away due to how easy it is for anyone to participate and how low-cost it is. I don’t think it will ever be a big revenue generator in America.
bsighbdkxj wrote:
I agree. That’s kind of why I think it’s just the nature of the sport that is not going to allow us to grow significantly..
The most popular spectator sport in America is a bunch of silly looking cars driving around an oval track for 3 hours. Running is not hopeless.
If you compressed the US National Championships down to a single 90-minute broadcast for
every men's and women's track event below 5K, and then held it on the same day every year (4th of July), people would watch it.
Great post. I agree with most of it. I see now how youtube can be one way - out of many - to promote the sport. I just dont like the vanity aspect of it. Rubs me the wrong way.
To answer your question about how to garner more interest in professional long distance running, Ill give it a shot.
Similar to tennis, running should have the equivalent of grand slams. Everyone knows that a lot is on the line at a grand slam, US open, australian open, wimbledon, etc. If there was a way to generate hype around certain races within the US, then people would know that there is a lot on the line to win. Also that the runners would earn money as a result of winning. These types of ideas have already been hashed out in other threads much more thoroughly than I am doing here...
But I think the answer lies somewhere in focusing on the competition aspect of it. And focusing on the competition itself, and emphasizing how high the stakes are. That there is a clear winner. And loser. And that winning brings a significant recognition.
I just find it funny if you sum up all their subs you still have less than some little known gardening youtube channels. Much less outdoors content much less science based content... Their brands are tiny in the realm of youtube/insta. They may be changing a sport but more people care about the top 10 things they should/shouldn't grow in their flower beds than their running content... and I don't see forms dedicated how a youtube page is changing the hobby of gardening so I'm gonna say they have minimal impact on the sport...
All that being said watching their videos do inspire me... to go out and beat them in races just like I beat Levet last year at CIM along with 100+ others
y’all washed up 40somthings need to chill out
these guys (apart from evert) are trying to figure out a way to keep this sport profitable and alive. All media these days with younger generations is based around personality. I get that y’all don’t see that in whatever content y’all consume but stuff like this is crucial for keeping the sport alive
If the sport isn’t in the public’s eye and profitable then we just get more college teams cut. People like these guys and the countless other who will pop up after them are the future of keeping out sport afloat.
Sure they’re not the top athletes performing at the highest possible level but that’s not really the point. The point is getting young people engaged. The number of kids who were inspired to work harder and join xc because of easton alreds NXN vlogs at my school alone is genuinely fascinating. Guys and gals like these folks are going to keep our sport alive with zoomers/alpha gen regardless if you like it or think it’s the best way to go on.
Loved OPs take.
Nothing wrong with using social media platforms to self promote. I encourage it if anyone cared what I suggest.
That’s not the criticism from me. My problem here is these guys, especially Evert, are massive tools and extremely unlikable.
Patently false. These guys have the clear aim of carving out a career in the sport based on something that has basically nothing to do with their performance or highlighting anothers' performance. It's highly masturbatory. This would be like if the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders started youtube channels about their lives as cheerleaders but never showed or said anything about the Dallas Cowboys. Sure someone would watch but it has nothing to do with football or performance excellence, it's just vapidly selling personality.
Non sequitur, their "work" has nothing to do with any college team's existence or success. No races or meets are possibly going to fold because not enough people watched The Athlete Special shotgun a hard seltzer.
So what is that "fascinating" number, since you are making the claim? You are aware that high school cross country and track doesn't suffer from lack of numbers, right? That for decades they have consistently led all other sports in participation nationally, right? And so what does that engagement lead to? More donations to college programs? More shoe contracts for post-collegians? Or next to nothing outside of their own ad revenue and t-shirt sales?
Well yours sucks.
Great post. +1