It took me about two years to get from 70 or so to 120 and above. That was from before my junior year in college to the summer after graduating. I also did not run that volume all year long. I had two build up phases in a year , one was about three months long and other about six weeks. The rest of the time I was around 100-110 in a typical week. But whatever the distance I did usually had a short day each week. This should be an extended process for you with an end result that's sustainable rather than something you push really hard for but cannot keep doing. As long as you're posting stuff here I'll be watching whether I'm chiming in or not.
The High Mileage Test (Inspired by NIKE FREE ME) Training Log
College Running
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Hey man, I think this is great. I wish you well in your endeavor, and I think you will see huge gains down the road. I also would ignore all discussion about pace at this point, and just let the pace come to you over time as you get fit. You will hit some faster paces naturally on your progression runs anyway.
However, I'm not sure why you jumped right into a 120 mile week and now want to get to 140. You need to give your body time to adjust. A couple weeks at 100, then 110, down week, a couple weeks at 120, 130, down week, etc. The body is a amazing adaptation machine, but you have to let it adapt. I get that easier running allows for more recovery, but it's also more time spent on your feet.
Another way to look at this is to run for time instead of mileage. Like the guy who said aim for 14 hours per week. That is a solid goal, and maybe where you should start, letting the fitness come to you over time. And it will. In any event, I attempted something like this, but ran my miles way too fast and got a career-ending injury. I think this is a two-year process minimum, and you are in the "training to train" phase. -
bump. best of luck. may your feet find soft surfaces as much as is practical.
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HRE - I'm glad you'll be around here, you definitely know your stuff. Also, I ended up accidentally doing what you suggested, I don't just stop when I hit a certain mileage, I usually hit 7.1, 13.3 or something like that and it's added up to the point where I should have a pretty easy day this week. So far I feel pretty good.
Nenow fan - I know it's not the smartest thing to jump straight into the mileage, but it's something I've wanted to try. Paces are already coming down a little at the same HR as I get back in shape. As of today I'm at about 135 miles for the last 7 days and it's honestly easier than I thought it would be, I feel fresher than when I was hitting 110 at sub 7 average. Obviously that might change after a few more weeks, but I'm not as tired as I expected. The only injury I've been worried about is a stress fracture, but I feel like trying to run on soft surfaces and not pushing the pace should help and I have never had any bone issues before, so hopefully I'll stay lucky.
TheFastestSlow - Thanks, it's been a lot of running on the side of the road in that crappy gravel, but I get about 50/50, so I think it works.
I'm trying to avoid daily updates, but something interesting (at least to me) happened. Monday - Wednesday my left hip got pretty tight and I had to work it out a lot and it was getting better, but still pretty tight before Wednesday's midweek LR. I ended up running it on the treadmill (which was not as mentally draining as expected) and the next day (today) it feels like I'm a new person even though I ran almost 45 miles the last 2 days. Anyways, next workout is tomorrow and if more people comment, I'll update in one of my replies, otherwise I'll update again Sunday or Monday. -
The only one with good advice on here has been HRE as usual. Don't listen to any of these other guys ESPECIALLY not you know who when he eventually shows up. NAU guys run slow on their easy days, not as slow as you but they are much faster than you are. Many other pros are running recovery runs slower than you are, you need to make sure you recover especially on the outset. Detractors on here may have good advice when it comes to workouts but don't take any advice regarding easy runs and recovery runs. Good luck.
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adidas free me wrote:
TheFastestSlow - Thanks, it's been a lot of running on the side of the road in that crappy gravel, but I get about 50/50, so I think it works.
I'm trying to avoid daily updates, but something interesting (at least to me) happened. Monday - Wednesday my left hip got pretty tight and I had to work it out a lot and it was getting better, but still pretty tight before Wednesday's midweek LR. I ended up running it on the treadmill (which was not as mentally draining as expected) and the next day (today) it feels like I'm a new person even though I ran almost 45 miles the last 2 days. Anyways, next workout is tomorrow and if more people comment, I'll update in one of my replies, otherwise I'll update again Sunday or Monday.
A treadmill doesn't have inclines, holes, and dips. Very wise of you though, I look forward to this thread. -
adidas free me wrote:
HRE - I'm glad you'll be around here, you definitely know your stuff. Also, I ended up accidentally doing what you suggested, I don't just stop when I hit a certain mileage, I usually hit 7.1, 13.3 or something like that and it's added up to the point where I should have a pretty easy day this week. So far I feel pretty good.
Nenow fan - I know it's not the smartest thing to jump straight into the mileage, but it's something I've wanted to try. Paces are already coming down a little at the same HR as I get back in shape. As of today I'm at about 135 miles for the last 7 days and it's honestly easier than I thought it would be, I feel fresher than when I was hitting 110 at sub 7 average. Obviously that might change after a few more weeks, but I'm not as tired as I expected. The only injury I've been worried about is a stress fracture, but I feel like trying to run on soft surfaces and not pushing the pace should help and I have never had any bone issues before, so hopefully I'll stay lucky.
TheFastestSlow - Thanks, it's been a lot of running on the side of the road in that crappy gravel, but I get about 50/50, so I think it works.
I'm trying to avoid daily updates, but something interesting (at least to me) happened. Monday - Wednesday my left hip got pretty tight and I had to work it out a lot and it was getting better, but still pretty tight before Wednesday's midweek LR. I ended up running it on the treadmill (which was not as mentally draining as expected) and the next day (today) it feels like I'm a new person even though I ran almost 45 miles the last 2 days. Anyways, next workout is tomorrow and if more people comment, I'll update in one of my replies, otherwise I'll update again Sunday or Monday.
Ok, well, just be careful. I think it would be smart to proactively work in a down week soon, maybe only 70 miles or so. The fatigue and wear and tear on your body is cumulative, but, if you are smart about this and take some down weeks or a day off here and there, it will boost your chances of success.
I wanted to be right where you are, but I was too impatient. If I would’ve had a coach to help me realize this was a two-year plan and not a six-twelve month plan to run a bunch of PRs, I’m pretty sure I would’ve had amazing success.
Btw, if you would shoot for the goal of two hours per day, eventually you will be averaging 140 miles at 7 min per mile pace. Your body will be able to do that gradually. And that will set you up for some really fast times. -
fan of Nenow wrote:
Btw, if you would shoot for the goal of two hours per day, eventually you will be averaging 140 miles at 7 min per mile pace. Your body will be able to do that gradually. And that will set you up for some really fast times.
Make that 120. 6 min pace is 140. Still, the point stands. You will get there. -
It's neat seeing someone do what you're doing. Glad it's going well so far.
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How'd the week go?
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Previous Week - 120.33 miles
Week 2: 12/7 - 12/13
Monday - 7.17 @ 8:24 / 11.01 @ 8:16 w/ 6 light strides
Tuesday - 8.14 @ 8:29 w/ 9 short hill sprints + 2 downhill strides / 14.00 @ 7:18 w/ 12x600 on (2:02) 200 jog rec. (35 min @ ~ 6:05/mi)
Wednesday - 7.03 @ 8:35 / 15.00 @ 8:06 (Treadmill)
Thursday - 7.20 @ 8:25 / 11.08 @ 8:01 w/ 5 light strides
Friday - 8.32 @ 8:34 w/ 12 short hill sprints + 2 downhill strides / 14.30 @ 7:25 w/ the first 55:41 a Progression (8 mi w/ the last one @ 6:10) + 6x40 sec hill sprints w/ 2 min jog rec
Saturday - 7.00 @ 8:36 (Treadmill) / 6.75 @ 8:05 (Treadmill)
Sunday - 8.03 @ 8:11 / 16.07 @ 7:11 (last 3 miles all in the 6:20s)
Total - 141.10 miles
(Treadmill is set to 2% incline)
An interesting week, but nothing too crazy (other than the mileage). Tuesday went better than expected, I thought I'd be lucky to average under 6 min/mi for the 600s, so I was happy to see that. I felt surprisingly good Thursday, nothing crazy, just good. Friday I didn't feel too hot, it also just snowed so footing was iffy going fast, which made the hills feel even harder, but my legs also just didn't want to move in general. I felt very good today on the long run, I only planned on going 15 miles (ran 8 in the morning because I didn't think I would make 16 in 2 hours), but I felt good and just went an hour out and came back faster. Really surprised to feel my best on the last day of the week, but I think yesterday only being 13.75 miles helped with that.
ShilohDoesntCare - Thanks for the support
ElGuerroujFan - True, but I don't run very hilly routes or on uneven terrain (except the side of the road, but that's not everyday), I think the treadmill is basically just a soft surface when running this much.
fan of Nenow - I get what you're saying, but I feel like I can handle this amount of running, maybe you'll be saying I told you so later though. If I dropped down to 2 hours of running per day, I feel like I wouldn't be getting much out of it now, which I know isn't true, I'd just have to pick up the pace a bit, but then I'm basically just doing something different from what I set out to do.
HRE - Thanks!
TheFastestSlow - I think it went well, what do you think? -
adidas free me wrote:
Previous Week - 120.33 miles
Week 2: 12/7 - 12/13
Monday - 7.17 @ 8:24 / 11.01 @ 8:16 w/ 6 light strides
Tuesday - 8.14 @ 8:29 w/ 9 short hill sprints + 2 downhill strides / 14.00 @ 7:18 w/ 12x600 on (2:02) 200 jog rec. (35 min @ ~ 6:05/mi)
Wednesday - 7.03 @ 8:35 / 15.00 @ 8:06 (Treadmill)
Thursday - 7.20 @ 8:25 / 11.08 @ 8:01 w/ 5 light strides
Friday - 8.32 @ 8:34 w/ 12 short hill sprints + 2 downhill strides / 14.30 @ 7:25 w/ the first 55:41 a Progression (8 mi w/ the last one @ 6:10) + 6x40 sec hill sprints w/ 2 min jog rec
Saturday - 7.00 @ 8:36 (Treadmill) / 6.75 @ 8:05 (Treadmill)
Sunday - 8.03 @ 8:11 / 16.07 @ 7:11 (last 3 miles all in the 6:20s)
Total - 141.10 miles
(Treadmill is set to 2% incline)
An interesting week, but nothing too crazy (other than the mileage). Tuesday went better than expected, I thought I'd be lucky to average under 6 min/mi for the 600s, so I was happy to see that. I felt surprisingly good Thursday, nothing crazy, just good. Friday I didn't feel too hot, it also just snowed so footing was iffy going fast, which made the hills feel even harder, but my legs also just didn't want to move in general. I felt very good today on the long run, I only planned on going 15 miles (ran 8 in the morning because I didn't think I would make 16 in 2 hours), but I felt good and just went an hour out and came back faster. Really surprised to feel my best on the last day of the week, but I think yesterday only being 13.75 miles helped with that.
ShilohDoesntCare - Thanks for the support
ElGuerroujFan - True, but I don't run very hilly routes or on uneven terrain (except the side of the road, but that's not everyday), I think the treadmill is basically just a soft surface when running this much.
fan of Nenow - I get what you're saying, but I feel like I can handle this amount of running, maybe you'll be saying I told you so later though. If I dropped down to 2 hours of running per day, I feel like I wouldn't be getting much out of it now, which I know isn't true, I'd just have to pick up the pace a bit, but then I'm basically just doing something different from what I set out to do.
HRE - Thanks!
TheFastestSlow - I think it went well, what do you think?
So far so good! I'm glad you're holding up well and I hope you're enjoying it. I'll be rooting for you. I hope this works well for you. Just remember to have patience. A lot of people make the mistake with big mileage in that they expect quick improvements, which seldom happens. It may take several months or even a year or more for you to adapt to this type of training. Good luck! -
Nice!
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wow that kind of mileage bump and already quality coming in. while i know many might say to hold off on quality until thorough adaptation to volume occurs, in my personal experience, quality is important to keeping my gait and hormones healthy - not to mention keeping staleness and boredom at bay. all this said, i’ve only really held 100+ weeks for maybe 6 weeks in a row in my life.
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you’ve inspired me to pursue a little high mileage test of my own over the winter. i’m only at 75 mpw so it will take me a month to get up above 100 mpw but thanks for stoking the flame. damn i need to start waking up a little earlier and losing a few lbs wouldn’t hurt neither. stupid delicious foods being delicious and food-like.
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adidas free me wrote:
Previous Week - 120.33 miles
Week 2: 12/7 - 12/13
Monday - 7.17 @ 8:24 / 11.01 @ 8:16 w/ 6 light strides
Tuesday - 8.14 @ 8:29 w/ 9 short hill sprints + 2 downhill strides / 14.00 @ 7:18 w/ 12x600 on (2:02) 200 jog rec. (35 min @ ~ 6:05/mi)
Wednesday - 7.03 @ 8:35 / 15.00 @ 8:06 (Treadmill)
Thursday - 7.20 @ 8:25 / 11.08 @ 8:01 w/ 5 light strides
Friday - 8.32 @ 8:34 w/ 12 short hill sprints + 2 downhill strides / 14.30 @ 7:25 w/ the first 55:41 a Progression (8 mi w/ the last one @ 6:10) + 6x40 sec hill sprints w/ 2 min jog rec
Saturday - 7.00 @ 8:36 (Treadmill) / 6.75 @ 8:05 (Treadmill)
Sunday - 8.03 @ 8:11 / 16.07 @ 7:11 (last 3 miles all in the 6:20s)
Total - 141.10 miles
(Treadmill is set to 2% incline)
An interesting week, but nothing too crazy (other than the mileage). Tuesday went better than expected, I thought I'd be lucky to average under 6 min/mi for the 600s, so I was happy to see that. I felt surprisingly good Thursday, nothing crazy, just good. Friday I didn't feel too hot, it also just snowed so footing was iffy going fast, which made the hills feel even harder, but my legs also just didn't want to move in general. I felt very good today on the long run, I only planned on going 15 miles (ran 8 in the morning because I didn't think I would make 16 in 2 hours), but I felt good and just went an hour out and came back faster. Really surprised to feel my best on the last day of the week, but I think yesterday only being 13.75 miles helped with that.
ShilohDoesntCare - Thanks for the support
ElGuerroujFan - True, but I don't run very hilly routes or on uneven terrain (except the side of the road, but that's not everyday), I think the treadmill is basically just a soft surface when running this much.
fan of Nenow - I get what you're saying, but I feel like I can handle this amount of running, maybe you'll be saying I told you so later though. If I dropped down to 2 hours of running per day, I feel like I wouldn't be getting much out of it now, which I know isn't true, I'd just have to pick up the pace a bit, but then I'm basically just doing something different from what I set out to do.
HRE - Thanks!
TheFastestSlow - I think it went well, what do you think?
Well, excellent. You know your body better than anyone. May I suggest you take a down week, like cut the mileage by 30% for a week? I really want to see you succeed. -
that good stuff - keep up the good work.
just wanted to add some of my experiences about high mileage (to add to what you are experiencing). I was never a high mileage runner in high school or college or even after college for many years....then
I wonder if it was possible to do 2 longs run in a row....so i did a 20 miler and the next day another. It went fine. so i did 3 days in a row a few week later (still, no big deal) i was surprised at how quickly the body seems to adapt. i was running these at a pretty good pace too.
then over one winter break, we has some nice weather so i thought i am just going to run 20 a day for as long as i can. Each subsequent day i would start out feeling bad, tired - thinking there is no way i am making 20 today. But strangely enough mid way through the run i would get faster and feel fine and end up making it another 20. in fact my total time each day was slightly progressing. i was running probably 6:40's = so these were not jog-fests. i made in 9 days and was feeling good/strong. on the last day a big snow was coming so i knew this would be the last day of the streak, so i went as far as i could (26 miles). so for a 7 day stretch i hit 146 (the most for me by far). I had probably only run over 100 miles in a week a couple of times before this.
the down side:
there was none. i think if the weather had been good i would have just kept knocking out 20 milers because the body had adapted and they were no longer a big deal. The following summer i had no trouble getting back up to 130+ miles. i think i ran 20 weeks where i ave'ed 149 miles a week.
currently just trying build back to a single long run of 17....but your thread is inspiring me. i hit two of them in a row last week and felt good.
i especially like how your coach has you including some faster running in there a few times per week. that is what i was not doing during my 9 day stretch (but i was running sub 7:00 so i didn't think i was losing any speed either).
clearly what you have done in two weeks is working because you were able to handle the mileage increase and then your workouts were better than you expected. that is exactly what i experienced. as long as your body is adapting you will find this to be the case (where you out preform your expectations). As soon as it starts to slip though - take a single day off. Many time that is enough to reset the body - big deal if that week's mileage is down a little.
one thing that i did that helped me maintain those 20 weeks at nearly 150 miles was i would not try to run doubles everyday. in a week, with 14 possible runs, i would probably run 10-11 times. Any time i felt i really needed it, i would take a 1/2 day off. that helped soooo much. and when i ran the next time, i felt so good. -
agc5k - Thanks! I'm definitely planning to run my best my senior year and beyond, but I do also hope to PR this coming indoor or outdoor season.
happens - It's really not a ton of quality, not a single mile sub 5:30, just some 600s at 5:30 ish. I do agree it helps keep me motivated and feeling a little fresher, but I think as long as you do strides, you should feel fresher in general. Glad you're thinking of getting back up there!
fan of Nenow - I will probably take a down week next week, but not by 30%. I'm thinking if I need a rest day, I'll take it, but if not, I'll just dip down to 130 by taking my shorter days even shorter. I just don't see the point in going that much lower if I feel good. If I feel like absolute crap, I'll definitely go down a lot though for a bit.
jerrry - That's a cool way of testing out the mileage and 6:40s is no joke for that amount! I'd guess you probably did lose a little speed if you weren't doing sprints or hard strides, but your aerobic base must've been massive. I agree with your thoughts on taking a day off, I like to feel run down before I even think of taking a day off and the day off usually cures that feeling. I will keep the doubles thing in mind, but I honestly prefer to double everyday, it keeps it all a routine, makes hitting the mileage easier, and I avoid long slogs trying to hit the mileage. I cannot imagine running 20 miles straight each day, but 8 and 16 is almost easy (especially after a 7 and 7 day).
Quick update: The top of my left foot is having some issues, I've dealt with them before and it usually goes away in a couple days, but it's the first actual pain I've had yet for anyone keeping track. If I can't get through the workout tomorrow, I'll take Wednesday off, but I'm staying optimistic (because I've dealt with literally this exact thing before, it's usually when I tie my shoes too tight and I think I did on Sunday, which doesn't help when you do 24 miles). Everything else feels great! -
not trying to have a triggered talk about nutrition, just a plain, brass tacks one.
so you went from lower mpw way up to where you are now. your furnace is probably ablaze, in comparison to before high mileage - but there is not always a 1-for-1 linear relationship between appetite and mileage.
how do you eat enough/not too much around 2 runs a day and has it been at all challenging to meet the energy demands while not having too much in the stomach when it comes time to run?
i’m personally finding that liquid calories help for pre-/post-run, never been a big drink mix person but if i want 250-500 calories before, during and after a 15-miler i can do that and not have to feel like my real food is playing catch-up. thoughts? -
i'll give you my answer to this. Because you are running at fat burning paces, there is not a major increase in calories needed.
