LUIS MF GRIJALVA WINS IN 13:16 OVER COOPER TEARE AND DREW HUNTER

go run fast wrote:

Great measure of failure. That means every US runner and every runner in the world has a bad coach and is a failure, other than Cheptegei. Stupid Jerry. None of his runners are world record holders.

Congrats on entirely missing the point. His point was that 23 is not a "young buck" any more, especially when you've been a pro for 4.5 years. Everyone has this idea of Hunter as a perpetual high schooler, but the fact is he hasn't produced stellar results after a number of years. He doesn't have the youth excuse any longer.

` wrote:

go run fast wrote:

Great measure of failure. That means every US runner and every runner in the world has a bad coach and is a failure, other than Cheptegei. Stupid Jerry. None of his runners are world record holders.

Congrats on entirely missing the point. His point was that 23 is not a "young buck" any more, especially when you've been a pro for 4.5 years. Everyone has this idea of Hunter as a perpetual high schooler, but the fact is he hasn't produced stellar results after a number of years. He doesn't have the youth excuse any longer.

That's true-ish, but East African runners' ages are notoriously wrong, so not the best example. That also shows why you can't use "average age of top 50 performances" as a reliable metric.

I think most legitimate 23 year olds should expect to have a couple years til their peak, regardless of whether or not they've been pro.

` wrote:

go run fast wrote:

Great measure of failure. That means every US runner and every runner in the world has a bad coach and is a failure, other than Cheptegei. Stupid Jerry. None of his runners are world record holders.

Congrats on entirely missing the point. His point was that 23 is not a "young buck" any more, especially when you've been a pro for 4.5 years. Everyone has this idea of Hunter as a perpetual high schooler, but the fact is he hasn't produced stellar results after a number of years. He doesn't have the youth excuse any longer.

23 is still young. It’s just that American distance running has gotten so much better in the past few years in terms of depth. 13:17 coming off a year with significant injury is pretty damn good. I agree he should be running faster, but, improvement isn’t a straight line. I say give him 2-3 more years to really make a judgement call. If he makes an Olympic team and/or runs 3:33/13:0x, then he’s where he should be.

But, I agree with posters who have argued that maybe he should move up to the 10,000 and/or find new training partners that will help him up his game if he doesn’t have a stellar 2021. We will see. I’m guessing he’s significantly faster 6-12 mos from now, barring another injury, but, if he’s not, it’s probably time to re-evaluate the training.

One disadvantage I think high altitude athletes have is that they can’t really run the “top end” workouts or polish finishing speed.

I agree that it is objectively "young", but when you're consistently being beaten by kids younger than you, then you no longer have the crutch of youth to fall back on and dismiss your underwhelming performances.

Don't worry about him. He will be an olympian. It is amazing of how good you think this guy is. Seems like you think he has the talent to run 12:50 right now under a different coach. Most of us are more realistic.

At 23, Rupp was a 13:14 guy with a crappy kick after being groomed/coached by now-banned Salazar for years.

Hunter is not and will not be Rupp, but arguing that someone who just ran a PR at 23 is done improving seems idiotic.

The American sub 13 guys were already listed in another thread as having ran their PR at the average age of 28 and most of them were slower at 23 than what Hunter is.

John Macardle wrote:

At 23, Rupp was a 13:14 guy with a crappy kick after being groomed/coached by now-banned Salazar for years.

Hunter is not and will not be Rupp, but arguing that someone who just ran a PR at 23 is done improving seems idiotic.

I didn't argue anything of the sort.

Hunter for the Win wrote:

Don't worry about him. He will be an olympian. It is amazing of how good you think this guy is. Seems like you think he has the talent to run 12:50 right now under a different coach. Most of us are more realistic.

I think he has the talent to run 13:05-13:10 under a different coach. I still don't think he'll make an olympic team, even with those marks. The field is too deep.

Actually, right on for Drew, one second for Luis. Throw in two seconds for Jenna Hutchins and I am 3/3 with a second of leeway/5000.

No one predicts better on a consistency basis. 48 years in the game is worth something, even if my legs won't behave like they used to!

What are you predicting for Hutchins on the track other than her 5k?