For those who oppose restrictions and won’t take the vaccine

flying squirrel wrote:

1101 wrote:

So . . . getting vaccinated against smallpox was "being a coward?" Wearing seatbelts is "being a coward?" How about stopping at red lights? Is that "being a coward", too? Heck, I'd say having working brakes in your car is probably "being a coward." Amiright?

Ahh, there are real risks to not wearing a seatbelt or stopping at a stop light. Again, let's look at the fatality rate for covid. 99.997%. The risk of a rushed vaccine is much more dangerous. Look at the efficacy of any vaccine. Flu is 40 percent at best. Are you that naive to think that fake immunity has no risks? Why is there a vaccine court? Do you know anything about retroviruses (virus fragments born from cultured animal cells?). The big difference is that wearing a seatbelt doesn't have a possible more lethal downside. Same with the simpleton stop light analogy.

Yeah, good point. 264,000 dead indicates no "real risk".

And great job cherry picking the flu vaccine. I can definitely see how its 40% efficacy is very relevant to the apparent 95% efficacy of the COVID vaccine.

Oh, and I love your 99.997% fatality rate for COVID. Perhaps you meant 99.997% survival rate? Odd then, that there have been 264 thousand deaths in the US. That would indicate that 9 Billion Americans have contracted COVID. Fascinating, in a population of 330 million. Or perhaps math works differently in your alternate universe.

Seriously, do you have any brain cells at all? Any at all?

Let's tell it like it is wrote:

The average age of someone who dies from Covid in the U.S. is around 78 yrs old. If you're under 70 and are heathly, the chances of dying from this virus is extremely low and virtually nonexistent for those under 20.

This coronavirus has been overblown and hyped up to create fear & hysteria so people will be more compliant to take the vaccine. A vaccine that's been rushed through the trials with insufficient safety data that may not even stop the transmission.

Open everything up and move on.

Good point! Because 78 year-olds aren't really human beings anyway.

calamity jane wrote:

Herd immunity wrote:

Sweden had a little mini-bump in deaths in early November that is already trending back down again. They've had it right all along.

Nope. Every seven days they hit a peak. Their daily cases are like a series of ocean waves; up then down every seven days. That is not possible. What it means that there is a delay in getting data from certain parts of the country. Those areas only seem to report once a week, or less.

Can you post a link with a graph that supports this?

Sally Vicks wrote:

For those who oppose restrictions and won’t take the vaccine what’s your end goal?

As far as I know we aren’t seeing herd immunity.

So you want to leave everything open but also not take a vaccine.

How does this play out if we all followed your advice?

Genuine question.

I don’t see why I can’t personally have it both ways. At least half the population will get antibodies through the vaccine. People like me, who didn’t change their life at all (going to work, going to bars, restaurants, weddings, etc) will just get the antibodies through constant exposure to virus and thus won’t need the vaccine.

browski wrote:

calamity jane wrote:

Nope. Every seven days they hit a peak. Their daily cases are like a series of ocean waves; up then down every seven days. That is not possible. What it means that there is a delay in getting data from certain parts of the country. Those areas only seem to report once a week, or less.

Can you post a link with a graph that supports this?

You never heard of Worldometer? You are not qualified to question my post if you do not have that rudimentary knowledge.

Now, it is up to you to figure out how to use the link below to find the data, the graphs, the options for rolling averages, and dates and number that show up on the graphs (which you can only solve if you are smart enough to do it with a standard internet stock market chart). Can you do it? Probably not.

The comment you were replying to was discussing deaths, not cases. I didn't realize you were talking about cases. I was looking at deaths in connection with the other poster's comment. There was a bump in early November and now it is back down. We can talk about cases forever, but they really mean nothing without looking at deaths or minimally hospitalizations.

Sally Vicks wrote:

browski wrote:

While we may not be there (herd immunity) now, we are on our way. The vaccine will provide a faster route to it, but if we aren't getting there, then you wouldn't see a place like NYC faring so much better than other parts of the country. It's not that we're so much more compliant here, it's that it already ripped through us.

I have zero intent on getting this vaccine.

How long until we’d have herd immunity?

Refusal to get the vaccine will kill the economy.

Some people have spent the entire pandemic warning about the economy instead of the health implications of COVID.

Now there's a vaccine, the same people want to screw the economy for longer because of the health implications of vaccines.

I hear some anger and projection in your tone. Your amygdala must be going crazy. Don't worry, I won't personalize your attack. Ignorance is part of the human condition. Do you really believe 264000 died? Even when states came out with their illegitimate covid deaths they did not change the numbers. Say in your dark wet dreams the number is accurate 264000 is still not that many people. Again, the average covid death is 4 years over the average life expectancy. Protect the old people.

It's interesting that you believe the covid vaccine has a 95 percent efficacy rate for a disease that is asymptomatic in 90percent of the people and wait for it... You can't have symptoms and get the vaccine. Can you read between the lines on this one?

You should go home and ask your grandma about the polio vaccine. What about the Norwegian study ( narcolepsy and h1n1). Bells palsey and the flu?

The ignorant self righteous is the real threat out there. I hope you are first in line to get your covid vax.

Sally Vicks wrote:

browski wrote:

While we may not be there (herd immunity) now, we are on our way. The vaccine will provide a faster route to it, but if we aren't getting there, then you wouldn't see a place like NYC faring so much better than other parts of the country. It's not that we're so much more compliant here, it's that it already ripped through us.

I have zero intent on getting this vaccine.

It’s not working out that way in Sweden.

You sound so smart and righteous. Really caring too.

1101 wrote:

Oh, and I love your 99.997% fatality rate for COVID. Perhaps you meant 99.997% survival rate? Odd then, that there have been 264 thousand deaths in the US. That would indicate that 9 Billion Americans have contracted COVID. Fascinating, in a population of 330 million. Or perhaps math works differently in your alternate universe.

Seriously, do you have any brain cells at all? Any at all?

And you believe all those people died OF COVID-19?

Seriously, do you have any brain cells at all? Any at all?

Sigh...

https://www.unz.com/chopkins/the-covidian-cult/

browski wrote:

The comment you were replying to was discussing deaths, not cases. I didn't realize you were talking about cases. I was looking at deaths in connection with the other poster's comment. There was a bump in early November and now it is back down. We can talk about cases forever, but they really mean nothing without looking at deaths or minimally hospitalizations.

You simply are not qualified to comment. Inflections lag deaths. That is how infections work -- they take their time to do their work. Sweden’s 7-day moving average for infections reached an all-time peak yesterday. A corresponding increase in deaths is coming, just it has everywhere else in the world.

Tatar wrote:

Now there's a vaccine, the same people want to screw the economy for longer because of the health implications of vaccines.

And, as was demanded of me, where is your link supporting your claim?

calamity jane wrote:

browski wrote:

The comment you were replying to was discussing deaths, not cases. I didn't realize you were talking about cases. I was looking at deaths in connection with the other poster's comment. There was a bump in early November and now it is back down. We can talk about cases forever, but they really mean nothing without looking at deaths or minimally hospitalizations.

You simply are not qualified to comment. Inflections lag deaths. That is how infections work -- they take their time to do their work. Sweden’s 7-day moving average for infections reached an all-time peak yesterday. A corresponding increase in deaths is coming, just it has everywhere else in the world.

You realize you are saying what people have been saying for 8 months now, right? Just to be clear.

Before COVID-19 appeared, the projection was for 2.6 Million people to die in the US from Jan. 1 to Nov. 24, 2020.

Many of those 264,000 people classified as COVID-19 deaths would have died in 2020 regardless of any COVID-19 infection. They would have been part of the 2.9 Million who, before COVID-19 appeared, were projected to die in the US for the full year 2020.

The Illinois Director of Public Health explained it:

Dr. Ezike explained that anyone who passes away after testing positive for the virus is included in that category.

"If you were in hospice and had already been given a few weeks to live, and then you also were found to have COVID, that would be counted as a COVID death. It means technically even if you died of a clear alternate cause, but you had COVID at the same time, it's still listed as a COVID death. So, everyone who's listed as a COVID death doesn't mean that that was the cause of the death, but they had COVID at the time of the death." Dr. Ezike outlined.

browski wrote:

While we may not be there (herd immunity) now, we are on our way. The vaccine will provide a faster route to it, but if we aren't getting there, then you wouldn't see a place like NYC faring so much better than other parts of the country. It's not that we're so much more compliant here, it's that it already ripped through us.

I have zero intent on getting this vaccine.

"Herd immunity is the only way!!!1 But, no, I don't believe in it enough to get the vaccine."

Sheesh you guys need to coordinate your talking points.

Harambe wrote:

browski wrote:

While we may not be there (herd immunity) now, we are on our way. The vaccine will provide a faster route to it, but if we aren't getting there, then you wouldn't see a place like NYC faring so much better than other parts of the country. It's not that we're so much more compliant here, it's that it already ripped through us.

I have zero intent on getting this vaccine.

"Herd immunity is the only way!!!1 But, no, I don't believe in it enough to get the vaccine."

Sheesh you guys need to coordinate your talking points.

Hey covidiot, why don-t you address the article posted above your post?

How "covid deaths" are counted.

Harambe wrote:

browski wrote:

While we may not be there (herd immunity) now, we are on our way. The vaccine will provide a faster route to it, but if we aren't getting there, then you wouldn't see a place like NYC faring so much better than other parts of the country. It's not that we're so much more compliant here, it's that it already ripped through us.

I have zero intent on getting this vaccine.

"Herd immunity is the only way!!!1 But, no, I don't believe in it enough to get the vaccine."

Sheesh you guys need to coordinate your talking points.

Um, no. I'm not scared of it enough to get a vaccine that was created minutes ago. Knock yourself out with it though.

For this to be true -- for the "excess deaths" to be people who were gonna die this year almost nobody would have to die for the rest of the year. The CDC dashboard lists 2.78 million deaths reported. This does not account for lots of missing data as the last months+ fill in, nor for the remaining month of the year.

The math is not on your side. This has been explained to you several times. You refuse to update your believes. Dogma is dangerous.

But sure, keep your fingers crossed for sudden immortality -- maybe you'll be right :)