rojo wrote:
The Border Clash between Co and Utah Xc team was cancelled due to Covid so now the top teams are flying to Alabama to battle. I'm sure this makes a lot of sense from a scientific standpoint (sarcasm).
https://www.dyestat.com/gprofile.php?mgroup_id=44531&do=news&news_id=610284-Battle-for-Border-Wars-Bragging-Rights-Will-Now-Be-Settled-at-RunningLane-National-Championship-Event-in-Alabama
rojo wrote:
The Border Clash between Co and Utah Xc team was cancelled due to Covid so now the top teams are flying to Alabama to battle. I'm sure this makes a lot of sense from a scientific standpoint (sarcasm).
https://www.dyestat.com/gprofile.php?mgroup_id=44531&do=news&news_id=610284-Battle-for-Border-Wars-Bragging-Rights-Will-Now-Be-Settled-at-RunningLane-National-Championship-Event-in-Alabama
ggilder wrote:
Why man why... wrote:God forbid anyone take heed from those quarter million Americans who didn't survive the pandemic. If only you could have told them in time that it was a scam they might not have fallen for it and died.
The scam is 250 thousand COVID deaths. The average age was 82 and most of them were already dying of something else (average stay in nursing home 5 months).
Actual US deaths that might have been caused by COVID were around 15K at most in a country where all-cause mortality is around 3 million.
.
Starvation deaths from global lockdowns by contrast are projected by the UN at over 200 million.
Manbearpig15 wrote:
ggilder wrote:
Why man why... wrote:God forbid anyone take heed from those quarter million Americans who didn't survive the pandemic. If only you could have told them in time that it was a scam they might not have fallen for it and died.
The scam is 250 thousand COVID deaths. The average age was 82 and most of them were already dying of something else (average stay in nursing home 5 months).
Actual US deaths that might have been caused by COVID were around 15K at most in a country where all-cause mortality is around 3 million.
.
Starvation deaths from global lockdowns by contrast are projected by the UN at over 200 million.
Thank you for speaking the truth.
ggilder wrote:
The scam is 250 thousand COVID deaths. The average age was 82
I can find no support for this. On the CDC pages, both the mean and the median ages seem to be somewhat younger, but if you have a link I'd really appreciate it!
and MOST of them were already dying of something else (average stay in nursing home 5 months).
As far as I can find out, a clear majority (that is, more than half) of American COVID deaths were not among nursing home residents. And in any case it seems that most of the COVID deaths were people who weren't actually "dying" of anything else at the time. But again, a link would be great!
Actual US deaths that might have been caused by COVID were around 15K at most in a country where all-cause mortality is around 3 million.
No, this is simply wrong. Obesity or diabetes, for instance, may make a person more vulnerable to the virus; however, the "but-for" standard applies: BUT FOR COVID-19, most of those who died would not have. I know there won't be a useful link for this one, because unfortunately it's a falsehood.
[To acknowledge that most who've died had one or more so-called "co-morbidities" that made them more susceptible does NOT mean that those co-morbidities were the cause of death. COVID-19 has been the cause of death of a quarter-million Americans.]
Starvation deaths from global lockdowns by contrast are projected by the UN at over 200 million.
I have heard this (or similar statements) made about COVID-related *disruptions* in supply chains and find it very believable, but have not been able to find a source for *lockdowns* per se causing that many deaths. Link?
formerly present wrote:
ggilder wrote:
The scam is 250 thousand COVID deaths. The average age was 82
I can find no support for this. On the CDC pages, both the mean and the median ages seem to be somewhat younger, but if you have a link I'd really appreciate it!
and MOST of them were already dying of something else (average stay in nursing home 5 months).
As far as I can find out, a clear majority (that is, more than half) of American COVID deaths were not among nursing home residents. And in any case it seems that most of the COVID deaths were people who weren't actually "dying" of anything else at the time. But again, a link would be great!
Actual US deaths that might have been caused by COVID were around 15K at most in a country where all-cause mortality is around 3 million.
No, this is simply wrong. Obesity or diabetes, for instance, may make a person more vulnerable to the virus; however, the "but-for" standard applies: BUT FOR COVID-19, most of those who died would not have. I know there won't be a useful link for this one, because unfortunately it's a falsehood.
[To acknowledge that most who've died had one or more so-called "co-morbidities" that made them more susceptible does NOT mean that those co-morbidities were the cause of death. COVID-19 has been the cause of death of a quarter-million Americans.]
Starvation deaths from global lockdowns by contrast are projected by the UN at over 200 million.
I have heard this (or similar statements) made about COVID-related *disruptions* in supply chains and find it very believable, but have not been able to find a source for *lockdowns* per se causing that many deaths. Link?
Sincere THANKS for any help!
Footballer wrote:
Your chance of getting into a car accident is about the same as catching Covid and having symptoms. Did that stop you from traveling for Thanksgiving last year?
You made the point that people are not good at assessing risk. Doing all of those things results in 6 million accidents in the US each year with 3 million people being injured. Your chances are less that you will be infected with Covid and experience symptoms than being injured in a car accident. We should prohibit all auto travel except for essential activities.
Runner10287 wrote:
Why man why... wrote:
Runner10287 wrote:
lease wrote:
GOD FORBID that the coaches and parents involved go for a year without a contest to determine bragging rights. The horror!
God forbid people realize they are being scammed by big government and do something to get around it. Good for them. Too bad most can't afford to do something like this and be taking a more harsh fight back here eventually.
God forbid anyone take heed from those quarter million Americans who didn't survive the pandemic. If only you could have told them in time that it was a scam they might not have fallen for it and died.
Whatever simp. You are the reason it's a fraud. It's a scam when you have the governor of California closing businesses but attending indoor dining events and traveling to Hawaii.
Footballer wrote:
You made the point that people are not good at assessing risk. Doing all of those things results in 6 million accidents in the US each year with 3 million people being injured. Your chances are less that you will be infected with Covid and experience symptoms than being injured in a car accident. We should prohibit all auto travel except for essential activities.
The point is that when people are free to assess the risk, it is obvious that most are willing to take the risk of getting sick or even dying as opposed to living in fear or not being entirely free.
Yeah, that is messed up.
It is a bit like shutting down an underage party because you are not comfortable with them drinking at your house and they all decide to go to another bigger party instead.
Same kids, different location, same risk. Although they are probably safer flying then driving.
Denier of nothing. I believe in no conspiracy theories. I believe Trump defeated Clinton and I believe Biden defeated Trump. One simple fact really distracted you. I believe Covid is real and has killed 250,000 in the US. I believe that 3 million will be injured in auto accidents also which you seem to deny. Nearly all people dying of Covid are elderly and overweight. Those are facts that you seem to have a hard time grasping. Do you think is a conspiracy by somebody to falsify the data to only make it appear that those are the people who are dying?
Oh Alabama... wrote:
ggilder wrote:
Mileage Varying wrote:there is a pandemic sweeping the country that is getting worse and worse. But life isn't fair, and people need to do what is right/safe.
Yes, Masked Man, the political panic is getting worse and worse, with testing up some 8fold per day (from 547 per day per million persons in April to over 4K per day in November for a total now approaching 175 million tests in the US alone, with millions of false positives; Elon Musk tested positive twice and negative twice over a few days).
Therefore the likelihood of any particular death being ascribed to COVID is way up. But according to global all-cause deaths per-thousand people, this is one of the safest years of my nearly 81 year lifetime--for example, in 2000, 8.9 deaths per thousand; 2010 8.6 deaths; and this year 2020, 7.6 deaths per 1000 people globally (annualized).
It's hard for liberal arts grads like me to grasp but covid is no threat at all to 99.99 percent of us. But the politicians in their imbecilic masks are a threat to the world, bringing a UN projection of 100s of millions of deaths by starvation in the third world.
Meanwhile, in my outdoor races, I am counselled to don a mask at the starting line and whenever I pass anyone.
Sorry you don’t like wearing a mask, snowflake. Odds of being struck by lightning are pretty low too but we don’t go running in severe thunderstorms when we can avoid it.
robert678 wrote:
Oh Alabama... wrote:
ggilder wrote:
Mileage Varying wrote:there is a pandemic sweeping the country that is getting worse and worse. But life isn't fair, and people need to do what is right/safe.
Yes, Masked Man, the political panic is getting worse and worse, with testing up some 8fold per day (from 547 per day per million persons in April to over 4K per day in November for a total now approaching 175 million tests in the US alone, with millions of false positives; Elon Musk tested positive twice and negative twice over a few days).
Therefore the likelihood of any particular death being ascribed to COVID is way up. But according to global all-cause deaths per-thousand people, this is one of the safest years of my nearly 81 year lifetime--for example, in 2000, 8.9 deaths per thousand; 2010 8.6 deaths; and this year 2020, 7.6 deaths per 1000 people globally (annualized).
It's hard for liberal arts grads like me to grasp but covid is no threat at all to 99.99 percent of us. But the politicians in their imbecilic masks are a threat to the world, bringing a UN projection of 100s of millions of deaths by starvation in the third world.
Meanwhile, in my outdoor races, I am counselled to don a mask at the starting line and whenever I pass anyone.
Sorry you don’t like wearing a mask, snowflake. Odds of being struck by lightning are pretty low too but we don’t go running in severe thunderstorms when we can avoid it.
Dude, I love to run in thunderstorms. Feels so bad***. I was cranking out some fast 400s once on the track in pouring rain and strong winds and lightning bolts were striking down less than 100m away. The closest was about 30m from the track. It was a really cool workout. Thor would have been proud.
More yes. But not a lot more.
border war wrote:
Yeah, that is messed up.
It is a bit like shutting down an underage party because you are not comfortable with them drinking at your house and they all decide to go to another bigger party instead.
Same kids, different location, same risk. Although they are probably safer flying then driving.
rojo wrote:
The Border Clash between Co and Utah Xc team was cancelled due to Covid so now the top teams are flying to Alabama to battle. I'm sure this makes a lot of sense from a scientific standpoint (sarcasm).
SortaRiskyBusiness. wrote:
rojo wrote:
The Border Clash between Co and Utah Xc team was cancelled due to Covid so now the top teams are flying to Alabama to battle. I'm sure this makes a lot of sense from a scientific standpoint (sarcasm).
You are correct. Flying to Alabama (going through 2 airports, an airplane, rental car areas, hotels) does not make a lot of scientific sense if one is trying to reduce exposure to the growing virus. It would have been better to have the meet close to home where people could drive and have less exposure. The minimum exposure is not to run the meet at all, which is what the organizers were attempting.
Yes, the risk for healthy youth appears to be small. However, this virus is less than 1 year old. It is a a disease that attacks the blood vessels so that it can replicate itself in the lungs where there are lots of vessels. The heart and liver also have lots of vessels and that is why some get very sick and take months to recover. Are we absolutely sure that these effects are not permanent? As a scientist and an actual conservative, it seems easier to avoid exposure and wear a mask just in case.
But the risk of a youth contracting the virus is not necessarily the risk to them. It is the risk of the propagating it to others and it will eventually get to someone who is high risk. If someone gets COVID doing something that was avoidable, then passes it on to their grandmother who dies, would it be worth it? What if it was a friend's grandparent? The further removed, the easier it is to justify.
If society prospers we all benefit. If society is not doing well, most of us suffer (as with the pandemic dragging on). If everyone put in a serious effort to stop the virus, things would go back to normal faster.
Here is an article about the effects of mask mandates in Canada. By any objective measure, they are doing much better than their southern neighbor.
https://voxeu.org/article/face-mask-mandates-slowed-spread-covid-19-canada
My next door neighbor is an ICU nurse at a big children's hospital. They are seeing teenagers in ICU with acute COVID 19 cases. It is kids of all shapes and sizes from coach potato to jock. HS kids are not exempt from a bad case of COVID 19.
And this is really the XC equivalent of the Kardashian birthday party. These are obviously rich kids who have parents with cash to burn. Their special guys and girls trained so hard this year and need the results for college so mom and dad booked flights and hotels to get them a special race out of state so they won't miss out. Meanwhile, health care workers in Utah and Colorado are getting ripped to shreds with unending COVID 19 cases.
