How to bridge the gap between 17:20s and sub 17 5k

Both sessions are pretty tough. The 20x200 is a workout that you can “learn to do” early in a cycle and make you think you’re really ready to race after you’ve done it a couple of times. But if you don’t have the background work in you’ll end up going out too fast and blowing up.

The 5-4-3-2-1 is much harder to fake your way through and is a much better indicator. Depending on the rout that you run it on, if you can average 5:15-5:20 ish pace for the session, you’re good to break 17:00.....at least that is about how it’s worked out for us doing the session on a slow loop and then racing on a fairly slow course.

Both sessions require you to be in pretty good shape and both carry a pretty high risk of blowing up mid way through. If you want to get the most out of them, you should be in pretty good shape before attempting. Both are also geared to give you that “oh sh!t” feeling pretty early on and teaching you to deal with it. Most high school races go out stupid fast. At our section meet course, we have to cross a levee only 300m into the race and every 20 minute 5k kid runs that first 300 in 15:30 pace, then spend the rest of the race slowing down. For us we can go out too fast and still be buried behind 150 runners, 110 of whom will slow down after about 3 minutes and clog up the trail. so the sessions for us are aimed at allowing us to go out over our heads, far enough up in the field, and then not die in the last mile.

Not the same situation in a road race or a track race, but the physiological benefit of developing lactate tolerance is still something that will help you with your racing. Usually I avoid posting things that indicate that there is a magic workout or simple adjustment to get someone to their goals, but like I said earlier, I think your fitness is there already.

How do we get to where we can do those sessions? Early in the training cycle, we do lots of 200s with adequate rest. Not lots as in all in one workout, rather we do 4-6 of them usually twice a week. Usually they are tacked on at the end of a cruise interval or tempo session or as our pre meet workout. As we get further along, we chop the rest down to 30 seconds, but keep the same pace. Late in the season, if the schedule allows, we’ll throw in 1-2 of the really high lactate sessions described above.

Interesting. Maybe that 20x200 workout is one to come back to a couple times throughout the training cycle. It's interesting that you mention "faking" it though workouts. I was actually thrilled with my 8x800 workout because I had finally learned to manage 800s and sort of 'fake' my way through them. 1000s are different and I hope that I can get to the point where I get a handle on 1000s in the same way I have with 800s and knock out 6 of them in a workout @3:22-23 ish.

I agree with all who have suggested you already have the fitness. You just need a few races.

By comparison, for a year in my mid-40s I was also chasing sub-17. I was disappointed to manage only 17:10. But I also could not get close to matching the workouts you listed.

Typically I would run VO2max workouts of 6 x 800 or 3 x 1-mile, with jog recoveries equal in time duration to the repeats. Pace was about 5:20 per mile.

Average mpw was 40-45, including threshold runs and long runs (also ran a marathon a few weeks prior the 17:10). I followed the 7:10 with 17:16, 17:13 then pretty much gave up.

20 years previously I had run low 16s; best mile was 4:45 as a 17-year-old. So, not a whole lot of talent to work with, but still disappointing not to see 16's again. I'm confident you'll do better. Go race!

Thank you for the input! I feel like that is a really solid mile workout you posted above and I find it to be more impressive than my 800 session. Like I mentioned above, I have mostly done standing recovery, so anyone with jogging recovery awes me a bit. 17:10 in your 40s is fantastic, great job and thanks for the vote of confidence!

Can I do it? wrote:

Thank you for the insights! I'm 5'10" and 143 lbs, so I can probably afford to shave off a few more pounds. The plan above is interesting. I think I am going to need a few more miles than you suggested, but incorporating a little strength training I think, can be very helpful.

That’s an excellent weight for a woman. Don’t let men body shame you into losing weight just to fit their ideal.

Update: I've gotten in two 5000m races on the track so far. 17:20s for the first one. Broke 17:10 for the first time the other day. Less than 10 seconds away with one race left in a month from now. A lot of you said I just need to get in some races, and that seems to be the case. That being said, some of the splits for a 16:5x 5000m seems intimidating. Hopefully the next few weeks get me mentally prepared for it. Thank you for you help so far!