I can easily run (maybe win) a 50, right?

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Just Another Run of the Mill ex-D1 er wrote:

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ultrarunner for a long time wrote:

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GBohannon wrote:
Any input on how to train for a 50 would be welcome. I’m guessing it’s not that much like training for a fast marathon, but maybe it is?

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The myth says that you have to train a lot of long miles for an ultra.
I would say, you can almost train exactly like you would do for a marathon.
The main difference is that you have to start with a very slow pace.
In Ultrarunning the "running part" gets less important the longer the race gets. Nutrition, weather, mental strength are the key to success.

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^^^Once again, this.

I've run three ?'s, along with several assorted-length "baby ultras". No particular need to go beyond typical marathon training, whatever that is for you. Spend the extra time you might have thought you needed for additional training on working out the other details instead - nutrition, hydration, and gear strategies for starters. Knowing what you can stomach, how much fluid you'll need, and how you might go about carrying it will pay far greater dividends on race day than a few extra miles/week ever will. The ONLY extra training I've ever done is perhaps one (and only one) "over-distance" run (>marathon, generally 50kish) in the lead-up, like 4-6 weeks out. Not a race, just going a little outside the normal comfort zone. This is optional, but can be beneficial if done right. It's also a great opportunity for gear/nutrition strategy shake out.

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Griffin, how’d it go?
Also, you ditched Strava I see?

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jphelps wrote:
Griffin, how’d it go?
Also, you ditched Strava I see?

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*Should say: “No race for me” not just “no” at the beginning.

A 50 mile race in the midst of the Michigan winter will be a whole other ballgame than the same distance in nice weather.

Personally I always hated ultras in cold weather. A lot more things can go wrong.

I’ll second that last post. I’ve run YSWC 25k each of the last 5-6 years, and the conditions can be brutal. You’re in MI so you know what the temp can be like, but the trail condition is the x factor. Could be great, could be horrendous. Maybe I’ll see ya there!

Look up this amazing ultrarunner and his training methodology. He uses some revolutionary endurance training techniques that allow him to train at 6:00 pace or faster almost every day during 100 mile weeks. He just ran a 50 miler in 5:16 on a very hilly course in hot, humid weather, and at some points late in the race he was running faster than Jim Walmsley's world record pace. Previously this year he ran several 50K time trials in 3 hours or faster, and sometimes runs marathons in the 2:40s as recovery runs.

https://www.strava.com/activities/3925792814

https://my.raceresult.com/156045/#2_DD04B7

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Ask Ivo wrote:
Look up this amazing ultrarunner and his training methodology. He uses some revolutionary endurance training techniques that allow him to train at 6:00 pace or faster almost every day during 100 mile weeks. He just ran a 50 miler in 5:16 on a very hilly course in hot, humid weather, and at some points late in the race he was running faster than Jim Walmsley's world record pace. Previously this year he ran several 50K time trials in 3 hours or faster, and sometimes runs marathons in the 2:40s as recovery runs.

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I'm way behind on this thread, but will have a few random comments for you.
**Given your speed, the 50 was very winnable for you at 7 hours. I was much slower, and went significantly under 7 hours on a rolling course (though it wasn't trails like your planned, and now not planned, event).
**Marathon training works fine, even for a 50-miler. Any doubts? Look up Camille Herron's training.
**Your biggest obstacle to a solid finish time would likely be nutrition and hydration. Nothing will kill you more than spending time vomiting or being queasy. So keep on top of fueling and drinking. If you keep those dialed in, and just keep cruising, you should do fine.

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ultrarunner for a long time wrote:

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Ask Ivo wrote:
Look up this amazing ultrarunner and his training methodology. He uses some revolutionary endurance training techniques that allow him to train at 6:00 pace or faster almost every day during 100 mile weeks. He just ran a 50 miler in 5:16 on a very hilly course in hot, humid weather, and at some points late in the race he was running faster than Jim Walmsley's world record pace. Previously this year he ran several 50K time trials in 3 hours or faster, and sometimes runs marathons in the 2:40s as recovery runs.

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First of all, Jim Walmsley has no world record. It's just a worlds best time for a distance which was never competed on. (50 miles)

And what are revolutionary endurance training techniques?

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[quote]Ask Ivo wrote:
Pretty much all successful ultrarunners don't need a MOXY sensor. They do that by feel.
And Vibram Five Fingers will ensure that Ivo's running career will be short.

You should be fit enough and since it’s Michigan the race course probably does not have much in the way of vertical climb or isn’t technical with rocks and roots on the trail. There is not universal agreement on what training is optimal for ultras but a couple of 3 to 4 hour runs a a slower pace might be a good idea. For ultra races being “fat adapted” and being on top of hydration are important. You can screw up hydration in a marathon without it crippling you but if your body needs 1.5 liters/hour (a common value in warmer weather) and you are only taking in 0.5 liters - after 6 or 7 hours you have a pretty major dehydration issue. Given your fitness you might be leading the 50 miler - would be useful to know what pace you can run comfortably for a very long time

So you know “most of the successful ultra runners” personally? Just out of curiosity, what are your best times for some of the ultra distances? Have you ever won an ultra?
Also, as far as Ivo goes he once again PR’d in the 50-Miles (6:14:21 or a pace of 6:17) and is on the Army World Class Athlete program setting a bunch of other PRs in the shorter distances as well (like a 15:31 for the 5K and 53:24 for the 10-miles)…

How long can you sustain a 6:17 pace? For a 50K? Marathon? Even a 5K??? Please LT me know your PRs and accomplishments? Also, do you have any sponsors? Cause if the answer is “no” you probably shouldn’t talk - there is a big difference between shuffling through and ultra and actually being successful… Unless your resume can back back up your statements, you are just another slow ignorant idiot…

Conor Naughton eats your Strava for breakfast G!

In case the OP is still following this thread, I actually ran the Hungerford 50M in 2020 that I think he was considering, and nearly won it! My new friend Dave was the better man, he ran a clean race with basically no aid station stops. We both finished in about 7:20. Overall the course was pretty fair, a mixture of dirt roads, ATV trails, single track, and pure sand. My watch had around 3000ft of elevation change at 46mi when it died. I certainly wouldn't call it flat though, while the hills weren't too bad, I did power hike a decent amount of them and ran the rest of the race without any walking. The surprising part is the sand that's present for about 1/4 of the race and just saps your energy without you noticing it. I peaked at 100mi/week in my buildup and thought I had a pretty good day aside from muscle cramps at the end. Your road marathon PR is much better than mine so I would think that sub 7 would be a good goal if everything goes right if you chose to do it again.

So you know “most of the successful ultra runners” personally? Just out of curiosity, what are your best times for some of the ultra distances? Have you ever won an ultra?
Also, as far as Ivo goes he once again PR’d in the 50-Miles (6:14:21 or a pace of 6:17) and is on the Army World Class Athlete program setting a bunch of other PRs in the shorter distances as well (like a 15:31 for the 5K and 53:24 for the 10-miles)…

How long can you sustain a 6:17 pace? For a 50K? Marathon? Even a 5K??? Please let me know your PRs and accomplishments? Also, do you have any sponsors? Cause if the answer is “no” you probably shouldn’t talk - there is a big difference between shuffling through and ultra and actually being successful… Unless your resume can back back up your statements, you are just another slow ignorant idiot…