Wear a mask or kill an economy, the choice is yours

CorrectorII wrote:

Apparently the White House stopped the USPS from sending millions of free masks early on:

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a34058796/postal-service-send-masks-households-april-white-house/

This does not suit Joedirts angle or bias.

He’ll still be a fan boy for trump.

In Texas every business I walk into, including mine, has a sign on the front door that tell you to put on a mask before entering. The Governor and most major cities mayors signed a mask mandate long ago.

Still I hear pro-maskers yell and scream “COVID cases are increasing because no one is wearing a mask!“ It’s shocking that it seems to never occur to them that maybe masks just aren’t that effective.

econ 911 wrote:

hjk2 wrote:

It's mostly old people that die from most diseases. By your logic not treating old people for heart disease, cancer, alzheimers, etc. and letting them die would also help the economy.

As a matter of fact, that's right.

We spend a lot of money keeping people alive that are not working and making money.

If they all die sooner, that money could go into more consumerism which would help everyone left alive.

Not convinced you take is accurate. Here are 2 examples.

My mom (age 101) died in May. She lived in her own home and paid 2-3 health care workers for her care from her savings. She used all the same services employed people use, lawn care, house painters, supermarkets, snow plow, HVAC technicians etc. I' d argue she used less social services than families with children. No schools, no car damaging the roads. This is a thing now (aging at home).

I too am retired. I have not started collecting social security although I am eligible. I have plenty of savings and travel a lot, go out to eat, stay in hotels, buy cars, motorcycles and use most of the services that you likely use. I left the workforce enabling a younger replacement to have my job. I pay plenty of taxes for younger people to use our schools. In what way am I a drain on society?

These Covid threads on LRC do much to explain why the US has by far the most infections and deaths in the world and a seriously ailing economy - and why it has plummeted in the eyes of the rest of the world. Apparently the US has the greatest concentration of morons on the planet.

energeticlotuseater wrote:

Still I hear pro-maskers yell and scream “COVID cases are increasing because no one is wearing a mask!“ It’s shocking that it seems to never occur to them that maybe masks just aren’t that effective.

I'm totally with you, I actually cut the seatbelt out from my cars, so many car accident deaths prove them ineffective. Why carry the weight and hassle, specially with kids!

I see I'm not the only sharp knife in the drawer! High five!

Dr Redfield - mask more effective than vaccine (unpopular view but true)

CorrectorII wrote:

energeticlotuseater wrote:

Still I hear pro-maskers yell and scream “COVID cases are increasing because no one is wearing a mask!“ It’s shocking that it seems to never occur to them that maybe masks just aren’t that effective.

I'm totally with you, I actually cut the seatbelt out from my cars, so many car accident deaths prove them ineffective. Why carry the weight and hassle, specially with kids!

I see I'm not the only sharp knife in the drawer! High five!

The point I’m trying to make that despite the various mask mandates there still seems to be a significant rise in COVID cases daily. This leads me to believe that the masks aren’t quite as helpful at stopping COVID as some people think. However, the pro-mask crowd at times seems to show an inability to even consider this possibility. They will just yell and scream that people just must not be wearing masks.

The inability to critique or think critically about their own point of view is unfortunate.

P.S. I do wear a mask when a business requires me to. I just am very skeptical about how well they actually work.

People may not wear a seatbet out of stupidity, but they don't find socking if others aren't also skeptical of them (they do reduce the risk of accident after all) Keep in mind, you THINK they don't consider it. The other option is that they consider it, and then find it idiotic!

To NOT wear a mask on purpose you must believe it makes it MORE likely to catch covid for you or for others, any other "sckepticism" based reason is idiotic, you must at least agree with that, no?

I’m skeptical because despite these various mask mandates the COVID cases are going to, or staying the same.

I wear a mask because I want to be allowed in various businesses who require masks.

energeticlotuseater wrote:

CorrectorII wrote:

People may not wear a seatbet out of stupidity, but they don't find socking if others aren't also skeptical of them (they do reduce the risk of accident after all) Keep in mind, you THINK they don't consider it. The other option is that they consider it, and then find it idiotic!

To NOT wear a mask on purpose you must believe it makes it MORE likely to catch covid for you or for others, any other "sckepticism" based reason is idiotic, you must at least agree with that, no?

I’m skeptical because despite these various mask mandates the COVID cases are going to, or staying the same.

I wear a mask because I want to be allowed in various businesses who require masks.

Masks definitely save lives. Look at how many more deaths per million Sweden had than the US because they did not have mask rules. Oh wait that doesn't fit the narrative..... you're killing Grandma you selfish Trump Lover!

energeticlotuseater wrote:

CorrectorII wrote:

People may not wear a seatbelt out of stupidity, but they don't find it socking if others aren't also skeptical of the seatbelts (they do reduce the risk of accident after all) Keep in mind, you THINK they don't consider it. The other option is that they consider it, and then find it idiotic!

To NOT wear a mask on purpose you must believe it makes it MORE likely to catch covid for you or for others, any other "skepticism" based reason is idiotic, you must at least agree with that, no?

I’m skeptical because despite these various mask mandates the COVID cases are going to, or staying the same.

Mmm, I wonder if all the "gut based" skepticals not wearing it may contribute to the cases staying flat ? In your own words, I find it shocking you haven't considered it

Heard mentality bro wrote:

CorrectorII wrote:

Apparently the White House stopped the USPS from sending millions of free masks early on:

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a34058796/postal-service-send-masks-households-april-white-house/

This does not suit Joedirts angle or bias.

He’ll still be a fan boy for trump.

I’m not a fan boy of Trump (I voted for McMullin in the last election). I just am not at all a fan of the Democrats and socialist ideologies. As dumb as Trump may behave at times, he is better than the alternative offered by the Dems. I have advocated for masks since COVID hit the US and have been critical of Fauci being intentionally deceptive over the efficacy of masks.

CorrectorII wrote:

energeticlotuseater wrote:

I’m skeptical because despite these various mask mandates the COVID cases are going to, or staying the same.

Mmm, I wonder if all the "gut based" skepticals not wearing it may contribute to the cases staying flat ? In your own words, I find it shocking you haven't considered it

Like I said, all private businesses in Texas are required to wear masks when in the business. Our governor and many of local mayors have implemented mask mandates. Purely anecdotal, but I also wear a mask because I want to enter these businesses. However, despite all these mask mandates the COVID cases continue to rise.

Now, your reaction to these facts is exactly how I assumed it would be. You basically blame the citizens and assume they aren’t following said mask mandates but don’t really consider the possibility that the actual mask mandates and masks are simply just not very effective.

Do masks help some? Sure. But looking at real world results masks are highly overrated.

This is no longer about masks or COVID 19. It's 99.99% about politics.

When the S&P 500 is up from July 31 to Oct 31st on election years, the incumbent party has won 85% of the time (11 of the last 13 presidential elections) and 100% of the time since 1970.

Republicans have to keep the economy up until the election. Democrats have to keep the economy down until the election. If a Democrat were in office, it would be the reverse. It's that simple.

For reference, the S&P 500 closed at 3271 on July 31st. Today, it's 3306, but that tiny advance could be wiped out in one trading day.

As we move into heating season and northern climates start to see a rise in cases and deaths (especially those with no mask mandates), it is worth reiterating this post. If you want to avoid economic shutdowns, the best way to do that is with masks. Did anyone else catch Bill Burr's SNL monologue? He put it in language that even simpletons can understand:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1xgXJ5_Q34

Wear a mask. It is a minor inconvenience that has huge economic ramifications.

I'm surprised there's not more recent data on this, and maybe there is but I just didn't catch it. Any way, actual mask non-wearers get way more airtime than their numbers would suggest. We've all seen "karen" videos of non-wearers throwing tantrums, getting tossed out of places, etc. over mask wearing. Gatherings where mask wearing is at a minimum make the headlines, but most people, even those that don't think they do anything, go ahead and wear them. Whether it's because they think they're helping themselves or people around them, whether they just want to avoid confrontation or just to be able to legally enter stores, the percentage of mask wearers in the US is in line with the rest of the world.

In this study from early July,

https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/07/08/face-off-over-face-masks-europes-latest-north-south-split

, the US was ahead of Canada, the UK, Norway, Denmark, and Sweden, roughly on par with France, Mexico, and Vietnam, and behind Spain, Italy, China, Singapore, and Malaysia. The US numbers were trending up in that study (Given the rough summer the US had, I suspect their numbers have continued to climb.

Here's a NY Times article from mid July. Different numbers, slightly different question, but similar results.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/07/17/upshot/coronavirus-face-mask-map.html

Monkeys typing wrote:

joedirt wrote:

Wear a mask or kill an economy, the choice is yours

There's more to prevention than simply wearing a mask, but wearing a mask is simple and effective.

It's bizarre but not all that surprising that this has become a political hot button.

+1

Same bleep, different day. Masks HELP mitigate the issue. And once again where does this idea that you either get COVID or die or get COVID and are fine? There is plenty of grey area with this virus and very many people are sick for weeks. Many people take months to recover. Some are dealing with lingering effects months after.

Lockdowns suck. They kill economies for certain, but can be avoided. But what will almost certainly happen come cold/flu season is that everybody who gets the sniffles will rush to the ER, thus overwhelming hospitals. If hospitals become overwhelmed there will be no choice but to lockdown again. Masks help avoid lockdowns because they help stop the uncontrolled spread of the virus.

drcovid crazy wrote:

David Wowie wrote:

[quote]joedirt wrote:

HI all,

As case numbers start to rise again in Europe..

Case numbers = positive test results = don't mean a damn thing.

Next to nobody is seriously ill.

The Covid death numbers are nearly all people who would have died absent the virus.

It's all bullspit folks, and it is being used against us

Exactly. They were all freaking out about a bunch of college kids that got the virus near us recently. Guess how many of them even got severely ill? Zero

This is an extremely contagious and deadly disease, So contagious that if you are asymptomatic and you walk past another asymptomatic person at @ 3 MPH and come within 6 feet of him for a split second, then grandmothers will die.

Luckily, if you wear a $4 mask made in China then everyone is safe.