Not a good look in the desert

Seems familiar:

https://kvoa.com/news/n4t-investigators/2019/09/23/n4t-investigators-u-of-a-student-says-he-was-bullied-targeted-with-homophobic-slurs/

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/23504091/former-arizona-wildcats-assistant-coach-sentenced-five-years-prison

Public weigh-ins were also part of the culture at Vandy as well. Are they a typical thing for women's distance track and xc? Par for the course is the inability and unwillingness to avoid or treat injuries in college running programs. You'd have a lot more success with healthy athletes, even if they are above what you deem their desirable weight, than with athletes constantly anemic and unhealthy.

I'd never hard of public weigh ins except at abusive programs. This is not the norm and it shouldn't be done anywhere.

Good God, anyone care to share the cliff notes?

Looks like this isn’t close to the first time with these coaches. How haven’t they been fired? Corruption at its worst.

What I don't understand about these cases, is why it is reasonably expected for track coaches to deal with cases of sexual assault. That's what police and lawyers are for. These University students are adults; why are they turning to other random adults they are affiliated with to solve their legal problems? It doesn't matter that the other individual is a team mate or fellow student; he's just another person violating your rights and/or committing a crime. Contact the proper authorities.

Coaches and athletic administrators are required to create a safe environment. It is not “resonably” expected. It is expected. It’s in whatever contract they sign to become coach.

Jambo Cabao wrote:

What I don't understand about these cases, is why it is reasonably expected for track coaches to deal with cases of sexual assault.

It’s part of a coaches job to ensure a safe environment for their athletes.

Or the fourth allegation listed in the first article linked...coaches ignored serious mental health issues.

Again, why is it the responsibility of the track coach to deal with serious mental health issues? Serious mental health issues are the realm of well trained medical health professionals. It isn't the wheelhouse of your track coach, and no one should expect it to be.

This is largely a case of individuals turning to other individuals who are unqualified to help with the issues they're having. There should be no greater expectation of the track coach to deal with sexual assault and serious mental health issues than there is for their algebra professor, the manager of their favorite restaurant, or the mechanic who changes their oil.

I’m sorry, but I’m female, competed 4 years in Division I cross country and track, have had coaches who have instructed me to count calories to get to race weight (and they were right, and it worked—yes, it’s possible to treat weight as just another aspect of training, akin to doing strides or strength work, not a big “self esteem” issue), have been kissed and groped and fondled without consent at bars and parties, read this whole long article, and can only come to the conclusion that these young women are coddled and expect the institution to treat them like parents who love them unconditionally. How on earth is it an athletic department’s or an individual coach‘s responsibility to make an athlete feel good about themselves if they’re not performing up to standard? At the end of the day, it’s an athletic institution that has to meet certain standards, not a therapy nonprofit. The idea that incidents regarding sexual harassment and mental health are up to the individual coach to deal with is INSANE. The idea that a coach is supposed to “hold you while you cry” about a poor race is crazy. These women need to grow up, nothing they described in the article is remotely close to anything resembling abuse and yes I can say that because I personally experienced all of what they described.

Forcing college athletes to count calories is abuse, whether you think it is or not. Its an amateur sport and no matter how good a team is, it should be treated as such. This is college sport, not professional level running. You want to make athletes count calories, coach pros.

I partially agree with the rest.

Being that this is letsrun, i’m willing to bet you are not a former d1 female runner and are more likely a sweaty old man in a basement

Unless a coach witnesses the event the coach is not qualified to solve the problem. Take it up with police. The coach is nit an attorney.

I would expect to take mental health advice from a coach as seriously as I would from a politician. Go to a psychologist for mental health issues. Not a coach. There is a reason a coach didn’t become a doctor.

Track coaches tell athletes to run. That’s what they do. Don’t expect much more than that.

Jambo Cabao wrote:

Or the fourth allegation listed in the first article linked...coaches ignored serious mental health issues.

Again, why is it the responsibility of the track coach to deal with serious mental health issues? Serious mental health issues are the realm of well trained medical health professionals. It isn't the wheelhouse of your track coach, and no one should expect it to be.

This is largely a case of individuals turning to other individuals who are unqualified to help with the issues they're having. There should be no greater expectation of the track coach to deal with sexual assault and serious mental health issues than there is for their algebra professor, the manager of their favorite restaurant, or the mechanic who changes their oil.

I don't think anyone expects the coaches to manage mental health issues on their own. But recognizing that an issue exists and connecting them with someone who is an expert is certainly part of the coach's job.

I am not a psychiatrist, and I don't personally manage or treat my patients' mental health problems, but it is absolutely my job to know when to call a psych consult or refer a patient to outpatient psych. I don't need specialist level knowledge to simply say "I think there's a problem here and I'm going to send this person to someone who can help." Similarly, a coach really needs to the awareness to recognize an issue even if they lack the training to deal with it themselves. Most athletic departments even have psych on staff, so the initial point of contact is readily accessible and known to the coach.

And one doesn't need to be an SVU detective to come up with a better response to sexual assault than "meh, don't tell anyone." This isn't just a question of professional competency. It is just a matter of being a decent and compassionate person. In fact, if a woman did tell an algebra professor/restaurant manager/mechanic that some guy had broken into her home to try to have sex with her, I would honestly expect any of those people to handle the situation better than the coaching staff did. If a patient in my care reported being sexually assaulted, do you honestly think my response should be "well that's not really my area of expertise, so I'm just gonna finish your discharge note and you can go"?

You seem to just have a really low bar for what you expect of professionals. The coach doesn't need to treat mental health issues on their own or run a full fledged sexual misconduct investigation. They just need to recognize that an issue exists and set the right wheels in motion to deal with the problem. This really isn't too much to expect.

Counting calories is the worst method of weight and health control and is ridiculous at any level.

Not to sidetrack this thread, but you might want to ask Alberto and/or Mary Cain about making pro runners count calories.

ball hawk wrote:

Not to sidetrack this thread, but you might want to ask Alberto and/or Mary Cain about making pro runners count calories.

I was thinking maybe extremely strict diets were a strategy pros could use after they'd optimized everything else. Obviously it won't work for all pro athletes and if the consensus is that it won't work well for any, I'm fine with that. I do know for a fact that collegians, no matter how fast or how serious, should not be counting calories.

Curious - is it abusive for the football coach to ask maybe a tight end to add weight (increase his calorie intake) in order to move him to left tackle? Or a SS adding weight to play LB? Or a TE to move to WR?

Would I do public weigh ins. Absolutely not. Very sensitive discussion that needs to be handled in private. Probably best to first ask the athlete what she thinks she can do to get to the level that you and her both want her to get to. Most likely she would bring it up among other things

As for mental health, that is above my pay grade. I would sit down with them and do everything I could but I would make a referral to a mental health counselor on campus.

If an athlete brings a charge of sexual assault and makes you aware of it you are required to take it to your supervisor.

The key for coaches, keep detailed notes and sometimes it is best to follow up with an email for your records

At the college level, I would say no in regards to your question about football player weight. College football needs to be run like an amateur sport not an nfl farm league.

College football players should be students who happen to play a sport instead of nfl hopefuls forced to get a degree. Hopefully with the demise of cable tv this becomes a reality in the future.