They finished 15th last year.
They finished 15th last year.
And NAU lost nationals after winning their regional. They were not national champs but they could still be considered to be the best team in the country. When a 15 upsets a 2 seed in the NCAA basketball tournament, do you immediately think they are the better team? How about the NFL teams who win 2 games on the year but one is against a 13-3 team? Which is better? If Harvard had run multiple times against the Big 10 teams, they would have finished in the bottom half almost every time. Yes Harvard finished 15th at nationals. They would not have been at nationals had they been in the midwest regional which only sent 2 teams to nationals who finished 4-5.
brickworker wrote:
Coaching is a major reason but recruiting has improved greatly. Look at the kids they have gotten the last few years. These are on pace or better than Princeton. If you look at the times and xc events won (great american and nXN regional ) this year they are recruiting on a national level. Those kids have not gone to Harvard in the recent past. Also the ivys are able to compete with some of the best Of the Power 5.
In recent years the Ivy League schools have been making a push to be more successful in sports. Admissions standards for athletes at Ivy League schools is SIGNIFICANTLY lower than the average for the entire student body. Gibby was fortunate to step in at the right time.
Harvard recruits itself. He can sit back and sub 9:10 guys will bombard his email on their own.
Fair enough. Point is they are getting top recruits that can pick their schools over the past couple of years. Are they a top 20 xc program, as an Ivy League member, yes I think so.
brickworker wrote:
Fair enough. Point is they are getting top recruits that can pick their schools over the past couple of years. Are they a top 20 xc program, as an Ivy League member, yes I think so.
They lost their #1 and #4 to graduation so it's very unlikely they would have been top 20 this year. Additionally, the Ivy League cancelled XC so Harvard won't even be top 200 this year.
I don't particularly think Gibby is doing a better job than Dolan , Vigilante or Ireland at Columbia. Even Harkins at Yale - Yale was only 32 points behind Harvard at Heps and had zero seniors and only 1 junior in their top 5. Yale has far less resources, and they are in the ghetto.
Interesting. My son ran 4:12 and had a 35 on the ACT but he was rejected at 3 Ivies and accepted at 2.
train the bod wrote:
Interesting. My son ran 4:12 and had a 35 on the ACT but he was rejected at 3 Ivies and accepted at 2.
Exactly, normally a 35 on the ACT would be a rejection from all Ivy League schools. Besides, 4:12 isn't good enough to get Ivy League schools excited.
4:12 is about a 4:14 in the mile. There were 37 guys that were sub 4:14 in the mile this indoor season alone and 19 under 4:10. 3 sub 4.
Well we will never know now, but if there is a NE Regional this year they would be crushed by Syracuse who gets Tooker and Phillips back awhile Harvard loses their top 2.
I bet they don't win a single race this fall.
Gibby's done extremely well everywhere he's been. Harvard usually does not have a lot of distance talent. The gifts of the successful coach/recruiter are to convince administration to prioritize his recruits in admissions, to reel them in, to keep them healthy, and to build them up intelligently to a high level. Right now, he's made a lot of progress in all these areas. You might think that aside from the lack of mountains nearby, Harvard XC could be the Stanford of the East.
As a runner under the previous coach before he retired in 2006, I know that Harvard's didn't have much a recruiting model for the majority of the coaches (the throws/multi events coach was the exception) as they just let the admissions office thin out the herd and then call up the good athletes who got admitted to say "hey, we're interested".
Since 2006, there has been more recruiting. Due to Princeton and Columbia being the traditional distance running power houses of the conference, I think it took a long time for Harvard break into that consideration mix for top distance athletes as they needed to prove some kind of success to get their attention. Just my viewpoint.
Gibby is a wonderful coach and guy. Back during the W&M glory days he spent an hour talking to a HS senior with a 4:30 PR (me) thinking about walking on. Training back then was a ton of mileage, not slow.
C/M Runner wrote:
As a runner under the previous coach before he retired in 2006, I know that Harvard's didn't have much a recruiting model for the majority of the coaches (the throws/multi events coach was the exception) as they just let the admissions office thin out the herd and then call up the good athletes who got admitted to say "hey, we're interested".
Since 2006, there has been more recruiting. Due to Princeton and Columbia being the traditional distance running power houses of the conference, I think it took a long time for Harvard break into that consideration mix for top distance athletes as they needed to prove some kind of success to get their attention. Just my viewpoint.
Things have changed a lot and they are very active in recruiting. The school is making a push to be more competitive - coming from the president and the AD. Recently the dilapidated Harvard indoor track was resurfaced and the facility was renovated.
And when Gabby Thomas won the NCAA championship they had an influx of money and got even more support from the school (money, admissions help, etc).
Looks like they have a freshman Brosnan who scored
Vivien Henz, freshman that finished 190th, is a 3:38 1500m runner. If he can develop his stamina, he will be a contributor, too.
Harvard actually returns their 1-6. Will be interesting how Kovacs makes an impact next year
How does a Harvard degree compare to NAU?
NAU outclasses them. Everyone has heard of NAU, but nobody has heard of this "Harvard". I assume students there don't care about school and their future, and instead they're going there for athletics.
Blanks, Iverson, Henz, Brosnan, Kovacs could be a pretty good top 5 next year. Kovacs isn’t your typical freshman and is a true distance guy.