Title says it all. Thoughts? Anyone know who's stepping in now?
Title says it all. Thoughts? Anyone know who's stepping in now?
Oh and my source is USTFCCCA's instagram. Can't find a link to an article, unfortunately.
Will still be an assistant
I got you bro wrote:
https://northcentralcardinals.com/news/2020/7/21/coaching-change-announced-for-mens-cross-country.aspxWill still be an assistant
Interesting. Seems similar to what York did in Joe Newton's final years. He became an assistant and was still the team's emotional leader, but the day-to-day training and logistics were handed over to Charles Kern.
What is to discuss? He is like 90 years old. They will always be good.
What a great person and coach.
It is sad to see so man people getting older and wearing out over time.
I’m sad to see he’s stepping down. I grew up near Naperville and was always impressed with how consistently good North Central has been every year. I hope this helps him deal with the cancer.
Wow...he looks really really sick. I saw him at Nationals this past year and chatted with him briefly while looking at the results. Very nice man. Wishing him and NCC all the best.
was/is he really a great coach, though? I always heard he had a meat-grinder program, just like York. IF you survived and you were a top guy, you raced. The guy had tons of HS kids to choose from (heard teams were ~200 in size. probably not the official roster)
Yes - absolutely-positively he is a great coach. Competitive success, personal development.
His training program might not fit everyone but none do. He emphasized seeking personal best and his athletes gave 100% which is what you want.
jdkdifhfjrj wrote:
Yes - absolutely-positively he is a great coach. Competitive success, personal development.
His training program might not fit everyone but none do. He emphasized seeking personal best and his athletes gave 100% which is what you want.
Wouldn't you want to do that without injuring a ton of your athletes? Again, all I know is hearsay based on people who were in the program. Still, how is that different from every other coach?
Also, "his training program might not fit everyone". I would think a great coach would tailor each athlete's training to what works best for them
Consistency is King wrote:
Wow...he looks really really sick. I saw him at Nationals this past year and chatted with him briefly while looking at the results. Very nice man. Wishing him and NCC all the best.
Heard through the grapevine that he received a great diagnoses the last time he went to the doctor.
babushka_lady wrote:
jdkdifhfjrj wrote:
Yes - absolutely-positively he is a great coach. Competitive success, personal development.
His training program might not fit everyone but none do. He emphasized seeking personal best and his athletes gave 100% which is what you want.
Wouldn't you want to do that without injuring a ton of your athletes? Again, all I know is hearsay based on people who were in the program. Still, how is that different from every other coach?
Also, "his training program might not fit everyone". I would think a great coach would tailor each athlete's training to what works best for them
What is your issue with Al Carius?
NCC, like every DIII program, has to take 9:20 to 9:50 hs guys and turn them into 24:30 8k runners in order to succeed. There isn't anyway to do that without putting in the miles. Every program has injuries regardless of their mileage or racing schedule. It's an inherent part of the sport.
As far as individualization goes, runners generally stay healthier and race better when they train as a group.
Most coaches will give runners a race off during the season if they need it and occasionally cut or add reps for runners depending on the day. That said, I don't know of any college programs that individualize much beyond a varsity and a development group for xc and a mid-d group and a distance group for track. Exact paces will obviously vary for each runner depending on ability.
Obviously a legendary and great coach. The results speak for themselves. Recruiting and building a program/culture that can sustain itself is part of that. If tons of good kids want to run for him and then push each other to great levels, that is a great coach.
zumwalt high wrote:
babushka_lady wrote:
Wouldn't you want to do that without injuring a ton of your athletes? Again, all I know is hearsay based on people who were in the program. Still, how is that different from every other coach?
Also, "his training program might not fit everyone". I would think a great coach would tailor each athlete's training to what works best for them
What is your issue with Al Carius?
NCC, like every DIII program, has to take 9:20 to 9:50 hs guys and turn them into 24:30 8k runners in order to succeed. There isn't anyway to do that without putting in the miles. Every program has injuries regardless of their mileage or racing schedule. It's an inherent part of the sport.
As far as individualization goes, runners generally stay healthier and race better when they train as a group.
Most coaches will give runners a race off during the season if they need it and occasionally cut or add reps for runners depending on the day. That said, I don't know of any college programs that individualize much beyond a varsity and a development group for xc and a mid-d group and a distance group for track. Exact paces will obviously vary for each runner depending on ability.
I don't have an issue with Al. I just asked a question about their program - heard it was a meat grinder. From what I read he's really good at building a team culture (which is important and often not done well) but if you have a hundred guys trying for 7 spots, of course you're going to have a good team. Its a numbers game.
This is similar to what frustrated me about everyone calling Joe Newton a legendary coach. Um, what did any york runner do post high school? Sage and McNamara are the only ones who i can think of that had success. As a unit, the gradutes of York's collegiate success, in no way, matched their high school success. I watched Jack Driggs run 4:17 to with the Illinois state title and just looked him up - his best 3k was 8:25. My roommate in college ran that and he was a 17:00 3 miler in HS.
Again, I have no issue with Al. His team culture building alone would probably make him one of the better college coaches in the US. But to pretend that only he could develop the >9:40 2 milers into a established runners is ridiculous. There are plenty of late bloomers that get overlooked because they don't have the times. Coaches are supposed to preach personal development. Would he have had the same success if he had a roster limit?
babushka_lady wrote:
Would he have had the same success if he had a roster limit?
Yes.
Getting the most out of your runners is the job of the coach. Having them improve after they leave means that you did not get the best out of them.
I agree. They have 50 on their XC roster. Most D1 teams have roster limitations around 12-15 for distance and middle distance runners.
It is also important to point out that North Central has a million advantages over other D3 schools in terms of acceptance rates, cost, etc. I know first hand they they find ways to get talented athletes better financial aid packages and (non-athletic) scholarships and are very much in the D3 grey area there.
Athletes with 800 TOTAL on the SAT can get into North Central, where 1600 total still might not get you into Johns Hopkins or MIT.
Definitely the end of an era. His guys kicked the crap out of me and my teammates way back in the early 90s.
I don’t know a ton about their training and burnout rate because that sort of thing wasn’t as well known back then; but it was apparent to outsiders who competed against their teams that they had great team chemistry and camaraderie.
Incidentally, one of my oldest articles of clothing is a NCC team jacket that one of my teammates gave me after “finding” it in an open van at D3 outdoor Nats in 1994.
No they don't. They have advantages over U of Chicago or MIT or Wash U. But they have no advantage over 95% of D3 schools. In fact, their average ACT is 25 while the University of Wisconsin schools average ACT is 24. The average at Loras and Wartburg is 23.