SAT is racist?? NCAA bball coaches call for ACT/SAT ban as they are "longstanding forces of institutional racism"

The SAT should have always been just one part of the picture and not the be all and end all of college admissions and it should have been worked to be fair to all. I don't think athletes should get special consideration or have less stringent requirements. We need to rework college sports to make them amateur and not farm teams for pro leagues. Student athletes should be students who participate in a sport, not athletes who have to go to class to put a check in a box.

Kvothe wrote:

The SAT should have always been just one part of the picture and not the be all and end all of college admissions and it should have been worked to be fair to all. I don't think athletes should get special consideration or have less stringent requirements. We need to rework college sports to make them amateur and not farm teams for pro leagues. Student athletes should be students who participate in a sport, not athletes who have to go to class to put a check in a box.

At one time when fewer people went to college the SAT/ACT was just one part.

Some of the criticism of standardized tests is some of the topics and others can be discriminatory. I read some questions from early tests and could see issues.

Loser wrote:

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/29474153/national-association-basketball-coaches-wants-sat-act-eliminated-eligibility-requirement-college-players

So, as an educator, I do agree that the SAT/ACT should not hold as much weight in admissions as GPA/coursework does. I just don't think that the argument of "institutional racism" applies to the SAT/ACT. I think socioeconomic status plays a greater factor in your ability to do well in school and take a standardized test. I feel that using racism as a reason to have athletes not take the SAT is a bit of a reach

Athletes have always been an academic headache for most DI schools. The fact that so many schools were caught creating artificial classes, or threatening professors and lecturers to pass athletes is enough evidence for this. At the recruiting level, this is just another step in that direction. Coaches are more than happy to jump on this, since apparently GPA and test scores are a major wall in their recruiting ability (apparently, athletes are struggling to achieve 2.2 high school GPAs).

The coach just knows he can get someone else to do the student's classwork for them once he gets them on campus. Getting them on campus is the tough part. Who knew math was racist?

Loser wrote:

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/29474153/national-association-basketball-coaches-wants-sat-act-eliminated-eligibility-requirement-college-players

So, as an educator, I do agree that the SAT/ACT should not hold as much weight in admissions as GPA/coursework does. I just don't think that the argument of "institutional racism" applies to the SAT/ACT. I think socioeconomic status plays a greater factor in your ability to do well in school and take a standardized test. I feel that using racism as a reason to have athletes not take the SAT is a bit of a reach

Anything, literally anything, that even appears or could be perceived to have a disproportionate and negative or disadvantageous effect on black people, is considered to be racist in its entirety, no matter what other possible reasons or factors for the perceived effect may be present. That "rule," and the premise behind it, is so ingrained/established that many people don't even see it as being argumentative/rhetorical when stated. What else could possible account for a disproportionate and negative effect on black people other than racism? It's de facto racism.

The analogous "rule" is, however (and of course), never mentioned with respect to disproportionate and positive effects.

Kvothe wrote:

The SAT should have always been just one part of the picture and not the be all and end all of college admissions and it should have been worked to be fair to all. I don't think athletes should get special consideration or have less stringent requirements. We need to rework college sports to make them amateur and not farm teams for pro leagues. Student athletes should be students who participate in a sport, not athletes who have to go to class to put a check in a box.

i know the NCAA are struggling to keep them amateur but ...

Loser wrote:

"Calling them "longstanding forces of institutional racism," the National Association of Basketball Coaches on Thursday proposed permanently eliminating SAT and ACT requirements as part of the NCAA's initial eligibility process."

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/29474153/national-association-basketball-coaches-wants-sat-act-eliminated-eligibility-requirement-college-players

So, as an educator, I do agree that the SAT/ACT should not hold as much weight in admissions as GPA/coursework does. I just don't think that the argument of "institutional racism" applies to the SAT/ACT. I think socioeconomic status plays a greater factor in your ability to do well in school and take a standardized test. I feel that using racism as a reason to have athletes not take the SAT is a bit of a reach

The ACT and SAT are not racist. Parts of the exam are culturally biased. If you are older than 40 you already knew this and have known it for over 3 decades.

If many universities are no longer using the ACT and SAT for admission purposes, maybe the NCAA should also look into it.

Loser wrote:

"Calling them "longstanding forces of institutional racism," the National Association of Basketball Coaches on Thursday proposed permanently eliminating SAT and ACT requirements as part of the NCAA's initial eligibility process."

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/29474153/national-association-basketball-coaches-wants-sat-act-eliminated-eligibility-requirement-college-players

So, as an educator, I do agree that the SAT/ACT should not hold as much weight in admissions as GPA/coursework does. I just don't think that the argument of "institutional racism" applies to the SAT/ACT. I think socioeconomic status plays a greater factor in your ability to do well in school and take a standardized test. I feel that using racism as a reason to have athletes not take the SAT is a bit of a reach

I have taught in multiple states, and the thing is that education standards can vary greatly from one state to the next. There are some states where a kid can graduate with a 4.0 GPA in honors and AP classes and still not be prepared for college because those classes were taught to a poor standard. It shouldn't count for everything, but there should be some way of determining whether a prospective student has enough core knowledge to handle college coursework. Otherwise, you will have some valedictorians from Mississippi that will be in for a rude awakening.

What part of the test is “culturally biased”? Obviously not the math or science sections, which leaves the reading and English sections. The reading section is just reading comprehension (i.e. the questions literally just make sure you understood what you read), so it can’t be the reading section that’s “culturally biased.” That leaves us with the English section, where you basically have to apply the rules of the English language (i.e. proper grammar and syntax, no redundancy). I would imagine your argument is that this section is “culturally biased” since people in the ghetto speak a different dialect of English? Hmm... I don’t know about that.

When I was in college in the early 90s, the basketball team had a big coup when they signed a local blue chip who was being touted as the next Kobe. They had to tutor the kid around the clock to get him to hit the minimum score on the SAT to be able to play basketball. SAT was a max of 1600 back then. The kid needed to hit 800. He finally hit it on his third try, but was a bust in college ball.

This scene has played out hundreds of times in Div 1 sports. Kids who excel in sports in HS blow off class thinking that they will be a pro someday. High schools let them slide through so they can play on the team and get the school to the playoffs. But when it comes time to take the SAT, it is a complete sh#tshow.

There is definitely cultural and racial bias in the SAT, especially on the verbal side. But the college coaches just want to be able to get their recruits through without having to worry about them getting a minimal score on the test.

Maybe classist. Mary Trump tells us Donald knew he was too dumb to do well, but they are loaded, so he just paid someone to take the SAT for him.

The "culturally biased" excuse was born from a handful of questions which have long been deleted - the most famous being the one that looked for an analogy for "runner : marathon" and the best answer was "oarsman : regatta." That would also seem to be biased against the much larger population of poor whites that didn't know much about sailing, but then again, we are dealing with a mindset where the perception is that all white kids grow up using the family yacht, when they aren't networking at the country club.

The "culturally biased" excuse is debunked. Attempts actually have been made to argue mathematics and the scientific method are inherently "culturally biased" (i.e., racist), but they are not credible or even coherent. Neither has anyone accounted for the fact that we are not anywhere near as segregated as required by the "culturally biased" claim - all kinds of kids of different races and backgrounds go to the same schools all around the country. Most of us know that from our own experiences, especially in city schools. Neither has any credible attempt been made to account for why the "culturally biased" tests don't have anywhere near the impact on poor whites, Asians (quite the opposite!), or Hispanics/Latinos that they do on blacks.

Over 50 years now, all that gets repeated is that SAT/ACT must be "culturally biased" against blacks. We are at the point now where we just basically say that any testing of logic, reason, deduction, vocabulary, and math in and of itself, is biased against blacks and we need to just eliminate the idea of standardized testing altogether (why not just eliminate it for blacks?). Grades will soon fall as indicators of anything, as some have already noted. Welcome to the age of reason!

Changed to Liberal NCAA b ball coaches. Again liberalism is a disease and is spreading as bad as covid.

Whites and Asians score better on ACT than other groups. A common argument for dropping the SAT requirement is that whites and Asians come from wealthier backgrounds and can better afford test preparation courses. Now you can benefit from free test prep material on Khan Academy, but a lower income family may only have access to one computer or device to access Khan Academy, whereas a wealthier family may have a computer or device for each family member. A counter argument to this is many schools have affirmative action policies and quotas.

Cali state schools and some private have already dropped act sat from admin standards. Other schools are beginning to follow

I'm a huge fan of the SAT's personally, because they helped me get into schools I wouldn't have gotten into on grades and accomplishments. However, the argument against them is that they predict college grades much worse than high school GPA does, and that they tend to make women and African Americans do worse in admissions than their grades would warrant. In other words, women and African Americans overachieve relative to SAT scores, whereas white men underachieve relative to SAT scores. If they use high school grades without SAT's and ACT's, they'll get more qualified students and a more diverse class.

Look, hard work, opportunity, concentration, and perhaps most importantly, experienced guidance are the best conditions for excelling in school. Hard work is led by faith in the system. In communities where no one makes it, it's going to be tough to get equivalent opportunities, experienced guidance, concentration, and faith in the system. You hear fewer words spoken; you have no books in the household; parents or more likely parent (singular) are stressed from limited opportunities and racism; and your fellow students are unlikely even to graduate from high school. That sets a lot of people up for failure.

Agree with Z(for once).

Translation: "My top prospects are too dumb to get into college, so let's do away with all acceptance standards"