Someone explain a believable “why” COVID-19 is a conspiracy

Primo Numero Uno wrote:

They'd rather continue the farce to that this is something we need to take extreme measures to stop rather than admit, we didn't know what was coming and overreacted. If there's one thing a world leader or politician does not have in short supply its ego and admitting we were wrong would be a huge hit. Plus with the media and all the other politicians to deal with anyone presenting a contradictory opinion gets raked across the coals so the politicians are all afraid to be the one to jump.

I could see this with other world leaders but not Trump. Trump changes his story all the time. If Trump were to say it was all a ruse and let's get back to work, none of his constituency would give it a second thought. In fact, they'd be happy about it.

yoyoyo... wrote:

Primo Numero Uno wrote:

They'd rather continue the farce to that this is something we need to take extreme measures to stop rather than admit, we didn't know what was coming and overreacted. If there's one thing a world leader or politician does not have in short supply its ego and admitting we were wrong would be a huge hit. Plus with the media and all the other politicians to deal with anyone presenting a contradictory opinion gets raked across the coals so the politicians are all afraid to be the one to jump.

I could see this with other world leaders but not Trump. Trump changes his story all the time. If Trump were to say it was all a ruse and let's get back to work, none of his constituency would give it a second thought. In fact, they'd be happy about it.

Trump is too stupid to see what is going on and really diagnose the issue nor does he have credibility with a lot of people to do so. He's done whats best for him politically is punt the issue down to the states and blame the liberal governors for not opening things and damaging the economy.

dunes runner wrote:

[quote]whyze why wrote:

please explain why governments across the world would be taking these extreme measures to stop COVID-19 if it’s not a serious health threat?

They're promoting covid19 - not trying to stop it.

/thread.

I thought you said the thread was over? You're trying to start a conspiracy theory.

They didn't all take extreme measures. Of those that did, some were merely panicked, and some were run by politicians who thrive the use of fear for political gain.

You don't need to ferret out an actual "conspiracy" to know that this is happening. And if there had been no virus, there would be a mass freakout about something else. In fact, there WAS another one - BLM - which made people forget about the virus for a week or two. This is how western politics works - and it is the true reason the US and Europe are "hardest hit" by the virus, other than the global south not being very susceptible to colds.

In the United States, the posturing by the Democrats was very clear. With the Russiagate hoax dead and their nominee for president a mental decrepit, they and their media allies made a desperate gamble to stir up a huge crisis, destroy the economy and try to blame it all on Trump. The economy came roaring back anyway, so now they're trying to destroy it again. They'll be doing this all through November - it is, quite literally, their campaign strategy. They'll probably have a virtual convention and not allow Sleepy Joe to debate.

They weren't originally going to do this. At first Joe wanted to be the anti-panic guy, criticizing Trump for cancelling the flights from China.

Many many countries around the world instituted pretty severe measures like lock downs and contact tracing etc to control COVID-19. Countries throughout the world, across continents did extreme measures. But in your mind, the whole crisis was invented by members of the US democratic party. I'm not even a Dem, but can see that rhat is ridiculous based on how most of the world was affected and has reacted.

Bad Wigins wrote:

They weren't originally going to do this. At first Joe wanted to be the anti-panic guy, criticizing Trump for cancelling the flights from China.

I remember Joe Biden categorically stating that there would definitely be no more than 2600 cases in the US.

Oh wait, that wasn't Joe, that was someone else.....

But how do you know any of this?? It sounds suspiciously close to what Donald Trump and the right-wing media says

It’s this and the ridiculous pandering to the “one death is too many” crowd. Ruining little kid’s childhoods and education because of fear over facts. Implementing “cures” that do more damage than the scamdemic every will.

The problem isn't that it isn't real. The problem is the moving goalposts. The dems have staked their territory that the virus is the worst ever, so they keep on script. First, the number of deaths would be astronomical. well, we took measures to flatten the curve so the hospitals would not be overrun. Once we were able to flatten the curve, the narrative changed that even one death was too many, so as to keep the spotlight on it. (People need to listen to what was said about the intent of flattening the curve. It is ludicrous that they have forgotten what was said early on.) So, the curve was flattened and we re-opened, but the dems never backed off their claim that the mortality rate was like 5-10%, (I forget the original number, TBH) and then the data came back that it was closer to 1%. So, they changed the narrative to asymptomatic people and false negative tests (which made the mortality rate even lower). Because they got caught using inaccurate data to scare people, they had to change course and claim that it produces health issues that will not be seen for a while.

Yes, the virus is real, but the democrat's narrative is what is not real. Keep moving those goalposts, and people will see just how dishonest you people really are.

MelRnr wrote:

What really makes me shake my head is when someone says that there wouldn't be a crisis if this wasn't an election year. Yeah ok. As if the rest of the world doesn't exist.

Comments like those just show how narrow minded the Trumpers are.

They obviously did it so that you can come to letsrun and post "whats wrong with everyone" for not following corrupt government bodies which is of course part of a government that you hate and also so you can chase down and scream at people not wearing their mask in the park.

Yes, the virus is real, but the democrat's narrative is what is not real. Keep moving those goalposts, and people will see just how dishonest you people really are.

The question is “why”. Also, please explain the international response, not just the US.

Many many countries instituted pretty severe measures? Like much more severe than the US?

Wow! Many many countries instituted contact tracing?

Can you list all of these many many countries that have done this?

Can you explain to me the severe measures taken by the following countries which have far fewer alleged covid deaths comparatively than the US?

-Bangladesh

-Poland

-Romania

-Argentina

-Philippines

-Ukraine

-Japan

-Afghanistan

-Denmark

-Nigeria

-Hungary

-Sudan

-Belarus

-Czech Rep

-Finland

-Cameroon

-Serbia

-S. Korea

-Morocco

-Bulgaria

-Greece

-Norway

-Kazakhstan

-Congo

-Kenya

-Senegal

-Ghana

-Croatia

-Haiti

-Australia

-Cuba

-Lithuania

-Estonia

-Ivory Coast

-Albania

-Thailand

-Tajikistan

-Venezuela

-Tunisia

-Gabon

-South Sudan-

-Congo

-Lebanon

-Latvia

-Nepal

-Slovakia

-Uruguay

-Uzbekistan

-Libya

-Zambia

-Madagascar

-New Zealand

-Benin

-Tanzania

-Cyprus

-Paraguay

-Costa Rica

-Malawi

-Georgia

-Angola-

-Montenegro

+50 more

I mean seriously, what did countries like Georgia & Montenegro do so that they basically have less deaths from Covid than from lightning strikes? Did they seal everyone in their homes? What amazing control tactics did Nigeria use to end up so much better than the US? Was it their far better leadership?

Without going through your entire list, I'll just talk about the couple I know off the top of my head from that...

Japan - Was one of the first countries to close their schools. They cancelled the Tokyo Marathon and postponed the Olympics.

Uruguay - Cosed down early unlike their neighbors in Brazil who are in a complete mess right now. In fact I just read about what a great job Uruguay did in this article below.

I'm sure if I looked into other countries you listed I'd find more evidence that all you are doing here is posting misinformation and lies.

This explains a lot:

https://blog.nomorefakenews.com/2020/07/01/murder-by-lockdown-details-from-a-dozen-countries/

"The reference here is a stunning May 23 article by John Pospichal, “Questions for lockdown apologists,” posted at medium.com.

(This is part-4 in the series, “Killing Old People”. For part-3, click here.)

Pospichal examined overall mortality numbers for Austria, Belgium, Denmark, England and Wales, France, Italy, Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Ecuador, and New York City.

Supported by charts, here are excerpts from his article:

“We now have mortality data for the first few months of 2020 for many countries, and, as you might expect, there were steep increases associated with the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic in each one.”

“Surprisingly, however, these increases did not begin before the lockdowns were imposed, but after. Moreover, in almost every case, they began immediately after. Often, mortality numbers were on a downward trend before suddenly reversing course after lockdowns were decreed.”

“This is an astonishing finding…”

“You will notice that only after each country (or city) was locked down did the increases begin. Moreover, they began immediately, and in nearly every case, precipitously.”

“All this leads us to the following questions, which we pose to all those who continue to defend the use of lockdowns as an effective means to prevent excess deaths.”

“Q: Why was there no significant increase in overall mortality, in any country we have good data for, before the start of lockdowns?”

“Q: Why does a precise and exact correlation exist between the start of lockdowns and significant rises in overall mortality?”

“Q: How is it that governments in every country imposed lockdowns at precisely the same time relative to the future precipitous rise in their populations’ overall mortality rate?”

“Q: How is it, moreover, that this moment in time [i.e., the imposition of lockdowns] happened to fall immediately before that precipitous rise?”

“Q: If health authorities vastly underestimated the prevalence of the virus at the beginning of the pandemic, why did the virus nevertheless wait until lockdowns were imposed to suddenly start killing at levels which exceeded normal deaths?”

—To that last question, I would respond: No virus would wait. We’re not talking about a virus at all. We’re talking about the sudden effects of the lockdowns.

And those sudden death-effects would come crashing down, first, and immediately, on the most vulnerable people in these countries:

The elderly, who were already ill for years.

THE LOCKDOWNS FORCED THE PREMATURE DEATHS OF OLD PEOPLE.

PEOPLE WHO HAD BEEN SUFFERING FROM MULTIPLE HEALTH CONDITIONS FOR YEARS, WHO HAD BEEN TREATED WITH TOXIC MEDICAL DRUGS, WHOSE IMMUNE SYSTEMS WERE ALREADY SEVERELY COMPROMISED…

AND WHO ARE SUDDENLY TERRIFIED BY TWO MORE FACTORS—THE POSSIBILITY OF A COVID-19 DIAGNOSIS, AND ISOLATION FROM FRIENDS AND FAMILY. THESE TWO FACTORS PUSH THEM OVER THE EDGE AND THEY DIE.

Especially in nursing homes; but also in hospitals, and in their homes.

This is the true face of “COVID.”

This is how the case numbers and the death numbers are being propped up all over the world, to yield the impression of a virus on the loose.

Without those huge numbers, the whole vicious charade of a pandemic would be exposed and rejected at once.

The lockdowns are a method of killing.

The governors and mayors and presidents and prime ministers who imposed the lockdowns—and behind them, the planners of “COVID”— have been killing old people."

I don't personally think there's a conspiracy theory. Hard to know what the right thing to do was early on. I'm kind of a cautious person so I always err on the side of being careful at least start off with.

Why would governments around the world do this if it wasn't a serious health risk well could be the gain more power could be to prepare the world for one world order. There could be Powers behind the scenes unknown unseen. Wars could be started the world economy could change.

Doesn't seem we were prepared very well for something like this although we knew this is a possible thing that could happen. I don't really like throwing blame and who did something one way or another way and it would have it turned out to be good or bad.

All we can do is prepare for the future from what we know now. Prepare physically and mentally materially Spiritually. Hopefully this is not the beginning of something even bigger but if it is might as well be ready heart mind body soul.

Here is the real conspiracy. As noted in many of the above posts, the virus has been successfully managed around the world through strong government responses both on the public health side and on the social welfare side (income support, freeze on financial obligations, etc.). In the US, northern states have had success on the public health side and have done a minimal amount on the social welfare side. The southern states have purposefully and intentionally allowed the virus to come roaring back and spread virtually uncontrolled. Every public health expert warned about reopening too soon. They all predicted a big surge of cases in the summer. So, why in the world would the southern states ignore the scientists and reopen early? The answer is that it was a conspiracy between business interests and hard right wingers to try to show the world that nothing can get in the way of capital. If the southern states had followed the scientists and provided social benefits to those put out of work/business (Texas is sitting on a 10 billion rainy day fund), then they would have effectively conceded that social democracy works. Instead, they have deployed their disinformation campaigns via Foxnews and other conservative media outlets and commentators to try to convince everyone that the virus isn't so bad after all and the interests of the capitalists are more important than keeping Grandpa or your diabetic brother in law safe. It is the same arguments as to why we just have to deal with global warming, toxic pollution, etc. If we do anything, everyone will lose their jobs and starve. But around the world that has not been the case. Social democratic governments have kept income flowing to workers while the public health system works to get the virus down to a very manageable level.

So I do think some of the actions taken did result in Deaths of elderly. The isolation or fear to go out and get medical care is real. The policy some states had of putting Covid patients in nursing homes was devastating. I don't know enough on this precise topic outside the US to comment.

I'm curious for a logical explanation of why all these parties would do this to kill the elderly. Why would all these individual governors and foreign politicians go to all this trouble to kill a few hundred thousand elderly people a few months before they would have died anyway? Even if their goal was to save strain on the healthcare system which is absurd because this would be like a 4-month relief on a never-ending problem, completely destroying the world's economy and damaging the livelihood of young healthy people seems to counteract this.

I think the COVID numbers are being propped up wit elederly who should not be counted. But I feel it is far more likely that was a negative unintended consequence that is nowbeing used as a face-saving tool the politicians than the original purpose of the lockdowns.

I've almost given up on logic on this one because I've seen so many smart people act so irrationally. I think what it comes down to is most people don't have the ability to actually process risks when it comes to themselves and loved ones. You hear all about Covid all day and it becomes very real and you become terrified that it will kill your kids, even though your kids are statistically more at risk from other viruses. Suddenly there becomes a sense that there will be a bigger sense of regret if Covid hurts someone you love than a number of other things that are far more likely to kill them. Helicopter parents continue to do lasting damage to kids health and development over fears of obscure things like abductions or school shooting, but abduction seems so real because every time it happens it is the top story in the news. I have friends with advanced STEM degrees on full lockdown not letting their kids out now because of their fear of what the virus could do to their young children. They are very smart people and understand science but the fear has become so real the facts and reality do not matter.

moving goalposts wrote:

The problem isn't that it isn't real. The problem is the moving goalposts. The dems have staked their territory that the virus is the worst ever, so they keep on script. .

I can't think of a single democrat (or person period) who thought COVID19 was going to be the worst ever. Care to list a single person who said it was going to be worse than 1918 or the black death?

We can make a pretty long list of people who said it would be like the flu and over by april. 130k deaths later and some idiots are stilling listening to those people.

Are you for real? New York just dipped under Texas for daily deaths. About 14 times as many people have died in New York as Texas, this is due to New Yorks failure to understand the virus poses minimal threat to young healthy people and only to very sick and their policies that exposed the very vulnerable to the virus. New cases have slowed in the Northern States which has little to do with their actions and more with the fact that a much higher percentage of the population has already had the virus. Don't cite antibody results which have been found to be meaningless.

Everyone is obsessing over rising case numbers without asking the question is that really a problem when this is in young healthy people who are not at risk and don't tax the medical system. Because if that is the standard we should never stop social distancing even when we have a Covid cure because other viruses are just as bad to the majority of the population.

I agree the Republicans have regularly been the enemies of science. But what the Liberals have done to science and facts on this one is atrocious. Statistically, we are going to learn this is no worse than the flu. We just have no prior immunity to it. The flu is not as damaging on a yearly basis to the elderly as Covid has been because we focus on getting those individuals flu shots and they have usually had prior exposure to the virus. But it would be just as damaging if their was no prior immunity. The question we should be asking is not how slow the spread of Covid but how do we keep things normal for 95% of the population while protecting those in the super vulnerable category, which should be a normal thing everyday not just with Covid around.