can i break 17:00 for 5k

As a 45 year old, I am probably going to say something you don’t want to hear. Even as a master you can’t do more on less. 30 miles a week + cross training isn’t going to yield fast times. If those 400’s were around 65-70 you might have a chance. But endurance and your aerobic engine is key. Unfortunately, only running can get that for you. I know because I have done what you’re trying to do.

If you are willing to put in a consistent aggressive stretching and strengthening program, you can overcome those plaguing injuries and put in the miles you need to.

I was doing what you are doing and was just plain frustrated. For some reason, I thought I could run fast and not do the work. Now I do yoga and imbalance strengthening for an hour each morning. I have been able to ramp up my mileage to 60 miles a week and stay healthy...caveat it took 3 years to get to this point. But I’m am running times I could not run at 40.

I ended up running 17:32 for the 5k this season. However, during the start of outdoor, I did 5x1000s in about low 3:20s-sub 3:20 which felt pretty easy. Also did 4-5xmile around low 5:40-30s going down to 5:20s which also felt great. This summer, I'm planning on averaging 50mpw in hopes of running around 16:20s in the 5k. Btw, I'm new to running since I started xc my sophomore year.

Progression:

Sophomore year: First year 19:23 5k. 2-5 miles a day over the summer.

Junior year: 17:32 5k. 5-8 miles a day over the summer. Mostly 5-6 miles. Highest I went was 49 I believe. Averaged around 35-40?

Junior year (right now): Working towards averaging 50 mpw. High might be around 56-60. Planning on implementing tempos later in the summer. Hope it goes well.

evening wrote:

kipchoges uncle wrote:

Averaging 30 miles per week + cross training

Pretty comfortable doing 5 mile tempo runs around 6 min pace

Recent workouts:

5x 1000 in 3:32 with 90 sec walking recovery

10x 400 in 80-81 with 60 sec walking recovery + 1 mile in 5:30 pretty controlled

Late 40's, had some injuries, hence the relatively low mileage

Thankyou

Do 6x1000m with 3' rest, if you can hit 3:20-3:23s at an 8/10 effort you should be able to run sub 17.

If you want to do a very hard workout, go for 4xmile with 2' rest. Better predictor than 1000s with 60-90r, but it's basically a race effort.

That makes sense. I would run the 6 x 1000m session as you describe, and hit 17:01 when I was 46.

Good thread! I'm curious what a typical easy day pace is for folks running 30-40 per week and targeting 17ish for 5k?

I'm new to distance training and trying to maintain that mileage at about 750-815 pace, and think I may be overdoing it a bit. Workouts aren't as consistent as I'd like so far with the higher mileage.

I ran 16:48.6 in February. I would not be able to do the 5 x 1k workout you did, I could do the 400s workout but it would be hard (I wouldn't be able to do the 5:30 mile at the end), and my 5 mile tempos were 6:20-6:35 pace. I was however running 70-75 mpw.

I think sub 17 is possible based off the workout times, the only possible doubt is the weekly mileage. I think if you get the right day with good weather, good competition, flat/fast course, and you just absolutely go to the well.... it can happen. Keep up the work, and good luck!

Great job to be in that shape in your late 40s! I am 55 and the last time I broke 17 I was 36 or 37. Try 6x800 in 2:40 2 min rest. Also 2 mile time trial 10.50. If u an hit those times u have a good chance

id give it a lock if you can do those 400s in the mid 70 seconds but i think you got this. with the rest of the metrics - with slightly quicker 400 repeats id give you 16:3x

Thank you. I believe I'm in the range. My workouts are intentionally not as hard as the could be because age. Probably need to do something a little more intense to feel the crunchiness of 5k effort.

Well.....if you have a coach who knows how to do it on low mileage you can succeed like the Irish aged 43 guy I coached 2 months from a master PB 16:30 at 5 k to 15:37 !!He just ran 5 sessions per week! What you need is a world class coach to succeed!

I ran 17:38 solo TT in may, and then four days after did 7x1k in 3:29/3:30 with 90 seconds rest and it wasn't a killer workout. however my tempos were more like 6:10 pace for 4 miles... 6:00's for 5 miles would have been a hard effort. didn't really do anything as short as 400's.

3 weeks later i ran 61:30 for 10 miles so i think the TT was pretty spot on.

i would guess you're in 17:0x shape, giving more weight to the tempos than the interval workout.

on the track or on the roads? track - for sure; roads - maybe, but would be tough.

I ran 16:31 in my mid-40s. Averaged 40 mpw for the 52 weeks before that. But, like you, was constantly working around injury. Running is the best training for running races. When healthy I would target 65+ mpw consistently. When injured, I cross-trained (mostly elliptical) 10 to 15 hours per week. You have decent "wheels" so don't really need to work on speed, IMHO - more speed endurance.

kipchoges uncle wrote:

Jan Stensson , Coach JS wrote:

You run paces that can reach a sub 17min 5 k , it will be close.......

-Head coach of LRC -

Thank you all for thoughtful responses.

Kinda want to try without the intense “predictor” workouts.

Will definitely make a run at it. Maybe a 2 mile time trial first.

el chapo wrote:

Good thread! I'm curious what a typical easy day pace is for folks running 30-40 per week and targeting 17ish for 5k?

I'm new to distance training and trying to maintain that mileage at about 750-815 pace, and think I may be overdoing it a bit. Workouts aren't as consistent as I'd like so far with the higher mileage.

You should do at least 7:50 pace but can go slightly faster. Good luck!

crunchiness great word here. im in my 30s so im now aware of this. and yes for trying to go for a speedy time at your age (you’re young for a tree or a lobster) maintaining the race pace will probably hurt.

80s 400 repeats is like 16:34 or so pace. thats nice. and good. i think if you can get in some sessions at 75s pace you’re a lock man.

im a ham and egger simply a low 15 min 5k guy but i do know that the third mile is where that deep fitness and trained speed work kicks in.

let us know how you make out at the race

Ran a 3200m time trial this morning.

5:27, 5:25 = 10:52

First "race" since an 8k in April of 2018.

Overall felt pretty solid. Kicked pretty well the last 400. Pretty sure I would've slipped off in a 3rd mile. But it was good to feel that sustained effort. Definitely will do a couple workouts of 800s-1600s at that pace.

With your tempo and the TT, sub-17 is definitely within reach. You may just need a few shorter tune-up races.

Following up

Had a nice workout of 6x 600s in 2:00

Then had a couple weeks managing hamstring cramp/strain (not from the above)... age

Recently ran another 2 mile time trial in 10:53, so at least near where I was

Today, 5x 1200 in 4:16, 4:15, 4:12, 4:09, 4:08 with 80 second walk recovery + 2x 200 in 34

Those were cruise intervals (not all out by any means)

Goal for fall is sub 17 and truthfully sub 16:50 (age grade 83% for 47 year old)

Run a mile time trial and see where you’re at.. that will give you a pretty solid start

good thread. to the op, you are in shape for sub 17. nice work!

can we agree that for an older runner (m45 +), low mileage training with cross training (!) doesn't mean that the training has a low volume? i think avoiding injuries and optimizing training stimuli are good goals. sometimes more miles jeopardize these goals.

at the age of 47 i achieved a sub 16:50 with the furman / first philosophy (3 quality runs plus 2 cross-training days per week). i'm starting again now, after i was fixated on the 800m last and this year, but somehow lost interest in it.

one of the toughest weeks for sub 17 / 5k was according to the furman / first plan, which i strictly adhered to:

1. 10x400 / 90s recovery in 72s (in my case standing or slow motion walking recovery)

2. 4-miler at 5:45 mile pace

3. 10-miler at 6:15 mile pace

i didn't always make the target times, but on average i was pretty close.