What does a productive way forward look like

It appears the virus is going away. It is in fact possible that it will go away and never return. If this is the case we can get back to normal. Actually I would like to see major changes like replacing government, banning compulsory education and a change in mindset of the world so we can all live in peace and prosperity.

The OP was asking for productive ways forward and many are simply listing things they wish were different.

Cultures change from generation to generation. This is inevitable. The world is different now than 50, 100, 1000 years ago. We aren't going back to some way it was way back when. This generation is softer than the previous one, which was softer than the one before that, and so on. So what? It's no ones fault, it just is. The internet has drastically changed the world. It's great for some things bad for others but it's not going away.

I live in Southern California and I see this situation gradually resolving itself because the youth (those under 30) are getting bored with this shelter in place situation. They have been respectful and following along but after 10 weeks plus of this they are moving towards returning to their normal lives.

Younger people generally feel like they are invincible anyway and statistics show that this virus isn't anything they need to worry about. More and more I am seeing them in groups, without masks, returning their lives to the way they were before. Unless the police start throwing people in jail, which I don't believe will happen in a major way, the younger folks will just return to their lives. This will cause the virus to spread very quickly and we'll get to heard immunity at some point... some people (mostly older) will die due to this, which isn't a good thing, but there isn't a cure and there probably won't be one so there is little we can do about it.

Perhaps people will learn from this experience and move towards healthier lifestyles... eating better and exercising regularly. That would be a positive result from all of this but we shall see.

Btw, I am older and in a much higher risk group (and a democrat) I just don't think the world can just hide from this disease for much longer... I don't see any other way.

why do pendulums swing>? because things have gone to far in one direction, so they swing in the opposite direction. if we want to go back to the way things were, then we will continue to swing to far in the other direction

based on your numbers, if the lazy 40% stopped going to work then 20% would have no one to create their wealth. So then they would move to automation, which in turn would turn the 40% into 5% because we wouldn't no longer need that 35% of middle management to oversee the lazy 40%. Now the 20% would become 5% because we would no longer need the majority of their products because 75% would have no income. Then we are left with 5% who will brutally rule over a lazy 95% who don't understand their decent status in life.

The productive way forward would be for our health professionals to saturate the airwaves with reports that getting healthy is the single best thing everyone can do for their own personal health. If health officials quit harping on masks and social distancing and instead, starting inundating the public with stories about how a healthy immune system can reduce risk of infection and risk severity if you do get infected.

Even if the data is shaky, it would result in less obesity, heart disease, high blood pressure, and other diseases.

It's borderline criminal that Fauci et al aren't doing this.

You must be an advocate of neo-math now apparently taught in schools. That makes no sense, Duke. First of all, 50% of the lazy 40% have stopped going to work, and they aren't really missed as much as it was predicted. Second, it's the other 40% - the 50% of the 80% that understand the need for the 20% - that matter, not the lazy 40%. Third, the 20%ers are the ones driving automation - automation is not driven by the whims of the lazy 40% deciding how much to goof off on any given day. So there is no chance of the 20% dwindling to 5% (or Karl Marx's 1%) and "brutally ruling" your mythical 95%. From the common man's perspective, that's the beauty of the American system - 80% get a better much life than they would ever get if left to their own devices, because of the 20%ers.

"80% get a better much life than they would ever get if left to their own devices, because of the 20%ers. "

Not quiet. The top 1% lives off the work of the middle 80%. The bottom 20% exists to scare the 80% to keep working.

The virus has exposed the Trump economy as a complete failure. It's utterly amazing to me that massive numbers of businesses (large and small), as well as renters/homeowners, live a missed payment (or a bad month of revenue) away from default. The savings rate is pathetic, but why wouldn't it be? The fed keeps the interest rate near zero for a decade, so putting a few bucks away each month doesn't pay off at all. How the heck does United Airlines need a bailout after three bad weeks? This is a company who was making profits hand over fist by charging more and more fees.

Apparently they saved nothing for a downturn.

This entire economy is a joke, a farce. The friggin stock market bottomed out in mid-March, before that news that 40 million people are out of work, and . But the markets go up?

BTW, nothing will change, and no one will learn anything. People just want "back to normal", even if normal means being one missed paycheck away from being tossed out in the street. Unbelievable.

A growing segment of those 20% are software engineers who introduce games like candy crush. These are worthless. I would also count among the worthless doctors who specialize in elective surgery, and if you want me to get really utilitarian about matters also worthless are the marketing agencies and all their little minions. Politicians in our country, as we have seen for over 200 yrs now, are worthless. Lobbyist, MSM nuff said. Entertainers aren’t worthless, but not worth nearly what they make. And I have growing suspicions that you are worthless.

you call this corrupted squalor of a government a “proven system” without realizing that among developed countries we are among the most young.

All that you have proved is that anyone can use the numbers they want to back your point.

We are going to have to accept that some things will change forever.

We’re not waiting this out and going right back to where we were.

There is no switch to turn. Open everything back up and fewer will choose to travel than before. That industry will be hurt really bad.

Stadium events will likely have smaller turnouts.

Some new industries will boom.

I don’t know what’s going to become of public transportation. That’s a huge transmitter of disease.

That has to be addressed going forward.

The additional unemployment benefits are currently there to encourage people not to work, so the transmission is slowed. Leadership is confusing now. We want to somehow contain the spread and have all back to work at the same time. Not possible.

Things will be bad for many.

It’s like getting hit by meteors for a year.

You can’t do much about it. Just weather it and build back when it’s clear.

fxtjhdsr wrote:

"80% get a better much life than they would ever get if left to their own devices, because of the 20%ers. "

Not quiet. The top 1% lives off the work of the middle 80%. The bottom 20% exists to scare the 80% to keep working.

My perception from many years in business, dealing with many different types of business, is that its 20%, not 1%, and that some large (but decreasing) percentage of the population (call it 60%) understand they are reaping the benefits of the ingenuity of that 20%, and not being exploited by them.

Your perception, and it looks like most people in this thread, is much different. I understand the allure of believing you and the rest of "middle" 80%" are all decent, hard-working types, toiling away and getting the shaft from some small elite group of evil-minded corporate fat cats (the 1%ers). The belief that one is being persecuted and taken advantage of is always fun to have, as it explains so many personal shortcomings and provides a rallying cry for friends and compatriots. Ironically, that's what Trumpism is all about - finding joy in pretending all kinds of amorphous elite and controlling forces are out to get you. Religion deals in the same emotion.

Anyway, my perceptions are much different than yours. We are not ruled by some small group of elites. We are driven by hard working people of intelligence, and the average guy should be thanking his god for them.

inierested reader wrote:

We’re caught in a trap, forced to decide between lives and livelihoods, public health and the economy. Most discussion on the topic descends into chirping and name-calling, dividing mainly along political lines (at least in the US, if perhaps not as much elsewhere). I’m wondering if we can manage some calm discussion on a productive way through this. Nobody wants to destroy the economy and nobody wants people to die, or at least those are my starting assumptions, and yet some degree of both is unavoidable.

My question is, given what we’ve learned so far, what is the best balance of freedoms versus restrictions to find an optimum path through this?

What I'v e learned is we can't go on together with suspicious minds. And we can't build our dreams on suspicious minds.

"my perceptions are much different than yours."

No they are not. I was trying to be funny. My real perception is that the 1% idea is a myth. That without the rich everyone's standard of living (in pure economic terms) would be vastly different. Redistributing wealth is wrong. Today even the bottom 20% lives far better than the richest person 100 years ago.

Trump blew it with testing. Our only hope now is a massive testing program. Otherwise Trump has ruined the country.

Ryan Foreman wrote:

inierested reader wrote:

We’re caught in a trap, forced to decide between lives and livelihoods, public health and the economy. Most discussion on the topic descends into chirping and name-calling, dividing mainly along political lines (at least in the US, if perhaps not as much elsewhere). I’m wondering if we can manage some calm discussion on a productive way through this. Nobody wants to destroy the economy and nobody wants people to die, or at least those are my starting assumptions, and yet some degree of both is unavoidable.

My question is, given what we’ve learned so far, what is the best balance of freedoms versus restrictions to find an optimum path through this?

What I'v e learned is we can't go on together with suspicious minds. And we can't build our dreams on suspicious minds.

Why can't you see what you're doing to me when you don't believe a word I say?

A business guy who thinks the world wouldn’t exist without capitalism. Fresh take.