Track and Field News publishes video of Alan Webb beating Ritz at 10,000 from 2006 - How in the world did that happen?

Coevett wrote:

How did Alan Webb have more endurance than speed for a miler with such a relatively muscular build?

Just like Nick Symmonds who was an endurance based 800 runner with a very muscular body, it's called genetic and lifting

Excuse the typo

If only Webb could have learned to run tactically. Imagine if he had Centro's head for it.

Paul Bunyan wrote:

Timmy Treadwell wrote:

Geb dropped down in distance and won a world indoors 1500m gold medal.

Seems many fast 1500m runners have a good 10k in them and vice versa.

No kidding. Not to mention KB and Mo Farah. Rupp has impressive PRs at both distances too.

I didn't really understand why people were so shocked that Webb won that race. He already had 2 mile and 5k PRs that were well in-line with a fast 10k, and if I remember correctly Ritz wasn't exactly setting the world on fire at that point.

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Ritz had been sick for the longest time and had only been back and running track intervals for 5 weeks.

donkeydoug wrote:

Paul Bunyan wrote:

No kidding. Not to mention KB and Mo Farah. Rupp has impressive PRs at both distances too.

I didn't really understand why people were so shocked that Webb won that race. He already had 2 mile and 5k PRs that were well in-line with a fast 10k, and if I remember correctly Ritz wasn't exactly setting the world on fire at that point.

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Ritz had been sick for the longest time and had only been back and running track intervals for 5 weeks.

I'm sure you're right...Sounds like every season Ritz ever had. It was always impressive that he ran as well as he did, given the circumstances.

dadsfadsfdasfdsafdas wrote:

zxczxcv wrote:

Each of the Ingebrigtsens, all 1500m runners, has won a European junior or senior XC title over 10k.

When people talk about Steve Ovett., they. get all excited about his slow (for an elite runner) HM as a sign of his range. Or Said Aouita. Basically we also want milers to run distance races but when they do some people think they are stupid to do so:)

Ovett's half marathon came during the track season when he was training for 800m. I think he won European Cup 800m about two weeks later. A better measure might be that he won an Olympic Gold at 800m and a Commonwealth Games 5000m (over Jack Buckner, who would win the European 5000m later that year). He also won the Inter Counties x-Country (trial for World Champs at the time) over 7 1/2 miles.

I think Webb came pretty close to his potential time wise 800 through mile, but I don't think he came close in the 3k to 5k range. I always wished he would've gone for it in a non championship year. It would've been great to see him add a sub 13 to his resume.

Another miler type who ran a pretty decent 10000 is Ronald Kwemoi, who has run 27:33 along with 3:28.81, 7:28 and 13:16. Although judging on his training logs, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to suspect that he has a problem with overtraining and burning out.

https://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=8191628

He's Alan effing Webb. Crazy to think he also beat Rupp in a 5K in 2010.

buzzzzzzzz lightyear! wrote:

WinnytheBish wrote:

Yikes, someone sure is defensive...is this Scott Razcko? I said it was unorthodox, and you pulled one example from 40 years ago to prove what? That only two coaches have done this in 40 years? I stand by my point.

I don't think he's defensive at all, but you seem to be. What's wrong, not used to people disagreeing with you? Your thoughts aren't universal, they are just yours. Get over it.

Kipchoge ran 2 mile races, as a world class runner. I don't know if you heard, but he's pretty decent at the marathon as well.

I can only assume you're Julia Webb at this point.

I just want to make sure you actually understand what I'm saying, since you seemed to have pointed out a totally different runner in a totally different situation. Did Kipchoge run the marathon in the same season as those 2 miles? Just curious, otherwise your post makes absolutely no sense. Feel free to also name the other runners who ran a 10k in a season focused on the mile when you figure it out.

I'm saying it's unorthodox to run a 10k the same season as a mile, both on the track. Obviously it didn't hurt him too badly, but I'm just saying it's different. I said it was crazy too, but didn't mention anywhere about it being a bad idea, which is what I assume you imagined to get yourself riled up. I was more thinking in awe of Webb's talent than saying it was a horrible training method.

plant curious wrote:

fubulemon wrote:

I have a theory - Webb took less time than Ritz to propel his body 10,000 meters, and as a result crossed the line first. I know it sounds implausible, but this is actually a very common way for one runner to beat another runner in a race, especially in an event such as the 10,000 meters, which is 10,000 meters long.

Ok, smart@$$. Rojo was obviously asking how they published the story. Technical details of running a website mystify him. He is well versed in the mechanics of the sport.

They secured the rights to the video, likely by paying the broadcasters, and then wrote an article about it?

I don't understand what you are getting at.

About the race, Webb had extraordinary guts. Many miles have great fitness and great 5k/10k potential but will never be able to race properly to maximize their ability.

Webb however is pure guts. He pushed himself to the max no matter what.

It’s a bummer that at some point in every Galen Rupp thread doping comes up, but Webb never gets it. Not logical.

Rupp is a super talent too. 13:37 in high school. 3:50 mile etc

That 10k didn’t necessarily screw Webb up but his training around it did. I seem to remember him screwing up his hamstring not long after this bc raczko gave him some 30 x 200 or 20 x 400 workout like the week after, no?

cxghb wrote:

Because Alan Webb is the most talented US runner ever.

Also the biggest choker. The biggest head case. The most emo.

...because Webb that season was much better aerobically trained; balanced with his anaerobic talent.

Paul Bunyan wrote:

Timmy Treadwell wrote:

Geb dropped down in distance and won a world indoors 1500m gold medal.

Seems many fast 1500m runners have a good 10k in them and vice versa.

No kidding. Not to mention KB and Mo Farah. Rupp has impressive PRs at both distances too.

I didn't really understand why people were so shocked that Webb won that race. He already had 2 mile and 5k PRs that were well in-line with a fast 10k, and if I remember correctly Ritz wasn't exactly setting the world on fire at that point. Possibly that race was a PR for him at the time, too.

I seem to remember that 2006 was a year where Webb had difficulty even breaking 4:00 for the mile...I think everything was geared towards building strength that season which really paid off in 2007.

Ritz had maybe 4 races lifetime that set the world on fire ..they all came just a few short months after moving up the road to Portland in May of 2009 to work with the famous chemist AlSal ... 5 months after leaving Hudson ... 27:22, 12:56, 1:00:00. The only other races of any real world class note would be 2:09:55 and 2:07:47; both of which pale in comparison to his blazing first few months with the good doctor AlSal.

I didn't click the link but I recall in the post race interview Ritz said before the race they agreed to share pacing duties rotating each lap. The 25th lap each was on their own. Not too shocking that Webb had a better kick. But I guess at the time nobody really knew his range. He could have run sub-13 if he trained for it in his prime.

The key workouts that made Webb run fast and strong , mile - 10000m , was 20 x 400m and his 9-10 x 800m ......just the problem he didn`t have a coach to know the perfect individual pace for him and not overdo the workout pace as he did. That became his downfall......

-The Wizard -

Webb ran his 800m, 1500m, and mile pb within less than a month of each other.

When you’re hot, you’re hot, and should take advantage of it and race. Jager should have gone after sub 8:00. Chelimo, Houlihan, countless others should have chased times. WVN should have gone after sub 43 etc.

You never know if you’ll get everything aligned again as history has proven. And then COVID happens and you might not even get races to run.