my friend thinks u. bolt could run a sub-4:30 mile

They can delete all the posts between us, that would be fine. They are unfortunate.......Douche.

No, I'm not good at insults. I'm sure you have dedicated your life to them and therefore are a legend in your own mind at least as far as they are concerned. I happily concede that you are better at insults than I am. (Although I'm not sure where my insults were. I am stating that you are a fraud. How do I know? Let me put it in your own language. "I know because I know!"

Let me ask you this since you are an expert (allegedly). Let's say I've got a Freshman that runs 2:00 in the 800. As a senior he will run 4:00 in the 1500, run a fairly hilly cross country 5k under 18, and his pure power is such that he throws just under 31 feet in the shot put (in other words, his power isn't that impressive. You can throw a 16 foot and change LJ into the mix if you want. Can he break 13.00 FAT from the blocks How about 12.00?

This is ridiculous! Do any of you have any grasp of human physiology? The sprinters on our track team do an occasional distance time trial around a clock near our school. The distance is around 1.5-1.7 miles. We had a 50 low 400m runner that runs in the mid 10s for it! Even our slow 5:50-6:20 mile guys beat him! We also have a sprinter who is a senior that ran 11s as a junior in the 100m that couldn't break 11 ON A 1.5-1.7 MILE COURSE! Sprinting and distance running have very little in common and it is ignorant to think that just because someone is a good sprinter they should be able to run well in a distance race.

I hope youre kidding wrote:

This is ridiculous! Do any of you have any grasp of human physiology? The sprinters on our track team do an occasional distance time trial around a clock near our school. The distance is around 1.5-1.7 miles. We had a 50 low 400m runner that runs in the mid 10s for it! Even our slow 5:50-6:20 mile guys beat him! We also have a sprinter who is a senior that ran 11s as a junior in the 100m that couldn't break 11 ON A 1.5-1.7 MILE COURSE! Sprinting and distance running have very little in common and it is ignorant to think that just because someone is a good sprinter they should be able to run well in a distance race.

A non overweight professional athlete has good overall conditioning. A pro sprinter will def be able to run a 6minute mile. Your little high school teammates....apparently not.

That is your experience, not physiology although I am agreeing I don't think Bolt could run a 4:30. You need a lot more info than a 100 time or a 400 time to get a good reading on twitch distribution. It would take me under a minute to find a 48.6 guy who could run under 17 for 5k.

I hope you're kidding--

Absolutely correct as far as my experience is concerned.

Ahh, a voice of reason. Thank-you.

Bag bag--

Not at all.

Exhibit A: Leonard Scott.

Exhibit B: Harry Aikines-Aryeetey

Exhibit C: Ben Johnson

Exhibit D: Maurice Greene

Exhibit E: Nesta Carter

Exhibit F: Donovan Bailey

etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc.

Your suggestion that they could all run a 6-min mile is hilarious!

When I was doing athletics for real, sprinters would, believe it or not, in some private moments hop onto a treadmill and see how fast they can go, and for how long.

If you think all real sprinters can do 10 mph on even a treadmill, for 6 minutes, you are out of your mind.

There are some who can--barely. Most would have a really hard time of it. You know how hard it is to lug around muscle and strong bones for 6 minutes?!

Why don't we just phone up a guy like Demps and ask him--he is in a college training program and probably likes a challenge!

Touche wrote:

That is your experience, not physiology although I am agreeing I don't think Bolt could run a 4:30. You need a lot more info than a 100 time or a 400 time to get a good reading on twitch distribution. It would take me under a minute to find a 48.6 guy who could run under 17 for 5k.

Or a guy like Webb who is faster at both of those distances

I'm not responding to your cr@p, Douche--no matter the excruciating detail in which you describe your current and future HS career.

Sprintgeezer wrote:

I'm not responding to your cr@p, Douche--no matter the excruciating detail in which you describe your current and future HS career.

Not me. Just someone who would prove you wrong in black and white once you made your proclamation on what kind of 100 a skinny, non powerful (30 foot shot putter and 16 foot long jumper)high school middle distance runner could do. Smart move not to answer though. You're not a bad troll at all. Your time is up though.

Anyone stupid enough to think that ANY sub-10 guy is going to do anything at all in a mile race should watch this:

http://racingnews.runnersworld.com/2011/03/a-brief-video-chat-with-carl-lewis.html

Notice the part where Tom Tellez portrayed Carl as the "worst distance runner I have ever seen."

Now, I'll start with Ben. Angela Issajenko wrote in her book that Ben's "secret" was that he refused to do long SE. Charlie Francis once posted that in his phase III, Ben did mostly 60 meter sessions, with an occasional 2X200 session--but I heard from people who were really there that Ben cut those 200s down to 150s. This is a guy would would jog through the last 50 of a 200. He wouldn't go anywhere near a 300 later in his career. Now you expect THIS GUY to go out and run a mile...fast?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Dan Pfaff has said that his people did accels on Monday and Friday. Bailey did 4X60. Bruny Surin did 3X60, which is all he could handle. Obadale Thompson was apparently an "odd bird" who could go all the way out to 8X60 before slowing down. Just so distance people get my drift, these are not warmups. 4X60 for Donovan Bailey was the whole workout....and he needed several days at lower intensity before attempting a workout like that again.

You want Donovan or Bruny to run a mile....really?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

There are programs like John Smith's (Maurice Greene) and some of the Jamaicans (Asafa Powell, Shelly-Ann Fraser-Pryce, Jermaine Gonzales) that have a signficant volume of extensive or intensive tempo in general prep, and these people might be expected to run sub-6, but not sub-5. Kerron Clement and Quincy Watts actually ran XC in high school (Clement apparently in ~16:30) and these two may have been able to run 4:30 with some 8X400 sessions maybe....but they're not pure sprinters (Watts has a 100m PB of 10.3 or 10.5m--don't recall for sure).

I would say possibly, if I'd not seen an at-his-peak Carl lewis try a 300. the last 100 was painful to watch. Yes I know Lewis is not Bolts body type and Bolt can go to 400 but folks always fall into the trap of thinking an sprinters performance deteriorates linearly with distance. It doesnt it often falls off a cliff - usually before 400 but in Bolts case I doubt his 800 is worth beans. if he trained for the mile I would guess 5:00 tops and thats only because you occasionally get freaks like Juantorena who can do it all.

Sprintgeezer wrote:

I know because of everything I've posted. Here it is again for you, you idiot (because you're obviously a single poster)--no acceleration, no knee lift, wrong angles, insufficient musculature, insufficient neural ability to generate power, incorrect foot plant, horrible arm action, biochemically optimized for aerobic ability, no conditioning for anaerobic power output, all adding up to terrible top speed and terrible acceleration, all adding up to lucky to run a 13 from the blocks today, and very unlikely to approach anything like 11.5

You're still 0-for-2.

Post a link to the thread, Douche.

please tell me where I said he would run 11.5 I didn't....I've read all what you said, and I don't care about his wrong angles, no knee lift, and horrible arm action. He has speed. Someone that can run 1:50 for an 800 has to have quite a bit of speed. I never said he could do it first try out of the blocks idiot. Maybe I implied it, but i meant he could run under 12 seconds from the blocks at some point....maybe not today or tomorrow, but a little work...a little work...and he could do it. He has much more speed than you give him credit. I'd like to slap you right in your mouth for being an idiot.

So, you don't saw the article in which Glen Mills said that Usain Bolt ran a 800m being HS junior in 1:57

At that point of his career, being a 400m specialist (45.3 PB) Bolt could do a sub 5 mile.

Sprinters are not stuck to being sprinters. The evidence shows that muscle fiber types can change with training. You can go from a sprinter to a distance runner and vice versa.

(so yes Bolt could run a 4:30 if he trained for it)

Bag bag wrote:

Sprinters are not stuck to being sprinters. The evidence shows that muscle fiber types can change with training. You can go from a sprinter to a distance runner and vice versa.

Can you provide documentation of this on scale large enough to make a difference. I know A can be taught to act more like B or ST but I've never heard of 90% B switching to 50% ST or even 50% A. I'd be fascinated to see the evidence you reference.

You have pinpointed your own source of difficulty, Douche--you don't care.

He has no speed relative to a sprinter. A 50-second 400m is 8 m/s, which is nothing. Incremental gains in speed require increasingly greater anaerobic contribution. That is very near, if not his actual, top speed.

The point is that a person trying to sprint CANNOT have respectable speed without beneficial angles, knee lift, and good arm action.

He would require one heck of a lot of work to go under 12, if he ever could. Remember, his flying 100, hand-timed by an overly-optimistic coach from a bad viewpoint, was only 10.9, which means it was really 11.3-11.5 FAT, which means it is WELL above 12, probably around 13, from blocks. A flying 100 plays to his strength--sustained speed--and minimizes the contribution of his weakness--acceleration.

Thank-you for finally showing some inclination to converse...Touche.

I love all the ambiguous statements you declare as somehow being meaningful facts that are supposes to serve as premises for some sort of conclusion. man you are are a smoke and mirrors master. Now I don't personally know Rupp's 400 time, but since you throw 50 flat out there, you understand that's 4 x12.5 100 meters. So in your little dream world, the same one where you ran a 10.5 100 and a sub five mile, a guy can't go 100 meters from the blocks in one fourth his 400 time? This has nothing to do with "angles, knee lift, and good arm action." Or mojo rising or the price of tea in China. And I'm still waiting for your expert opinion on a 4:00 1500 meter guy with a high 17 5k and pretty weak power oriented events. I would love to know how fast you think he could run 100 meters. If Rupp, a guy who strings together multiple 4 flat 1500s in a row can't break 13, could this guy?

Sprintgeezer wrote:

You have pinpointed your own source of difficulty, Douche--you don't care.

He has no speed relative to a sprinter. A 50-second 400m is 8 m/s, which is nothing. Incremental gains in speed require increasingly greater anaerobic contribution. That is very near, if not his actual, top speed.

The point is that a person trying to sprint CANNOT have respectable speed without beneficial angles, knee lift, and good arm action.

He would require one heck of a lot of work to go under 12, if he ever could. Remember, his flying 100, hand-timed by an overly-optimistic coach from a bad viewpoint, was only 10.9, which means it was really 11.3-11.5 FAT, which means it is WELL above 12, probably around 13, from blocks. A flying 100 plays to his strength--sustained speed--and minimizes the contribution of his weakness--acceleration.

Thank-you for finally showing some inclination to converse...Touche.