Official LRC President Joseph R Biden Thread

Equality posters only · 2021-01-20T10:47:15-05:00

Honestly, Robinette is a pretty dope middle name.

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5 years ago 03/03/2021 5:18pm EST

re: Fat hurts

Fat hurts wrote:
Dr. Racket wrote:
Mass adoption is really gonna require infrastructure for people who live in cities and park on the streets or otherwise don't have access to some form of overnight charging.
The Audi CEO actually made an interesting argument for why they think range will actually decrease in the future. It's a bit avant garde but I kinda see the point - once infrastructure is up and you can recharge in 5 minutes or less then there's no need for a lot of big, expensive, heavy batteries. That seems like at least a decade or more away.
The other problem I have with EVs right now is that they mostly seem like appliances. With the exception of a few high end models like the e-Tron GT and the Taycan, it seems like EVs are marketed to people who hate driving and really wish they didn't have to (hence a big push for things like auto-pilot and a whole bunch of in car accessories and screens). Anyone who thinks a Chevy Bolt is "actually a really great car!" is probably someone who doesn't really care much for cars to begin with.
Motor Trend made the Chevy Bolt its "Car of the Year" in 2017. Do you think Motor Trend doesn't really care much for cars?
You are correct that mass adoption will require a lot more charging options. If everyone was able to magically switch to EVs today we wouldn't have enough chargers. But as I've said before, it's really easy to build out the infrastructure. A charging station is little more than a glorified extension cord. And you can put a charging station almost anywhere.
The largest obstacle to mass adoption is battery production. We can't build EV batteries fast enough to meet demand. And that's a lot harder to do.

Motor Trend. Lolz. Yep. Hang your hat on that. EVs will get better in a few years. Battery tech and infrastructure improvements will make it less frustrating and more convenient to have one. Until now as you’ve documented in this very thread they are very inconvenient to own and frustrating today. Four or five years ago they were mind-numbingly frustrating to own and inconceivably inconvenient. You had to plan your entire day around driving. How frustrating is that. Very. How inconvenient is that. Very.

5 years ago 03/03/2021 5:47pm EST

re: jumbo shrimp

2.0 million vaccinations per day, 7 day average

today had 35% more jabs than Wednesday 7 days ago

Noice. Progress.

Some centers will go 24 hours soon as vaccine deliveries flood in.

Best States

MO. Good job, MO. First appearance on the good list

Worst States

AR, your twin MO is on the best list. Grow up.

And NY - you have been on the bad list forever. Come on.

5 years ago 03/03/2021 5:53pm EST

re: agip

agip wrote:
2.0 million vaccinations per day, 7 day average
today had 35% more jabs than Wednesday 7 days ago
Noice. Progress.
Some centers will go 24 hours soon as vaccine deliveries flood in.
Best States
CO
MN
VT
HI
MO. Good job, MO. First appearance on the good list
Worst States
AR
NY
NJ
DE
RI
CA
AR, your twin MO is on the best list. Grow up.
And NY - you have been on the bad list forever. Come on.

That is remarkable, well done to all involved.

Didn’t the previous administration set a goal of 20 million vaccinations is December yet only vaccinate about 2 million?

Now we are vaccinating that many per day. Huge essential improvement.

5 years ago 03/03/2021 6:12pm EST

re: Ciro

Ciro wrote:
agip wrote:
2.0 million vaccinations per day, 7 day average
today had 35% more jabs than Wednesday 7 days ago
Noice. Progress.
Some centers will go 24 hours soon as vaccine deliveries flood in.
Best States
CO
MN
VT
HI
MO. Good job, MO. First appearance on the good list
Worst States
AR
NY
NJ
DE
RI
CA
AR, your twin MO is on the best list. Grow up.
And NY - you have been on the bad list forever. Come on.
That is remarkable, well done to all involved.
Didn’t the previous administration set a goal of 20 million vaccinations is December yet only vaccinate about 2 million?
Now we are vaccinating that many per day. Huge essential improvement.

Duh!!! Easier to vaccinate more people now when you barely had just two vaccines approved just before Christmas. (Pfizer and Moderna). Plus, we just had J&J's vaccine approval last week or so.

5 years ago 03/03/2021 6:14pm EST

re: Ciro

Indiana just dropped the age to 50 for vaccination. Where are other states?

I'm 49.5 so just outside the window.

5 years ago 03/03/2021 6:32pm EST

re: Ghost of Disco Gary

Ghost of Disco Gary wrote:
Ciro wrote:
That is remarkable, well done to all involved.
Didn’t the previous administration set a goal of 20 million vaccinations is December yet only vaccinate about 2 million?
Now we are vaccinating that many per day. Huge essential improvement.
Duh!!! Easier to vaccinate more people now when you barely had just two vaccines approved just before Christmas. (Pfizer and Moderna). Plus, we just had J&J's vaccine approval last week or so.

The entire point of operation warp speed was at-risk production of the vaccine. There should have been a good amount of vaccine available when the approval was granted. The taxpayers were already on the hook. If there was a delay, it was due to poor project management, which falls on Trump's team.

5 years ago 03/03/2021 7:13pm EST

re: jumbo shrimp

It's a scientific miracle that not one but several vaccines have been created, tested, manufactured and approved already, when we were told it could take years. Just grow up with the the partisan hackery

https://i.imgur.com/FXhC3lz.png

5 years ago 03/03/2021 7:38pm EST

re: Hardloper

Trumpists like to say that Trump stopped the foreign wars, but that's not true - he increased drone strikes a lot.

Biden just put a speedbump in, to see if they should be slowed permanently.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/03/us/politics/biden-drones.html#click=https://t.co/83cej0zZuC

5 years ago 03/04/2021 5:37am EST

re: jumbo shrimp

jumbo shrimp wrote:
You had to plan your entire day around driving. How frustrating is that. Very. How inconvenient is that. Very.

With a gas car, you have to plan your week around fuel stops, oil changes, and expensive repairs. You are constantly worried about fill-ups, tune-ups, oil changes, and trips to the "service center" where you get ripped off by your mechanic.

And most of all, you worry about a car that will roll over easily and catch on fire in an accident. 38,000 people die in auto accidents each year. With a gas car, you are a lot more likely to be one of them.

With an EV you never have to worry about anything. Just plug in each night and you always start the day with a full battery. You get a car that's inexpensive, fun to drive, and easier to live with.

This is why 97% of EV owners say they will never go back to gasoline.

It's also why if you buy a gas car you are an idiot.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 8:11am EST

re: Fat hurts

Fat hurts wrote:
jumbo shrimp wrote:
You had to plan your entire day around driving. How frustrating is that. Very. How inconvenient is that. Very.
With a gas car, you have to plan your week around fuel stops, oil changes, and expensive repairs. You are constantly worried about fill-ups, tune-ups, oil changes, and trips to the "service center" where you get ripped off by your mechanic.
And most of all, you worry about a car that will roll over easily and catch on fire in an accident. 38,000 people die in auto accidents each year. With a gas car, you are a lot more likely to be one of them.
With an EV you never have to worry about anything. Just plug in each night and you always start the day with a full battery. You get a car that's inexpensive, fun to drive, and easier to live with.
This is why 97% of EV owners say they will never go back to gasoline.
It's also why if you buy a gas car you are an idiot.

Well ok. Lolz. Look here. I get it. You’re a fanboy for EVs or at least subpar EVs like the bolt. You are very emotionally invested in it. You likely have spent the last few years since you bought one trying to convince yourself that it hasn’t been a frustrating and inconvenient experience. It has. When you take the emotion out of it you realize this. EVs will get better in the next few years. Battery tech will improve range and drop prices. Adequate infrastructure will improve as well and make EVs less frustrating and more convenient. Right now as you have clearly illustrated throughout this thread EVs are frustrating and inconvenient right now.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 8:24am EST

re: jumbo shrimp

looks like making Dr Seuss the #1 news topic in the nation is working -

Biden's disapproval rating at all time highs, by a small amount. Approval is down, but not at record lows.

Although you'd expect some of this as the honeymoon wears off - can't separate out the seussian affect.

Expect nonstop culture-war from the right wing, since the nation generally agrees with Biden policy. And nothing gets dumb right wingers inflamed like a good kulturkampf.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/

5 years ago 03/04/2021 8:29am EST

re: agip

Also looks like Americans found a non-Tesla electric car they'll buy:

Tesla Inc (NASDAQ: TSLA) is losing market share to Ford Motor Company’s (NYSE: F) Mustang Mach-E in the United States, according to Morgan Stanley, Electrek reported Wednesday.

What Happened: The global financial services firm said in its February auto sales report that the Elon Musk-led company’s share of the battery electric vehicle market fell to 69% compared with 81% in the same period a year earlier, according to Electrek.

The Ford Mustang Mach-E reportedly made up for nearly 100% of the share loss.

The report said that EV sales in the U.S. were up by almost 40%.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 8:36am EST

re: Fat hurts

Fat hurts wrote:
jumbo shrimp wrote:
You had to plan your entire day around driving. How frustrating is that. Very. How inconvenient is that. Very.
With a gas car, you have to plan your week around fuel stops, oil changes, and expensive repairs.
Plan my week around fuel stops? All my vehicles can get over 500 miles per tank. Using synthetic oil I can get 10,000 miles between oil changes. What are these expensive repairs you feel will commonly occur with gas vehicles?
You are constantly worried about fill-ups, tune-ups, oil changes, and trips to the "service center" where you get ripped off by your mechanic. Yes, some mechanics will rip people off, the rest of your concerns are non-issues. Also, if you have an issue with your EV battery who will fix that for you? Are EV mechanics a different breed than normal mechanics?
And most of all, you worry about a car that will roll over easily and catch on fire in an accident.
What percentage of car accidents involve rollovers and fire?
38,000 people die in auto accidents each year. With a gas car, you are a lot more likely to be one of them. Do you have stats showing that EV don't get in accidents as often as gas vehicles?
With an EV you never have to worry about anything.
Except when you take a trip over 200 miles, and when you can find a charge.
Just plug in each night and you always start the day with a full battery.
Which is great for those living in a residence with a garage. That won't help a college kid living in the dorms or an off campus apartment or house. Or a person that rents and doesn't have a garage or outside access to electricity. Should they run a couple hundred feet of extension cords outside a window?
You get a car that's inexpensive, fun to drive, and easier to live with.
Which EVs are inexpensive? What makes them fun to drive?
This is why 97% of EV owners say they will never go back to gasoline.
It's also why if you buy a gas car you are an idiot.
In the area I live, and with the miles I drive, and with the people I need to haul, and the boat and camper I need to pull, I would be an idiot to purchase one.

A few replies in bold

5 years ago 03/04/2021 9:16am EST

re: Not all areas are the same

Not all areas are the same wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
With a gas car, you have to plan your week around fuel stops, oil changes, and expensive repairs.
Plan my week around fuel stops? All my vehicles can get over 500 miles per tank. Using synthetic oil I can get 10,000 miles between oil changes. What are these expensive repairs you feel will commonly occur with gas vehicles?
You are constantly worried about fill-ups, tune-ups, oil changes, and trips to the "service center" where you get ripped off by your mechanic. Yes, some mechanics will rip people off, the rest of your concerns are non-issues. Also, if you have an issue with your EV battery who will fix that for you? Are EV mechanics a different breed than normal mechanics?
And most of all, you worry about a car that will roll over easily and catch on fire in an accident.
What percentage of car accidents involve rollovers and fire?
38,000 people die in auto accidents each year. With a gas car, you are a lot more likely to be one of them. Do you have stats showing that EV don't get in accidents as often as gas vehicles?
With an EV you never have to worry about anything.
Except when you take a trip over 200 miles, and when you can find a charge.
Just plug in each night and you always start the day with a full battery.
Which is great for those living in a residence with a garage. That won't help a college kid living in the dorms or an off campus apartment or house. Or a person that rents and doesn't have a garage or outside access to electricity. Should they run a couple hundred feet of extension cords outside a window?
You get a car that's inexpensive, fun to drive, and easier to live with.
Which EVs are inexpensive? What makes them fun to drive?
This is why 97% of EV owners say they will never go back to gasoline.
It's also why if you buy a gas car you are an idiot.
In the area I live, and with the miles I drive, and with the people I need to haul, and the boat and camper I need to pull, I would be an idiot to purchase one.
A few replies in bold

It was just fanboy being an emotional fanboy.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 9:24am EST

re: Not all areas are the same

Not all areas are the same wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
With a gas car, you have to plan your week around fuel stops, oil changes, and expensive repairs.
Plan my week around fuel stops? All my vehicles can get over 500 miles per tank. Using synthetic oil I can get 10,000 miles between oil changes. What are these expensive repairs you feel will commonly occur with gas vehicles?
You are constantly worried about fill-ups, tune-ups, oil changes, and trips to the "service center" where you get ripped off by your mechanic. Yes, some mechanics will rip people off, the rest of your concerns are non-issues. Also, if you have an issue with your EV battery who will fix that for you? Are EV mechanics a different breed than normal mechanics?
And most of all, you worry about a car that will roll over easily and catch on fire in an accident.
What percentage of car accidents involve rollovers and fire?
38,000 people die in auto accidents each year. With a gas car, you are a lot more likely to be one of them. Do you have stats showing that EV don't get in accidents as often as gas vehicles?
With an EV you never have to worry about anything.
Except when you take a trip over 200 miles, and when you can find a charge.
Just plug in each night and you always start the day with a full battery.
Which is great for those living in a residence with a garage. That won't help a college kid living in the dorms or an off campus apartment or house. Or a person that rents and doesn't have a garage or outside access to electricity. Should they run a couple hundred feet of extension cords outside a window?
You get a car that's inexpensive, fun to drive, and easier to live with.
Which EVs are inexpensive? What makes them fun to drive?
This is why 97% of EV owners say they will never go back to gasoline.
It's also why if you buy a gas car you are an idiot.
In the area I live, and with the miles I drive, and with the people I need to haul, and the boat and camper I need to pull, I would be an idiot to purchase one.
A few replies in bold

Your car gets 500 miles per tank? So you have to stop every 450 miles or so to fuel up at a smelly gas station and pay big bucks for the experience. Unless I'm on a road trip, I never have to stop at all.

Common repairs and maintenance in gas cars:

oil change

spark plugs

brake pads

tire rotation

transmission fluid

transmission replacement

worn out belts

worn out hoses

fuel filter replacement

air filter replacement

battery replacement

antifreeze replacement

muffler replacement

wiper replacement

thermostat replacement

air flow sensor replacement

ignition coil replacement

O2 sensor replacement

catalytic converter replacement

spark plug wire replacement

solenoid replacement

Common repairs and maintenance in EVs:

rotate tires

wiper replacement

There are thousands of moving parts in a gas car. A typical EV has maybe 20. That's why they don't require much maintenance.

There are stats from Tesla showing that they get in a lot fewer accidents than gas cars. This is because they have excellent collision avoidance systems and today these systems are more likely to be in an EV than in a gas car.

But my main point is that EVs are always rated as much safer in an accident than their gas counterparts. The main reason is because they are 11 times less likely to catch fire and because they don't roll over. It turns out that having a heavy engine mounted high in the vehicle that also sucks up a very flammable liquid doesn't fare so well in a crash.

Yes, if you are on a very long trip (over 6 hours) it will take a little longer in an EV. That is the gas car's only advantage.

Which EVs are inexpensive? All of them. Total cost of ownership is much lower than a gas car because electricity is several times less than gasoline and EVs require a lot less maintenance.

My kid is in college. Most college campuses have EV charging stations. As soon as we get our Tesla, my kid will be getting the Bolt EV to use at school.

Superior acceleration and handling make the EVs more fun to drive. It also makes the car safer. Ask anyone who has tried it out. Or just watch the many videos of people who experience the instant torque for the first time. Big smiles.

EVs are very good for towing. Several models can be ordered with tow hitches. Lots of people haul boats and campers with EVs.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 9:35am EST

re: Fat hurts

Fat hurts wrote:
Not all areas are the same wrote:
A few replies in bold
Your car gets 500 miles per tank? So you have to stop every 450 miles or so to fuel up at a smelly gas station and pay big bucks for the experience. Unless I'm on a road trip, I never have to stop at all.
Common repairs and maintenance in gas cars:
oil change
spark plugs
brake pads
tire rotation
transmission fluid
transmission replacement
worn out belts
worn out hoses
fuel filter replacement
air filter replacement
battery replacement
antifreeze replacement
muffler replacement
wiper replacement
thermostat replacement
air flow sensor replacement
ignition coil replacement
O2 sensor replacement
catalytic converter replacement
spark plug wire replacement
solenoid replacement
Common repairs and maintenance in EVs:
rotate tires
wiper replacement

The fact that you think most of those are "common," and that you left out things like brake changes on EVs tells me two things:

1) You don't know much about cars, nor have you really worked on one (at least since the 80s). No crime in that really. Like I said earlier, a lot of people hate driving and view cars as nothing more than another accessory for a task they wish they didn't have to perform.

2) You're either trolling at this poin,t or truly a massive EV stan.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 10:31am EST

re: Dr. Racket

Dr. Racket wrote:
The fact that you think most of those are "common," and that you left out things like brake changes on EVs tells me two things:
1) You don't know much about cars, nor have you really worked on one (at least since the 80s). No crime in that really. Like I said earlier, a lot of people hate driving and view cars as nothing more than another accessory for a task they wish they didn't have to perform.
2) You're either trolling at this poin,t or truly a massive EV stan.

While Fat Hurts seems way over the top in his EV evangelism and I'm not seeing much value in continuing the sub-thread, EVs have regenerative braking which does greatly reduce brake wear.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 10:32am EST

re: Fat hurts

You can say all you want about all the things one will have to maintain on an ICE vs an EV. At about 100,000 miles on an EV you will likely have to replace the batteries, which will run you $10k or so. I have a Ford F-150 with over 200,000 miles on it and a Subaru Outback with over 200,000 miles on it and the only thing I have had to do with either is tires, brakes, batteries (that cost about $100) and oil changes. I can go on 600 mile trips with either and make one stop each way that takes 10 minutes to fill the tank, use the restroom and grab a bite to eat. Considering many of those trips are business related, the time difference and availability of charging (going through the mountains, rural Colorado and rural New Mexico, charging availability is severely limited), there is no way a full EV is superior (especially in the winter months when the battery performance drops off a cliff). Additionally, EVs with long range batteries weigh considerably more than comparable ICE vehicles (a model S weighs as much as most SUVs), so the tires will cost more, the suspension will cost more, you will still have fluids to maintain in the transmission, there are still chassis parts that require regular lubrication and there are still hydraulics and brakes to maintain (though the pads should last longer). Not to mention all of those new controls and sensors they are putting on the car that will have to be cleaned and maintained.

A plug in hybrid is far more suitable for most people as the smaller battery is sufficient for running errands around town, you don't need the super charger (15 minute to 1 hour charger) or a 240V 60A charger (4-6 hour charger) at your house that will require a service panel upgrade and will require the utility to change out all of the electrical infrastructure serving your neighborhood when your neighbors decide they all want high end chargers as well [charging stations are far more than just an extension cord as superchargers require commercial level electrical service (480V) at high amperages]. The smaller 72kW super chargers require 480V, 150A electric service, which is what you would find at a small commercial building. the 250kW super chargers require 480V at over 500A, which is enough to serve a decent sized school.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 10:49am EST

re: Dr. Racket

Dr. Racket wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
Your car gets 500 miles per tank? So you have to stop every 450 miles or so to fuel up at a smelly gas station and pay big bucks for the experience. Unless I'm on a road trip, I never have to stop at all.
Common repairs and maintenance in gas cars:
oil change
spark plugs
brake pads
tire rotation
transmission fluid
transmission replacement
worn out belts
worn out hoses
fuel filter replacement
air filter replacement
battery replacement
antifreeze replacement
muffler replacement
wiper replacement
thermostat replacement
air flow sensor replacement
ignition coil replacement
O2 sensor replacement
catalytic converter replacement
spark plug wire replacement
solenoid replacement
Common repairs and maintenance in EVs:
rotate tires
wiper replacement
The fact that you think most of those are "common," and that you left out things like brake changes on EVs tells me two things:
1) You don't know much about cars, nor have you really worked on one (at least since the 80s). No crime in that really.

You never need to change brake pads in an EV. An EV uses regenerative braking whereby the kinetic energy of the car is used to generate electricity that goes back into the battery. This process reduces forward motion and slows the car to a stop. The friction brakes are only used in an emergency. So they don't wear out.

You might have heard this marketed as "one pedal driving". For most trips, I never have to touch the brake pedal.

And you are right. I haven't actually worked on cars since the early 90's. You can quibble over which of those repairs are still common. But my point still stands.

Tires and wiper blades are pretty much the only things that commonly wear out in an EV. A gas car requires A LOT more repairs and maintenance.

5 years ago 03/04/2021 11:10am EST

re: Fat hurts

Fat hurts wrote:
Not all areas are the same wrote:
A few replies in bold
Your car gets 500 miles per tank? So you have to stop every 450 miles or so to fuel up at a smelly gas station and pay big bucks for the experience. Yes, and I work by several gas stations and typically get gas without fretting the experience and rarely notice a smell. I often need to grab milk, or bananas, or bread otherwise I pay at the pump and I'm gone in a couple of minutes.
Unless I'm on a road trip, I never have to stop at all.
I typically stop every three to four hours to use a restroom and grab something to eat or drink and fuel up. This is typically 10 - 15 minutes unless we plan to dine in.
Common repairs and maintenance in gas cars:
oil change
spark plugs
brake pads
tire rotation
transmission fluid
transmission replacement
worn out belts
worn out hoses
fuel filter replacement
air filter replacement
battery replacement
antifreeze replacement
muffler replacement
wiper replacement
thermostat replacement
air flow sensor replacement
ignition coil replacement
O2 sensor replacement
catalytic converter replacement
spark plug wire replacement
solenoid replacement
Common repairs and maintenance in EVs:
rotate tires
wiper replacement
There are thousands of moving parts in a gas car. A typical EV has maybe 20. That's why they don't require much maintenance. Makes sense that there is less maintenance, but I have been fortunate not to have needed much in vehicle repairs and my last battery I replaced was $79.99 and I put it in my self in 10 minutes and was given $10 on my old battery, can you say that with an EV?
There are stats from Tesla showing that they get in a lot fewer accidents than gas cars. This is because they have excellent collision avoidance systems and today these systems are more likely to be in an EV than in a gas car. I believe many new gas vehicles now have similar safety features.
But my main point is that EVs are always rated as much safer in an accident than their gas counterparts. The main reason is because they are 11 times less likely to catch fire and because they don't roll over. It turns out that having a heavy engine mounted high in the vehicle that also sucks up a very flammable liquid doesn't fare so well in a crash. That does make sense but I see very few rollovers and believe they make up a very small percentage of accidents.
Yes, if you are on a very long trip (over 6 hours) it will take a little longer in an EV. That is the gas car's only advantage.
Which EVs are inexpensive? All of them.
This is definitely where we differ. Your version of inexpensive is much different than mine, and I'm talking initial new purchase price, or used purchase price.
Total cost of ownership is much lower than a gas car because electricity is several times less than gasoline and EVs require a lot less maintenance.
My kid is in college. Most college campuses have EV charging stations.
Maybe, but way less off campus housing are set up for this.
As soon as we get our Tesla, my kid will be getting the Bolt EV to use at school.
Superior acceleration and handling make the EVs more fun to drive. It also makes the car safer. Ask anyone who has tried it out. Or just watch the many videos of people who experience the instant torque for the first time. Big smiles. I guess that is all a matter pf opinion.
EVs are very good for towing. Several models can be ordered with tow hitches. Lots of people haul boats and campers with EVs.
Which EV would you recommend to tow a 21' Ranger bass boat or 32' Jayco travel trailer?

More replies for you in bold

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