Lance Armstrong bonks at 1/2 Ironman, loses a spot at the finishline and ignores his daughter

If anyone thinks bikes don't help...go watch the video where German cycler has an ELECTRIC ENGINE in his bike. He just presses a button and it flies. That looks like a fairly big help to me, mere runner I am?

Ferris wrote:

... Anyone can show up to Boston...or New York...or where ever and win..

Hats too bee shed wrote:

I can't. Believe me, I've tried dozens of time. Haven't won yet and don't imagine I ever will.

Let me re-phrase: In running, anyone with the ability to put one foot in front of the other has the opportunity to compete against the very best in the world. This happens in almost no other sport. You can't show up to the NFL and expect to play.

That isn't really true. I have as much of a chance to compete in the NFL as I do in a Golden League Meet against Bekele.

LETSBEREAL wrote:

If anyone thinks bikes don't help...go watch the video where German cycler has an ELECTRIC ENGINE in his bike. He just presses a button and it flies. That looks like a fairly big help to me, mere runner I am?

You have made an excellent point.

I could also add that another reason mere runners can't make the pro tour is because they can't afford ferraris - which also go a lot faster than cheap bikes.

craptacular wrote:

That isn't really true. I have as much of a chance to compete in the NFL as I do in a Golden League Meet against Bekele.

Not really. Go enter an open 3K at a local collegiate meet and run 7:35 or even run a 28:00 road 10K. Guaranteed you'll have someone calling you and a good shot at racing against Bekele. Yes, this is extreme, but the opportunity is there. All you have to do is show up and run.

This same opportunity does not exist in major professional sports.

Ferris wrote:

craptacular wrote:

That isn't really true. I have as much of a chance to compete in the NFL as I do in a Golden League Meet against Bekele.

Not really. Go enter an open 3K at a local collegiate meet and run 7:35 or even run a 28:00 road 10K. Guaranteed you'll have someone calling you and a good shot at racing against Bekele. Yes, this is extreme, but the opportunity is there. All you have to do is show up and run.

This same opportunity does not exist in major professional sports.

Ya, I just need to be 6'6 275 and able to run the forty really fast. If I could, then the NFL would probably call me.

It has nothing to do with the 'engine' and everything to di with you being WRONG about the impact of aero equipment.

Quit with the deflection and just stop talking about things you're obviously very ignorant of. To assert that an aero setup only saves you 1-1:30 minutes is

WRONG

asdfsdf wrote:

Actually there are a few others like basketball that don't take a lot of money - but I exclude them because they are not played globally.

Basketball isn't played globally!?!?

Wow, you are SUPER ignorant!

cat 6 wrote:

asdfsdf wrote:

Actually there are a few others like basketball that don't take a lot of money - but I exclude them because they are not played globally.

Basketball isn't played globally!?!?

Wow, you are SUPER ignorant!

In comparison to Soccer (Football), it's not played very globally.

cat 6 wrote:

It has nothing to do with the 'engine' and everything to di with you being WRONG about the impact of aero equipment.

Quit with the deflection and just stop talking about things you're obviously very ignorant of. To assert that an aero setup only saves you 1-1:30 minutes is

WRONG

ok guy please explain to me what I am ignorant about. You say aero gear saves up to 5:33 seconds over a 40 km TT. I say it is more like a minute thirty.

Based on your article (which btw is the most optimistic article I have ever seen (and I have seen it before) on the benefits of aero), about half of the max saving are simply achieving the aero position. One can get an aero position on a cheap P1 (I hope you know what that is), and since the argument was framed around how expensive cycling is, I would say the time saving from simply riding in the aero position should be removed from the analysis. So that takes your best time saving down to about 2 mins and 45 seconds due to aero gear.

So now we are a minute apart on what we feel is the difference between full aero gear, and road position.

That is not a big gap. Based on anecdote after anecdote, white papers, etc., I am less optimistic about how much time top of the line aero gear saves one, than you are. Big deal.

So how do you interpret that I am ignorant about aero?

I don't really care if you think it is three minutes and I think it is less, but I find it really odd that because I don't agree with you, that you say I am ignorant about aero.

As I said before - the Slowtwitch community is about as well versed in this question as any group on the internet. Go ask this question over there and you will get a ton of well reasoned, but wildly varying, answers from engineers, tt state champs, and the bike companies themselves. Accordingly, it is incredibly egotistical of you to suggest that just because I don't agree with you, that I am ignorant about the topic. Time to open your mind to the possibility that you are not the only guy that knows this stuff.

I'm surprised no one has seen this yet, straight from Lance Armstrong's face book page:

"To the fools in certain parts of the press who are saying I intentionally "ignored" my very own daughter at that finish of yesterday's race ... that's below the belt and shame on you for insinuating as much. I would NEVER do that to any of my 5 kids. Ever."

cat 6 wrote:

asdfsdf wrote:

Actually there are a few others like basketball that don't take a lot of money - but I exclude them because they are not played globally.

Basketball isn't played globally!?!?

Wow, you are SUPER ignorant!

Now you are claiming I am wrong about the global coverage of soccer vs basketball?

Boy you really are bothered by me - I guess my dismissiveness of aero is really getting to you. You must be John Cobb, or maybe Boardman himself!

I really wonder why you are so eager to prove yourself the kind of all things aero, and the rest of us idiots who can't possibly comment on the topic.

Feel free to post your palmares if it makes you feel better about your cycling superiority. Sleep well, I hope you remember to take off your aerohelmet before bed.

Phenom Man wrote:

cat 6 wrote:

Basketball isn't played globally!?!?

Wow, you are SUPER ignorant!

In comparison to Soccer (Football), it's not played very globally.

So now it's not "played very globally"? WTF kind of answer is that?

Basketball is a global sport. Nothing to do with its popularity compared to soccer, and EVERYTHING to do with it being played all over the world.

I've already laid it out for you. You can take just one or two pieces of equipment and get more than minutes faster.

Your initial assertion about a regular bike and aero bike only being 1-1:30 minutes faster was flat out wrong.

But I wonder how long of a response I can get you to type up so you can try to run around that all day long? The last one was impressive.

asdfasdf wrote:

cat 6 wrote:

Basketball isn't played globally!?!?

Wow, you are SUPER ignorant!

Now you are claiming I am wrong about the global coverage of soccer vs basketball?

Boy you really are bothered by me - I guess my dismissiveness of aero is really getting to you. You must be John Cobb, or maybe Boardman himself!

I really wonder why you are so eager to prove yourself the kind of all things aero, and the rest of us idiots who can't possibly comment on the topic.

Feel free to post your palmares if it makes you feel better about your cycling superiority. Sleep well, I hope you remember to take off your aerohelmet before bed.

My palmares? Like being a 20 year old Cat 1 and racing in Europe by 22? How is that relevant in any way?

Though I did meet Cobb actually. One of my teammates had a custom AERO FRAME made for Espoir Nats. Too bad you weren't there to tell him how that would have only made a minute or so difference. I bet Cobb would have just laugheddddddddddddd.

No. You said basketball isn't a global sport.

That, like most of your posts already, is WRONG as it's played all over the world.

I should charge you for giving you such an education.

Well, he's kind of right. Soccer is THE most popular sport in the world. Basketball isn't. I would think that's pretty clear. Sorry, you kind of come off like a d-bag.

You continue to come off as being generally unpleasant and egotistical so I am not sure what else to say.

We simply disagree about the time benefits of aero gear. But you seem so eager to assert that I am wrong.

My premise to explain our differences is that the time advantages of aero is hard to quantify - due to things like yaw angle, individual rider position, keeping atmostpheric conditions static, the fact that each aero benefit of a component is not a mere additive process, etc.

You on the other hand just state that your estimate is exactly correct and that is that. You linked to one article that backs you up, but you don't acknowledge that the conclusions therein are not accepted wholesale by the marketplace.

I might be wrong, I am ok with that. However, I am pretty happy with my time estimate on it and I think yours is high. I can have that opinion without categorically slamming your view.

You come off like VIPAM - insulting everyone who does not agree with his voodoo calcuator - not unlike you and your certainty about something that is hard to estimate.

In any case, hopefully the fact that I gave you the opportunity to let us know that you were an awesome cyclist (which I say in all honesty - Cat 1 is pretty out there), will calm you somewhat and increase the civility of this thread.

OK Lance didn't win a tri.(though he finished pretty well in the top 10) He won 7 tours. How many of you here win every race you compete in? If we scrutinized finish line video of every race you were in what we we see? Give the guy a break.

not to mention implying he isn't a good parent? How many of you can honestly say that if a camera caught every interaction with your kids some of it could be judged harshly especially if it were taken out of context as this few seconds of video has been?