Is this comedy, or do you really believe this?
Is this comedy, or do you really believe this?
Brian wrote:
"I like that this Florida preacher isn't taking anymore threats. It's a shame the radical Muslim community are such bobbleheads that they will riot and blow up stuff rather than just say 'shame on you reverend, and move on'. So he does have a point, there is a certain barabarism in that community."
Yeah, it is too bad Muslims can't be as civilized as Christians, who sublimate their desire for revenge into fevered and eagerly anticipated imaginings of the tortures God will inflict on us scoffers for our impious regard for their Bible. It will be a giant step for Islam when they learn they can mask their cowardice as letting God reap his vengeance while they get to watch and laugh.
I've always kind of felt that way about a lot of Christians.
Yeah, it is too bad Muslims can't be as civilized as Christians, who sublimate their desire for revenge into fevered and eagerly anticipated imaginings of the tortures God will inflict on us scoffers for our impious regard for their Bible. It will be a giant step for Islam when they learn they can mask their cowardice as letting God reap his vengeance while they get to watch and laugh.
And this was my reply to Brian, so I will relay it to you as well:
Umm . . . the bolded might apply to some who call themselves Christian, but in no unbiased persons opinion would they imply that this is anything close to a majority view. I suggest, therefore, that you make or stick to some other excuse or excuses for not obeying the gospel.
"Say unto them, as I live, saith the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live; turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?" Ezekiel 33:11
If God has no pleasure in the death of the wicked then I would (and do) question the authenticity of that persons faith who does. Nevertheless, God will oblige those who reject Him by allowing them a place to go where His manifest presence is not, namely, Hell. I think it stinks, and apparently so does God.
So, anyone else reading the Qur'an today?
and to the bible disprovers: These believers have gone through their entire lives believing whatever so far, so I doubt a few forum threads will convince anyone. I myself stubbornly believe in logic, and the Christians aren't convincing me of anything.
Nice how after the pastor said he wasn't going to burn the book the Muslims had an American Flag burning party at their mosque. Everyone says how Muslims are a peaceful religion except for a few. The truth is even though the majority don't go around beheading and blowing people up they ALL hate America. I'll never forget the day after the towers came down they showed footage over in the middle east and thousands of Muslims were dancing, chanting and singing. Little old ladies, who if you saw and the street you'd think what a nice lady she was, were bobbing up and down, hands pumping in the air, smiling, laughing. It really shows what these people are really like. They're sick! And even our own Muslim loving president hates America. Always apologizing like he's ashamed to be an American! Embarrassed by his own country! Ever here him say he's proud to be an American? You never will. No? Someone should ask him that very question.
You discredit yourself when you talk about our "Muslim loving President." As a Christian he is SUPPOSED to love Muslims as well as everyone else. You do make a good point though (not with anything you said about Obama, which just makes you seem ignorant). The so-called "moderate" Muslims tend to be far more RADICAL than even the most conservative Christians. The public and the media have different standards for judging a Muslim as a radical vs. judging a Christian as a radical. If a Christian, for example, supported ANY terrorist group then they would be considered a radical. A Muslim, however, gets a free pass with supporting Hamas. Likewise, a Christian would be a radical or an extremist if they violently protested against a cartoon depicting Jesus in a negative light. When Muslims do it we say that the cartoonist was culturally insensitive. Imagine, furthermore, if a Muslim group had said they would burn the bible. Besides the fact that it wouldn't even make the news (because that shite is so commonplace) no Christian person or group would have batted an eyelid.
Yep~ wrote:
The truth is even though the majority don't go around beheading and blowing people up they ALL hate America. I'll never forget the day after the towers came down they showed footage over in the middle east and thousands of Muslims were dancing, chanting and singing.
Yes, I'm sure they were dancing because of their religion, and not because of one of any of dozens of social, economical, historical, or political reasons people in the middle east might have (justified or unjustified) to be mad at the US.
And I'm sure ALL Muslims everywhere were dancing since they ALL hate America, even the relatives of the Muslim US citizens who were killed when the towers fell.
You have amazing insight in to the collective mindset of 20% of the world population including all the various sects that can't even agree with each other.
yesweshould wrote:
You're right- the problem really isn't the books, it's the cults surrounding those books. Many fewer people have ever actually READ those texts than have hated, hurt, or killed others in the name of them.
Still, the aim of my proposal (like that of the Qur'an burning) is symbolic.
The problem is the ideas in the books that lead people to act like hate filled animals.
As others have mentioned, as far as the bible is concerned, which one? Which version?
Ever read "The Year of Living Biblically"?
All religion is idiot fairy tails designed to control people. Any religion that can both inspire people to peace and cooperation etc., and violence and killing...
Is proof that it is idiocy and insanity.
Fuq, no. Incredibly boring way to spend the day. I'm going for a nice tempo run and then I think I might watch the rest of Inglourious Basterds which I started into the other day. Later, at bed time, I'll tuck back into Michael Chabon's Yiddish Policemen's Union which I'm about half way through and enjoying very much. It is quite probable that I shall never read the frikken Koran in my whole life. The Old and New Testaments were insane and boring and malevolent and contradictory and just plain stupid enough for one life. From what I've read, the Koran rips off those two snorers pretty comprehensively. Hey, howsabout people read The Satanic Verses today instead? Good book, IMNHO.
zero out of ten wrote:
[quote]Yep~ wrote:
Yes, I'm sure they were dancing because of their religion, and not because of one of any of dozens of social, economical, historical, or political reasons people in the middle east might have (justified or unjustified) to be mad at the US.
And I'm sure ALL Muslims everywhere were dancing since they ALL hate America, even the relatives of the Muslim US citizens who were killed when the towers fell.
Truth be told, yes, ALL Muslims hate America, even the relatives of the Muslim US citizens killed on 911. They likely believe the US planned it, like many do, or America deserved it even if their families were killed. And let me take it further. Not only do all Muslims hate America, they hate anyone or anything that isn't Islam. That's their creed, that's their law. Nobody else is worthy, nobody else matters. All that matters to them is Allah, Mohammed, and the quran. And anyone that doesn't fall in line, get on their knees and worship the aforementioned shall be destroyed. Yes that's what they believe. And you know, what an jealous bunch they are. What sexual insecurities they must have to force their women into enslavement, bondage, torture, stoning, not even allow them to wear what they want. Unless it is a full cover outfit which they require. These women aren't even allowed proper education, to work where they want, to live free. Thier religion has major issues. At least other religions have somewhat progressed beyond most of their insecurities, Islam have yet to grow up.
For those that think Islam is so barbaric. Here is a list of things god killed people for in the Bible. Christianity is no better than the rest.
The following list is a list of "crimes" that call for death in the bible. It was taken from another website:
Religious Grounds:
Some passages in the Hebrew Scriptures condemned people to death if they followed a different religious or spiritual path. Quoting from the King James Version of the Bible, Jehovah required the state to execute a person:
for following another religion: Exodus 22:20 states: He that sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the LORD only, he shall be utterly destroyed. See also and Numbers 25:1-15.
for a stranger entering the temple: Numbers 1:51 states (in part): ...when the tabernacle is to be pitched, the Levites shall set it up: and the stranger that cometh nigh shall be put to death. See also Numbers 3:10, 18:7 and 17:13.
for proselytizing: Deuteronomy 13:1-10 states that a person who tries to convince an Israelite to convert to another religion must be killed.
for communicating with the dead: Leviticus 20:27 calls for the execution by stoning of all mediums and spiritists (aka spiritualists), both male and female.
for black magic: Exodus 22:18 states: Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live. This is a mistranslation. The passage has nothing to do with Wicca or other forms of Neo-paganism, which are the only types of Witchcraft that are practiced today in North America in significant numbers . The original Hebrew word is translated "sorceress" in most other versions of the Bible. A more accurate phrase would be "women who engage in black magic, harming others by the use of spoken curses." Men are left off the hook.
Sexual grounds:
Other passages required people to be stoned to death or even burned alive for sexual activities:
for adultery: Leviticus 20:10 states: And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. This is repeated in Deuteronomy 22:22
for incest: Leviticus 20:11 states: And the man that lieth with his father's wife hath uncovered his father's nakedness: both of them shall surely be put to death... See also Leviticus 20, verses 12 and 14. Verse 17 prescribe excommunication for incest with one's sister or step-sister.
for temple prostitution: Leviticus 20:13 states: If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death.... This verse is often incorrectly interpreted to refer generally to homosexual behavior. See also Deuteronomy 22:24. Both verses, in the original Hebrew, refer to homosexual prostitution in Pagan temples, which was a common religious practice in the tribes surrounding the Israelites.
for bestiality: Leviticus 20:15 states: And if a man lie with a beast, he shall surely be put to death: and ye shall slay the beast. And if a woman approach unto any beast, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the woman, and the beast.... See also Exodus 22:19.
for sexual activity before marriage: Deuteronomy 22:13-21 concludes: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die...".. Note that this applied only to women who had been presented as virgin brides and could be proven to have engaged in intercourse before being engaged or married. There appears to have been no penalty for men who engaged in pre-marital sexual activity.
for sexual activity with both a woman and her mother: Deuteronomy 20:14 requires that all three be burned alive.
for being seduced if engaged: Deuteronomy 22:23-24 states: If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die. Note that this applied only to engaged women. Her fiancé could (in some cases) have sexual access to her, but no other man was permitted to engage in such activity as soon as she became engaged. There appears to have been no penalty for engaged men who seduced women.
for rape of an engaged woman: Deuteronomy 22:25 states: But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die. A man who raped a single woman who was not engaged would only have to marry her and give 50 shekels of silver to her father.
for prostitution Leviticus 21:9 states: And the daughter of any priest, if she profane herself by playing the whore, she profaneth her father: she shall be burnt with fire. Executing someone by burning them alive appears to be reserved for a narrow range of criminal acts.
For lying about Church donations: Acts 5:1 to 11 describe how a couple, Ananias and Sapphira sold an piece of real estate. They gave part of the money to the apostles, claiming it was the full proceeds from the sale. Peter interpreted their act as lying to the Holy Ghost. God killed Ananias on the spot. Three hours later, Sapphira repeated the lie to Peter. He cursed her and God killed her immediately. Members of the church were understandably terrified.
(sometimes) for committing murder: Levitucus 24:17 requires that "he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death." Leviticus 24:21 repeats this requirement. See also Numbers 35:16 and Deuteronomy 17:6. The Hebrew word "ratsach" in the Hebrew Scriptures (Old Testament) and the Greek word "phoneuo" in the Christian Scriptures (New Testament) are generally mistranslated into the English word "kill." They actually mean "to murder with premeditation."
However, Exodus 21:20, states that if a slave-owner kills his male or female slave, he shall be merely "punished." The nature of the punishment is not specified. The murderer would presumably not receive the death penalty; if he were to be killed, then one would expect the text to say this directly. However, if the injured slave lives for a while after the beating before dying of the abuse, the owner is not punished at all.
for kidnapping: Exodus 21:16 states: And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. This involves kidnapping for the purpose of selling him into slavery. See also Deuteronomy 24:7.
for human sacrifice: Leviticus 20:2-5 states: Whosoever.... giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death. To "give ones seed to Molech" means to ritually sacrifice one's child to a Pagan God.
for cursing parents: Exodus 21:17 states: And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death. See also Leviticus 20:9. The exact meaning of the key Hebrew word is ambiguous; it might mean, in English, to curse or blaspheme, or to degrade or shame.
for abusing one's parents: Exodus 21:15 states: And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death.
for careless handling of an animal: Exodus 21:29 states: But if the ox .....hath killed a man or a woman; the ox shall be stoned, and his owner also shall be put to death. If an animal has the habit of injuring others, and the owner does not kill it, then the both the owner and the ox may be put to death.
for stubbornness and rebellion: Deuteronomy 21:18-21 states: If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother.....all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die..... Because of the ambiguities in some of the words used in the original text, the death penalty might not have been required in this case.
for blasphemy: Leviticus 24:16 states: And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death. Blasphemy was defined as uttering the name of Jehovah while cursing.
for working on Saturday: Exodus 35:2 states: ...but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a Sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death. Numbers 15:32-36 described a man who was executed because he gathered wood on Saturday.
for ignoring the decision of a priest or judge: Deuteronomy 17:12 states: And the man that will do presumptuously, and will not hearken unto the priest that standeth to minister there before the LORD thy God, or unto the judge, even that man shall die....
for perjury: Deuteronomy 19:15-21 states in part (with reference to a murder trial) ....if the witness be a false witness, and hath testified falsely against his brother; then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother.... That is, a perjurer would himself be killed.
for accidentally killing a pregnant woman: Exodus 21:22-23 states: "If men strive [i.e. fight], and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, Burning for burning, wound for wound, stripe for stripe." If two men are fighting and accidentally hurt a pregnant woman so that she has a miscarriage, then:
if the woman fully recovers, then the man responsible will have to pay a fine to the woman's husband.
if the woman dies, then the man would be killed also.
if some other harm comes to the woman, (e.g. loss of an eye or tooth) then that would be inflicted upon the man as well.
Some Bible translations, supported by conservative Christian denominations, translate miscarriage as "premature birth." And they interpret verse 23 to include death of the newborn. However, this translation is rare.
Still more grounds for execution:
A male who was not circumcised: Genesis 17:14
Eating leavened bread during the Feast of Unleavened Bread: Exodus 12:15
Manufacturing anointing oil: Exodus 30:33
Engaging in ritual animal sacrifices other than at the temple: Leviticus 17:1-9
Consuming blood: Leviticus 17:10. This would include eating rare meat.
Eating peace offerings while ritually unclean: Leviticus 7:20
Waiting too long before consuming sacrifices: Leviticus 19:5-8
Sexual activity with a woman who is menstruating: Leviticus 20:18
Going to the temple in an unclean state: Numbers 19:13
Persons teaching another religion: Deuteronomy 13:1-11
A prophet whose prophecy does not come true: Deuteronomy 18:22
Gluttony and excessive drinking: Deuteronomy 21:20
Activities for which God Imposed the Death Penalty Directly
God killed individuals because they engaged in various transgressions:
for wickedness In Genesis 6, God was disappointed at the wickedness and evil acts of humanity. He sent the flood in Genesis 7:6 which killed every man, woman, child, infant, new-born and animal, except for those who were in Noah's ark. This is as close as humanity has come to a complete genocide. The exact nature of the wickedness is not defined. God also killed Er in Genesis 38:8 for some unknown form of wickedness.
for being abusive to strangers In Genesis 18:20, God had heard that the people of Sodom were wicked and evil. He sent some angels there, who confirmed the stories. In Genesis 19:24, God demolished Sodom and all of its men, women, children, infants, new-born, plants and animals, except for Lot's family. The crime of the people of Sodom has been interpreted by some to be homosexual rape, and by others to be any form of homosexual behavior. But it was clearly lack of hospitality to strangers, as seen in Jesus' comments in Matthew 10:14-15 and Luke 10:7. This is confirmed in Ezekeiel 16:48-50.
for being excessively curious: In Genesis 19:17, the angels told Lot to: ....Escape for thy life; look not behind thee, neither stay thou in all the plain; escape to the mountain.... Lot's wife looked back. God killed her and turned her into a pillar of salt.
for practicing birth control: Onan was required by Jewish law and tradition to marry his brother's widow and have a male child who would be considered the brother's heir. This is called levirate marriage. He didn't want to do this, and so practiced an elementary form of birth control (coitus interruptus). God killed him. This was first interpreted by the Church as punishment for a sexual sin: avoiding pregnancy through the use of a birth control technique. Later, in spite of all evidence to the contrary, the Church said it was masturbation. "Onanism" became a synonym for auto-eroticism. Recent Biblical scholars interpret his crime as refusal to follow Jewish custom and provide an heir.
It's 9 years since 9/11. It's 63 years since Truman's Original Sin, the US invasion of Palestine. As long as the occupation continues, Islam will be planning and carrying out retaliation against US Zionist targets. Obama and Bush are pretty stupid not to have ended their imperialism and Zionist in the Middle east.
Not a Muslim.... wrote:
I'm Catholic, not Muslim, but I can't think of a better response
http://al-quran.info/default.aspx?x=y#&&sura=1&aya=1&trans=en-hilali-khan&show=both,quran-uthmani&ver=2.00Anyone else?
I hope you read the part where it talks about how you earn so many virgins in the afterlife for killing non-believers (like yourself).
I heard Obama's flowery speech today. But actions speak louder than words. Obama funds and arms 10,000,000 Zionist and Crusader militants and civilians in Islamic countries. Obama hates Islam.
hithere wrote:
Not a Muslim.... wrote:I'm Catholic, not Muslim, but I can't think of a better response
http://al-quran.info/default.aspx?x=y#&&sura=1&aya=1&trans=en-hilali-khan&show=both,quran-uthmani&ver=2.00Anyone else?
I hope you read the part where it talks about how you earn so many virgins in the afterlife for killing non-believers (like yourself).
Earn virgins? Further proof of their sexual insecurities. They need virgins because they wouldn't know what to do with a real woman.
Obama hates Islam wrote:
I heard Obama's flowery speech today. But actions speak louder than words. Obama funds and arms 10,000,000 Zionist and Crusader militants and civilians in Islamic countries. Obama hates Islam.
Don't be fooled by the act. To overthow an empire you must sacrifice some for the greater good. Obamas goal is to destroy America. For this to happen it must appear that he supports America. The real plan is to spread America abroad and thin out the strength at home to the point we're vulnerable to attack. The reason other world powers failed in the past is this very reason, speading yourself too thin. While we're fighting wars on 2 fronts others are laying back building up their forces for the right time to strike.
Islamic territories encompass some 1,500,000,000 people. Of that, the US occupies a very small area with 10,000,000 invaders. That's only 2/3rds of 1%. The US can prevent another 9/11 by closing out it's illegal occupation. Hope this helps.
hithere wrote:
Not a Muslim.... wrote:I'm Catholic, not Muslim, but I can't think of a better response
http://al-quran.info/default.aspx?x=y#&&sura=1&aya=1&trans=en-hilali-khan&show=both,quran-uthmani&ver=2.00Anyone else?
I hope you read the part where it talks about how you earn so many virgins in the afterlife for killing non-believers (like yourself).
Guess what! Thanks to this thread, I actually read a bit of the Koran today. Even took the time to look for the section you mentioned. Turns out the reward is promised to the "Muttaqun", which basically means "God-fearing". So the 72 virgins thing has nothing to do with killing infidels unless you want to abstract that from "God-fearing". Which I have no doubt some have done, but you can hardly generalize that to the whole religion.
So I learned something today. Thanks.
Yep~ wrote:
Obama hates Islam wrote:I heard Obama's flowery speech today. But actions speak louder than words. Obama funds and arms 10,000,000 Zionist and Crusader militants and civilians in Islamic countries. Obama hates Islam.
Don't be fooled by the act. To overthow an empire you must sacrifice some for the greater good. Obamas goal is to destroy America. For this to happen it must appear that he supports America. The real plan is to spread America abroad and thin out the strength at home to the point we're vulnerable to attack. The reason other world powers failed in the past is this very reason, speading yourself too thin. While we're fighting wars on 2 fronts others are laying back building up their forces for the right time to strike.
By this same line of thought G.W. Bush was trying to destroy America before entering us in the two wars that Obama inherited. The assertion Obama is trying to destroy America is ludicrous. And if you noticed, we are drawing down troops in Iraq and sending a lot of troops home or to Afghanistan. The notion that Obama is spreading us too thin is not factual. We are also drawing down troops in Afghanistan next year. There's no conspiracy going on at all.
Obama has abandoned the left wing of the Democratic Party by not ending Bush's Holy Christian Crusades Against Islam. In a few months the GOP will take control of the House and Senate. Unless Obama immediately ends the war in the Middle East and frees the 8,000,000 Palestinians held in concentration camps, the left will not help Obama in 2012.